What don't people understand about "Separation of Church and State"?

[KryptoBud]

They don't deny homosexuals the ability to come in and buy off the shelf items. They simply decline special commissions to do gay events. That's different from

Not really, but if that's their choice they should have that right. I think its discrimination covered up with "religious belief" I think they should have to let it be known what is not acceptable to them. Like when you walk into a bar or night club they have signs under 21 not permitted. So let them acknowledge what their god isn't down with the fags/dikes and let their customers decide if that's a business they want to support. I don't think there would be a whole lotta signs made, I don't think they'd be in business long.

 

[ThickStemz]

Not really, but if that's their choice they should have that right. I think its discrimination covered up with "religious belief" I think they should have to let it be known what is not acceptable to them. Like when you walk into a bar or night club they have signs under 21 not permitted. So let them acknowledge what their god isn't down with the fags/dikes and let their customers decide if that's a business they want to support. I don't think there would be a whole lotta signs made, I don't think they'd be in business long.

Should we make the jews wear yellow stars too?

When it comes to off site catering I'm in favor of granting wide leeway.

If it's an in store item commonly in stock then no discrimination.

But if you have to be part of the event then it should be at will. Any reason or no reason at all.

 

[UncleBuck]

But if you have to be part of the event then it should be at will. Any reason or no reason at all.

you are completely fabricating that part.

 

[ThickStemz]

you are completely fabricating that part.

It's a goddamn hypothetical you moron.

 

[UncleBuck]

It's a goddamn hypothetical you moron.

nope.

you can try to revise history, and lie, and spin and chase your tail, but here is what you said:

I saw something on the news recently about a bakery owner in Oregon who was fined over $100k and thereby forced our of business. The reason...

They had regular customers who were a lesbian couple. They came in often and bought baked goods.

The lesbian couple decided to get married. Becuase they liked the people at the bakery and their products they came to them for the wedding cake.

The bakers refused the job becuase they're christians. On a personal level I think this is stupid.

However, they never denied the lesbian couple products that were put up for sale.

They only refused to participate in a ceramony they didn't find acceptable becuase of their religious beliefs.

you did not pose this as a hypothetical, as you can see.

you are simply a bad liar.

 

[ThickStemz]

That is from days ago and in a completely different conversation.

I was talking to two different people.

And even in that case there was enough personal involvement where it still wouldn't be fabrication.

Idk anyone who picks up their own wedding cake. It is usually aranged to be delivered, sliced and served.

 

[UncleBuck]

That is from days ago and in a completely different conversation.

I was talking to two different people.

And even in that case there was enough personal involvement where it still wouldn't be fabrication.

Idk anyone who picks up their own wedding cake. It is usually aranged to be delivered, sliced and served.

sorry you git caught lying.

the underlines are a nice touch though.

 

[ThickStemz]

sorry you git caught lying.

the underlines are a nice touch though.

Accidentally hit underline.

If you've noticed I don't speak to you often. It's nothing to do with our disagreementon most issues.

At least pada and Fogdog can have a good faith conversation. Grow up man. You're the least mature human I've met in a long time.

 

[ttystikk]

I live in Utah....you dont know how important the separation of church and state is until you live here.

LDS kids get time off school each and every day from middle school on to attend LDS "Seminary". There are seminaries attached to every public school...middle schools, High Schools and Colleges. There is nothing similar offered to students of any other belief system.

When measures are considered in our legislature (and even at the county and city levels in many cases) those measures will not pass unless the "church" (LDS) approves of or is indifferent. This last month our medical marijuana bill was doomed as soon as the LDS church came out against it. It was changed, based solely on the churches opposition to it.

When applying for a job at the local PUBLIC college, I was asked "What ward do you belong to?" (ie, wards are the local level congregations). When I complained, I was told "They only asked to be friendly"

I can tell you right now that whoever is the next republican candidate, will recieve the electoral votes for Utah. It does not matter who it is, they will win Utah, because the church votes as a block the straight republican ticket here.

I used to live in Grand Junction. I could feel their repressive influence everywhere.

It isn't okay just because it's 'our' religion. The Constitution applies to everyone equally and must be enforced everywhere, equally.

Carving out exceptions for special interests has gotten this country INTO the mess we're in, exactly because we've abandoned any semblance of fair or level playing fields.

 

[KryptoBud]

Should we make the jews wear yellow stars too?

When it comes to off site catering I'm in favor of granting wide leeway.

If it's an in store item commonly in stock then no discrimination.

But if you have to be part of the event then it should be at will. Any reason or no reason at all.

I still think its discrimination, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Personally I don't know why people get married anyway. What purpose does it serve? If anyone has any logical reasons please share them. Its a religious ceremony. that you must have before you can have sex. Religious people must be horny as fuck. They cant wait to get married, and where do 90% of weddings take place.... Pretty good business plan for the church and its tax free. That's my theory albeit a little far fetched, But we are talking about religion after all.
People that think theres a separation of church and state are delusional. all you have to do is look at some of laws in this country. Gay marriage, recreational drugs, abortion, prostitution, doctor assisted suicide just to name a few. Why do we have laws that tell consenting adults that aren't hurting anybody what they can and cant do to their body?
I think religion is a cancer the earth would be a better place without. Also don't forget in god we trust on every dollar you've ever spent.

 

[ThickStemz]

I still think its discrimination, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Personally I don't know why people get married anyway. What purpose does it serve? If anyone has any logical reasons please share them. Its a religious ceremony. that you must have before you can have sex. Religious people must be horny as fuck. They cant wait to get married, and where do 90% of weddings take place.... Pretty good business plan for the church and its tax free. That's my theory albeit a little far fetched, But we are talking about religion after all.
People that think theres a separation of church and state are delusional. all you have to do is look at some of laws in this country. Gay marriage, recreational drugs, abortion, prostitution, doctor assisted suicide just to name a few. Why do we have laws that tell consenting adults that aren't hurting anybody what they can and cant do to their body?
I think religion is a cancer the earth would be a better place without. Also don't forget in god we trust on every dollar you've ever spent.

Separation of church and state means something different to most people than the constitution seems to mean. Firsrly, it isn't expressly stated that they should be separate in the constitution beyond saying congrease should make no law regarding an establishment of religion.

This was to prevent a government funded church. An official one.

But it doesn't seem to limit the people of a church influencing a government with what secular laws we pass.

 

[Heisenberg]

thickstemz made the whole fucking thing up to suit his false narrative.

he's a sock puppet here on a mission to spread bigotry, racism, white supremacy and whatever other shit he can.

facts are not important to him.

Wow Buck, this is what you give us? Conspiracy, cynicism, ad hominems? After all these years of arguing on here I would have expected you to get better at it, not worse. There are many nuances to this issue and many juicy bits you could have ripped apart from this particular argument, yet you reach for the typical go-to arguments we see from the likes of anti-vaxxers and Food Babe?

I was never fond of your particular argument style, despite agreeing with you on nearly every issue, but I think different styles are necessary to get across points to a diverse audience. There needs to be an asshole telling it like it is. But if this post is any indication, you seem to have gotten lazy and unimaginative.

 

[Skittles McP]

I still think its discrimination, but everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Personally I don't know why people get married anyway. What purpose does it serve? If anyone has any logical reasons please share them. Its a religious ceremony. that you must have before you can have sex. Religious people must be horny as fuck. They cant wait to get married, and where do 90% of weddings take place.... Pretty good business plan for the church and its tax free. That's my theory albeit a little far fetched, But we are talking about religion after all.
People that think theres a separation of church and state are delusional. all you have to do is look at some of laws in this country. Gay marriage, recreational drugs, abortion, prostitution, doctor assisted suicide just to name a few. Why do we have laws that tell consenting adults that aren't hurting anybody what they can and cant do to their body?
I think religion is a cancer the earth would be a better place without. Also don't forget in god we trust on every dollar you've ever spent.

Marriage wasn't invented by religion. It served a civil purpose throughout history and only gained traction as the modern "Religious ceremony" when the Catholic church got involved. Marriage isn't inherently a religious ceremony.

 

[Olive Drab Green]

Hail, Satan.

 

[ky man]

Well the bible says GOD made adam and eva (I know that's not spelled rite) but if we where made to screw the same sex GOD would have said adam and steve.JMO But I don't see how 2 men or 2 ladys could show there face in publick with out shame and I also belive that THE GAYs ARE GOING STRAIT TO HELL AT THE END OF TIME.jmo and that's how I was raised.and I will go to my grave beliving that.If every one was gay there would be no new kids born and man would just die out.Gays jmo are sick people in the head.TELL ME Why would 2 men wount shit on there dicks??Iam dun with this sick post..ky

 

[ky man]

Not really, but if that's their choice they should have that right. I think its discrimination covered up with "religious belief" I think they should have to let it be known what is not acceptable to them. Like when you walk into a bar or night club they have signs under 21 not permitted. So let them acknowledge what their god isn't down with the fags/dikes and let their customers decide if that's a business they want to support. I don't think there would be a whole lotta signs made, I don't think they'd be in business long.

There is more strait people in this world then there is fags_dikes..............Guess witch ones meaning all of them are going strait to hell at the end of time.You said I don't think theyd be in business long...That's where you are wrong I think onley 3 percent of people or less are fags and dikes in this world...jmo...ky

 

[mean.green]

Well the bible says GOD made adam and eva (I know that's not spelled rite) but if we where made to screw the same sex GOD would have said adam and steve.JMO But I don't see how 2 men or 2 ladys could show there face in publick with out shame and I also belive that THE GAYs ARE GOING STRAIT TO HELL AT THE END OF TIME.jmo and that's how I was raised.and I will go to my grave beliving that.If every one was gay there would be no new kids born and man would just die out.Gays jmo are sick people in the head.TELL ME Why would 2 men wount shit on there dicks??Iam dun with this sick post..ky

We live in a world where we are running out of resources because our world is massively populated. It would take a lot more than 3% of gay people to make a dent in the population... besides gay people can adopt children that would otherwise sit in homeless shelters.

Everything in this world has a purpose...

Also we have a separation of church and state for a reason. People cannot push their morals or beliefs on someone else. Just because you believe they are going to hell, doesn't mean that being gay is wrong. Gay people have a purpose: adopting children and reducing the over-population. Straight people, however, continue to hurt the earth by increasing the population. Maybe we could use some more gays....

IF god said that being gay is wrong, that was in another time (sodom and gomorrah).
Since then a lot has changed.

Marriage before god is another issue that I don't care to discuss. Personally, I think it should be up to the religious official who does the marriage. There will always be the few hardcore believers who see gay's as blasphemous. Just find a minister willing to marry gays. But I think churches should be treated like businesses, they should not be able to refuse service to anyone (my opinion).

I don't normally contribute to discussing beliefs in a public matter, however I feel that KY Man was a little harsh due his own ignorance. I just wanted to contribute my 2 cents.... If you disagree with me then its no big deal!!

 

[Skittles McP]

Well the bible says GOD made adam and eva (I know that's not spelled rite) but if we where made to screw the same sex GOD would have said adam and steve.JMO But I don't see how 2 men or 2 ladys could show there face in publick with out shame and I also belive that THE GAYs ARE GOING STRAIT TO HELL AT THE END OF TIME.jmo and that's how I was raised.and I will go to my grave beliving that.If every one was gay there would be no new kids born and man would just die out.Gays jmo are sick people in the head.TELL ME Why would 2 men wount shit on there dicks??Iam dun with this sick post..ky

Ky I think the problem you're having is that you think everyone is held to the same standard you hold yourself too. First off, not everyone is Christian. So why should the rest of the world who doesn't follow Christianity, all 6 billion of them, have to follow the rules of a religion they don't believe in? You are trying to enforce your own ideals and beliefs on others. Christianity doesn't get to decide everyone's lives for them. Religion isn't the law, it's a religion...

 

[UncleBuck]

Well the bible says GOD made adam and eva (I know that's not spelled rite) but if we where made to screw the same sex GOD would have said adam and steve.JMO But I don't see how 2 men or 2 ladys could show there face in publick with out shame and I also belive that THE GAYs ARE GOING STRAIT TO HELL AT THE END OF TIME.jmo and that's how I was raised.and I will go to my grave beliving that.If every one was gay there would be no new kids born and man would just die out.Gays jmo are sick people in the head.TELL ME Why would 2 men wount shit on there dicks??Iam dun with this sick post..ky

ya gotta blame straight people for this shit. if they didn't have any kids, there would be no gay people.

 

[Heisenberg]

TELL ME Why would 2 men wount shit on there dicks??Iam dun with this sick post..ky

You could ask straight men the same thing, as many enjoy anal sex. Women have buttholes too.

And just an FYI, saying "that's how I was raised" is not a defense for any idea. It merely tells us that your parents were as bigoted as you. It says that not only do you have terrible ideas, but that they are not even something you came up with yourself. You were told what to think, which doesn't really help your case.