6 Weeks Into Flower ... What's Wrong???

JohnDee · Jul 10, 2019

jondamon said:
Buffering coco imo is only required when using an inferior coco product or compressed coco bricks.

Not inferior...it's just marketing. If you have the money and have access to a good hydro store...sure buy Canna. But if you live in the boonies...bricks are cheaper to ship and it's not that hard to do the buffering yourself. But no...it's not inferior.

jondamon said:
My post wasn’t intended to bash your advice if that’s how it was taken?

Sheesh Jondamon...I complimented your post...yes I was happy to see it because GG wasn't getting it.

guitarguy10 said:
I would never flush plants midgrow with plain water, come on!

GG...hard to know how good a coco grower you are so I just wanted to make sure. You sure have fallen for the Canna playbook. Maybe someday you'll learn there are other options.
JD

JohnDee · Jul 10, 2019

GG,
The comment that you were "flushing too much" troubles me. I've been reading about different approaches to watering coco, since I'm setting up an auto irrigation system for my coco pots.

The actual style of watering seems to make a difference. The suggestion is to water slowly...making sure that all the coco is getting saturated. The problem that can occur with incomplete watering (some dry areas) is accumulation of nutrient salts.

So if you are just dumping the water to top of coco...maybe that's contributing to your toxic salt issue. Well that plus overfeeding. :cool:

JD

guitarguy10 · Jul 10, 2019

JohnDee said:
Not inferior...it's just marketing. If you have the money and have access to a good hydro store...sure buy Canna. But if you live in the boonies...bricks are cheaper to ship and it's not that hard to do the buffering yourself. But no...it's not inferior.

Sheesh Jondamon...I complimented your post...yes I was happy to see it because GG wasn't getting it.

GG...hard to know how good a coco grower you are so I just wanted to make sure. You sure have fallen for the Canna playbook. Maybe someday you'll learn there are other options.
JD

Wasn't getting what? I've listened to everything that has been suggested, I have flushed them now with about 4L excess runoff each plant. What 'don't I get?

I'm not a pro coco grower or anything but I'm not new either. I've had 2 or 3 successful coco grows before and I'm using Cannas products because I had a bunch left over from last grow, I have always had success with no hiccups (until now) using Cannas line-up so why change? I am using boost only cuz it was part of a package deal when I was buying nutes. Normally wouldn't invest that much money on some nutrient.

I don't buy bags of prebuffered coco that's way too expensive. Instead you can buy bricks of coco from Canna that come prebuffered, u just need to reconstitute them. A brick that makes 40L cost $20 free shipping (to Canada from EU).

Why would I try 'other options when their nutrients work great and are reasonably priced? Nutrient lineup ain't broke so I ain't gonna fix it.

JohnDee · Jul 10, 2019

GG,
I made that comment to Jondamon refering to my initial post...I think you now realize what was fucking with your plants.

The "other option" could be not necessarily a different brand...but a different approach. You don't have to believe everything that thay say...much of which was probably proofread by lawyers.

Just seems like an open mind and a creative approach is better then following some manufacturers script.
JD

jondamon · Jul 10, 2019

guitarguy10 said:
Wasn't getting what? I've listened to everything that has been suggested, I have flushed them now with about 4L excess runoff each plant. What 'don't I get?

I'm not a pro coco grower or anything but I'm not new either. I've had 2 or 3 successful coco grows before and I'm using Cannas products because I had a bunch left over from last grow, I have always had success with no hiccups (until now) using Cannas line-up so why change? I am using boost only cuz it was part of a package deal when I was buying nutes. Normally wouldn't invest that much money on some nutrient.

I don't buy bags of prebuffered coco that's way too expensive. Instead you can buy bricks of coco from Canna that come prebuffered, u just need to reconstitute them. A brick that makes 40L cost $20 free shipping (to Canada from EU).

Why would I try 'other options when their nutrients work great and are reasonably priced? Nutrient lineup ain't broke so I ain't gonna fix it.

When I used canna you could go on their website and use their nutrient calculator to tailor a feed schedule for you.

Mine used to max out at 1.6EC when I was running with them. I think it was the light feeding schedule.

jondamon · Jul 10, 2019

JohnDee said:
Not inferior...it's just marketing. If you have the money and have access to a good hydro store...sure buy Canna. But if you live in the boonies...bricks are cheaper to ship and it's not that hard to do the buffering yourself. But no...it's not inferior.

Sheesh Jondamon...I complimented your post...yes I was happy to see it because GG wasn't getting it.

GG...hard to know how good a coco grower you are so I just wanted to make sure. You sure have fallen for the Canna playbook. Maybe someday you'll learn there are other options.
JD

Lol no worries buddy. Just wasn’t sure the “flush” comment had been taken the wrong way or not.

No harm no foul broski.

guitarguy10 · Jul 10, 2019

jondamon said:
When I used canna you could go on their website and use their nutrient calculator to tailor a feed schedule for you.

Mine used to max out at 1.6EC when I was running with them. I think it was the lift feeding schedule.

I posted a picture of the feed schedule (from their calculator) on the first page ... attached here too now.

I never said I was following everything canna says, I am just following their nutrient feeding schedule (and changing it as necessary). I contacted them for their advice, on flushing and on other things. I don't necessarily follow it, I just read their advice because they always reply with highly informative and bountiful information. No lawyers I don't think because their answers to my questions are often highly technical and have always had some value.

I keep a log book that i write down everything I feed them or see or whatever to learn from what changes to make on my next grow. I don't just follow some companies advice, I follow my own advice, the advice of any company that wants to give it and the advice of any RIU forum member that wants to give it.

So thank you all for your advice.

Oh and I personally have always strongly disagreed with the idea of flushing your plants mid grow (in coco), so that is why I agree with Cannas opinion, I didn't need theirs to tell you I think flushing mid-grow is silly.

jondamon · Jul 10, 2019

guitarguy10 said:
I posted a picture of the feed schedule (from their calculator) on the first page ... attached here too now.

I never said I was following everything canna says, I am just following their nutrient feeding schedule (and changing it as necessary). I contacted them for their advice, on flushing and on other things. I don't necessarily follow it, I just read their advice because they always reply with highly informative and bountiful information. No lawyers I don't think because their answers to my questions are often highly technical and have always had some value.

I keep a log book that i write down everything I feed them or see or whatever to learn from what changes to make on my next grow. I don't just follow some companies advice, I follow my own advice, the advice of any company that wants to give it and the advice of any RIU forum member that wants to give it.

So thank you all for your advice.

Oh and I personally have always strongly disagreed with the idea of flushing your plants mid grow (in coco), so that is why I agree with Cannas opinion, I didn't need theirs to tell you I think flushing mid-grow is silly.

To me that’s rather high on EC.

My source water is 0.2EC.

here’s roughly what I used to use as a guideline.

Source water included in EC value.

veg
0.8-1.2EC

Flower
1.2-1.6EC

I used to taper down to about 0.8EC for the last 2-3 weeks of flower.

ZYM rhizotonic I used at recommended levels as per schedule.

So based by the fact my source water was already 0.2 each of the EC values was inclusive of my source water EC.

Edit.... and also don’t forget that their feed chart assumes 20% runoff each time you water.

DocofRock · Jul 10, 2019

I agree with nute burn. I pushed 1030 ppm once on two month old plants, burned the shit out of them. I immediately backed off and now, I usually only max out around 850 ppm (1.9 EC), and I mean MAX. I usually aim for around 720 in flower, with a week or two higher due to increased P/K. Anyway, just looking at the leaves I’d say nute burn.

DocofRock · Jul 10, 2019

guitarguy10 said:
Fed them pH 5.8, 1.8EC A/B/Zym/Boost/Rhizo/CalMag to about 20L runoff (each plant drinks about 3-4L every feeding, I have 4 plants).

The pH of runoff has come up closer to acceptable (from 3.8 to 5.0), I will make sure it goes up a bit more on next feeding. I will also be giving them EC 1.6 next feeding (and thereafter), just want to go down in steps gradual 2.2 to 1.8 to 1.6 vs. straight from 2.2 to 1.6. If I remember correctly EC of runoff has always been crazy high which is why I don't check runoff from my canna buffered coco, it's always been off the meter or close to that.

That was exhausting, I need a better method next grow, hope this does it cuz dunno if I have it in me to do more of this right now.

IMO, runoff ppm/pH DOES provide useful information about what’s going on in the root zone. I think you can use the two together to determine nutrient needs (or excess). I know people say that runoff doesn’t matter, but you should never have runoff pH as low as 3.8 - that’s an issue. Yeah, it may be insignificant to measure runoff when you’re dialed in with your feeding regimen, as the pH will naturally have some swings. That said, at least in my opinion, those swings should only oscillate between the minimum and maximum desired pH values for growing cannabis in your chosen medium. In the case of coco, I’d say a low of 5.5 and a high of 6.5.

6 Weeks Into Flower ... What's Wrong???

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