Coco roots…again ffs

Growing in pure canna coco coir. always noticed my veg time was slow compare to my mates. He would come over and see my plants n tell me to water them. Doing so mine would go over watered. I was needing mine to be bone dry basically as was packing down the coco to much. He gave me some well rooted clones and I potted them into the finals. Didn’t compact the coco and started watering sooner and they grew faster than any plants I’ve ever had in the past.

so I thought that was my issues sorted. Started some seeds. Watered daily from the start till run off. Noticed I had poor roots though, I even lost one plant due to over watering. Turns out you can over water coco if the roots aren’t there. also the coco seemed to lose its airyness/fluffyness and wasn’t sure if that was down to me flooding the coco even when it was still wet.

Popped some freebies to try get it right and I shoved them under a cfl just to save on the electric. Watered and as under such a weak light the pots stayed wet for longer. Noticed I had way better roots. So I potted up into 2 litre pots and kept them under a cfl and roots was looking like this.

once they needed a second watering I decided to put them under a 400w hps. Few days later I got roots looking like this. Different plant possibly but you get the idea…



Would love to know what I am doing wrong? The roots see, less thick and white. I’m not letting the pots go bone dry but makes me wonder am I still letting them get too light?
I know people say water coco every day but think I was put off from that when I over watered previous plants with doing that from the start. I’m also maybe being over paranoid here. But I’m wondering has me taking the plant out the pot. Then dumping it back in while still wet and heavy.actually pressed the coco down as it does seem to have lost some of its airyness to it.

I am putting all these plants into a Wilma system as always had good roots with that and can’t afford to fuck up another crop. Just be good to know if people think judging by how the roots have changed in appearance has it come from letting the coco get too dry? Certainly can’t be over watering so it’s kinda all I’m left to think as the cause.

Are you feeding or just watering

Any perlite added?

Coco can be hard for people new to it during the seedling stage, but even if you aren't getting optimal results, the plants usually snap out of it once they fill out their pot with roots. What are your temperatures like? You need to keep them nice and warm to get a good wet/dry cycle going early on. Some people have great results feeding to runoff from day one. I feed my seedlings to runoff ever other day when they are in solo cups, just to get a slight wet/dry cycle going. Once the roots fill out a container, then I feed to runoff every day. What EC are you feeding them at this stage? You need to feed every time you "water" from day one in coco.

bam0813 said:

Any perlite added?

Click to expand...

Perlite definitely isn't needed.

OP, the plants shown with roots are big enough that they should be fed daily in the container they were pulled out of.

Edit: Also if the pictures of the roots were the containers you started in the I'd suggest something smaller.

Cheers guys.

I started off in smaller pots. Was in 500ml pots under the cfl. Had decent roots and potted into these 2litre pots. Watered until run off and left. had no fan running as the cfl doesn’t get hot enough where the tents at. When the plants needed a second watering I switched on the hps and fan. Then as you can see from the second photo the roots look less happy. I feed every watering too by the way.

The roots under the cfl was staying wet for longer as the weak cfl took longer to dry out. I haven’t been watering daily under the hps. Which leads me to believe the reason the roots look less happy is due to the pots being left to go too light. They haven’t gone bone dry but should be watered more regular.
I think the reason for me holding back on watering so often is because last time I watered daily till run off from day1 of the seed and ended up with poor roots. I know some people say to do that but I saw better roots with what I done this time round by far. Think it’s just knocked my confidence of watering sooner.

This coco now feels more compact than it should be. Probably where I tapped the pot on the floor when I put the wet coco back in the pot. Not solid but deffo lost some fluffiness. So I’m gonna pot everything up and use the Wilma system drippers. I’ll switch to hand watering once they’ve fully rooted the pot. Just find the drippers always gives good roots.

I am gonna pot one plant up from the 2litre into 3 litres. Just for my own sake of wanting to get this issue sorted. Gonna make sure the coco is nice and fluffy. then water again when the pot is heavier than what I would usually water it. If it can’t be over watering the only alternative is under watering.

Will see how that goes. would it be worth posting that plant here so can sort of keep a diary for it?

Imo I’d post it up in the grow logs to follow the grow through

bam0813 said:

Imo I’d post it up in the grow logs to follow the grow through

Click to expand...

Should I post it here or like start a diary?

Ended up killing the lot. Pissed off looking at them, they looked behind and shit for their age. Everything was sweet till I whacked on the hps. Will clean the tent tomorrow n then decide what my next move is.

ninja1 said:

Ended up killing the lot. Pissed off looking at them, they looked behind and shit for their age. Everything was sweet till I whacked on the hps. Will clean the tent tomorrow n then decide what my next move is.

Click to expand...

Seems a bit excessive, but to each their own. Their size/age relationship doesn't matter unless they were autos. If they were photos you just get them back to the health you want them and continue to grow.

twentyeight.threefive said:

Seems a bit excessive, but to each their own. Their size/age relationship doesn't matter unless they were autos. If they were photos you just get them back to the health you want them and continue to grow.

Click to expand...

I just knew something had gone wrong mate. Pissed off with fucking up so much.

Gonna pop some freebie seeds today. This time I’m gonna do things a little different. Have the coco more “fluffy“. Also when I switch on the hps I’m gonna water the plants more sooner. Even though I never had a single plant go droopy and look under watered. Also felt like some moisture was still in the coco but yeah that’s what I’ll be doing.
These plants and their roots looked worse from the moment I decided to introduce the hps IMO.

Would be handy to get my mate to pop over as his always got the plants vegging super fast without any issues. He ain’t driving at the moment though. Might have to resort to begging him tbh lol.

ninja1 said:

I just knew something had gone wrong mate. Pissed off with fucking up so much.

Gonna pop some freebie seeds today. This time I’m gonna do things a little different. Have the coco more “fluffy“. Also when I switch on the hps I’m gonna water the plants more sooner. Even though I never had a single plant go droopy and look under watered. Also felt like some moisture was still in the coco but yeah that’s what I’ll be doing.
These plants and their roots looked worse from the moment I decided to introduce the hps IMO.

Would be handy to get my mate to pop over as his always got the plants vegging super fast without any issues. He ain’t driving at the moment though. Might have to resort to begging him tbh lol.

Click to expand...

The HPS light might be a bit more powerful than the LED. More than likely they were light stressed and needed a period to adjust to them.

Edit: Definitely was getting much more light after you fired up the HPS as you only had them under CFLs before, not LED!

Good point . I don’t use hps but was wondering the opposite, was the bulb spent.

The coir will start to hold its shape and get harder as time goes on, that’s normal.

Next grow I’m gonna be using a laser pointer thing to check the temps of everything. Although is the same set up I’ve always had and when it goes fine I normally yield decent. I’m gonna have a few seeds and water one sooner than I usually would. Plus let one get as light as I usually would.

Can only ever be under or over watering right? It’s just confusing me how they seem fine when under cfl and the roots are growing with any issues.
Switching to hps increases heat and then the fan is turned on as well. So that makes me think it’s most likely not watering soon enough. That said I still don’t feel the pots was ever bone dry.
Anyway that’s what I plan on doing with 2 of the next lot of seeds and see how it does. the others I ain’t even decided on how I’m gonna treat them.

ninja1 said:

Next grow I’m gonna be using a laser pointer thing to check the temps of everything. Although is the same set up I’ve always had and when it goes fine I normally yield decent. I’m gonna have a few seeds and water one sooner than I usually would. Plus let one get as light as I usually would.

Can only ever be under or over watering right? It’s just confusing me how they seem fine when under cfl and the roots are growing with any issues.
Switching to hps increases heat and then the fan is turned on as well. So that makes me think it’s most likely not watering soon enough. That said I still don’t feel the pots was ever bone dry.
Anyway that’s what I plan on doing with 2 of the next lot of seeds and see how it does. the others I ain’t even decided on how I’m gonna treat them.

Click to expand...

You also didn't share any pictures of your issues. If your only problem is what the roots look like then that isn't an issue, every plant is going to be different.

Once the roots are established like in those pictures FEED your coco at least daily. And stop pulling your plants out of the pots.

Going from CFL to HPS is going to shock the plants. Give them a week or so to recover, it's a LOT more light.

twentyeight.threefive said:

You also didn't share any pictures of your issues. If your only problem is what the roots look like then that isn't an issue, every plant is going to be different.

Once the roots are established like in those pictures FEED your coco at least daily. And stop pulling your plants out of the pots.

Going from CFL to HPS is going to shock the plants. Give them a week or so to recover, it's a LOT more light.

Click to expand...

The roots on every plant started to look worse. They all went from being white and thick looking. To more thin and overall just unhappy. The plants themselves I have to admit also started to look a little unhappy too…


I had a similar issue last time. With me using hps from the start. I thought maybe the hps dried the coco too soon.When they was in the small pots, as I noticed I had poor roots. So that’s why I tried the cfl to start them next time and yeah I had better roots for it. The difference is the coco stays wet longer when under cfl. So that’s gotta be pointing towards under watering right?

The next seeds I’m gonna start them under 250w cfl. I might just plant the jiffy’s into 1litre pots. Rather than using 500ml pots and potting up into 2 litres. Try and get the 1 litre pots really wrapped with roots like I’ve seen others achieve.

switch the hps on at 250w after their second watering and from there see how they do. Like I say I’ll water one a little sooner than I usually would. Water another when the pot feels what I consider light. And 3rd I might just bang in another tent and keep that under the cfl. Just to see then what ends up with the best roots while I’m waiting on some clones to come.

Considering paying my mate to get a taxi to me so he can come show me when he’d water. He always had had fast and better veg times and plants look huge compare to mine even if we start off at the same time. I thought when I saw he wasn’t packing the coco down like I was that it’ll be me sorted.


Edited to add I’m also gonna check the humidity. I’ve got the temp and humidity reader but don’t check it as kinda got a feel for when it’s too hot plus I use an sms controller for the fan with a probe to adjust everything to the right temps. Laser pointer aimed at the pots as well but tbh they can’t be too hot as I didn’t have the hps sat super close or anything.

ninja1 said:

The roots on every plant started to look worse. They all went from being white and thick looking. To more thin and overall just unhappy. The plants themselves I have to admit also started to look a little unhappy too…View attachment 5056666


I had a similar issue last time. With me using hps from the start. I thought maybe the hps dried the coco too soon.When they was in the small pots, as I noticed I had poor roots. So that’s why I tried the cfl to start them next time and yeah I had better roots for it. The difference is the coco stays wet longer when under cfl. So that’s gotta be pointing towards under watering right?

The next seeds I’m gonna start them under 250w cfl. I might just plant the jiffy’s into 1litre pots. Rather than using 500ml pots and potting up into 2 litres. Try and get the 1 litre pots really wrapped with roots like I’ve seen others achieve.

switch the hps on at 250w after their second watering and from there see how they do. Like I say I’ll water one a little sooner than I usually would. Water another when the pot feels what I consider light. And 3rd I might just bang in another tent and keep that under the cfl. Just to see then what ends up with the best roots while I’m waiting on some clones to come.

Considering paying my mate to get a taxi to me so he can come show me when he’d water. He always had had fast and better veg times and plants look huge compare to mine even if we start off at the same time. I thought when I saw he wasn’t packing the coco down like I was that it’ll be me sorted.


Edited to add I’m also gonna check the humidity. I’ve got the temp and humidity reader but don’t check it as kinda got a feel for when it’s too hot plus I use an sms controller for the fan with a probe to adjust everything to the right temps. Laser pointer aimed at the pots as well but tbh they can’t be too hot as I didn’t have the hps sat super close or anything.

Click to expand...

I don't see an issue with that plant. Like I said stop pulling it out of the pot to look at the roots it's stressing the plant out.

The plant shown above is large enough for that pot that it needs to be fed to runoff every single day. Coco is supposed to stay wet. If you aren't feeding that plant daily then that's your problem. No need to pay for a taxi for your buddy to come over.

Did someone call for a taxi?

ninja1 said:

I just knew something had gone wrong mate. Pissed off with fucking up so much.

Gonna pop some freebie seeds today. This time I’m gonna do things a little different. Have the coco more “fluffy“. Also when I switch on the hps I’m gonna water the plants more sooner. Even though I never had a single plant go droopy and look under watered. Also felt like some moisture was still in the coco but yeah that’s what I’ll be doing.
These plants and their roots looked worse from the moment I decided to introduce the hps IMO.

Would be handy to get my mate to pop over as his always got the plants vegging super fast without any issues. He ain’t driving at the moment though. Might have to resort to begging him tbh lol.

Click to expand...

You need to harden them off when going to more powerful lights. Basically let them slowly adjust to more and more light.