Is it me or do only a select few only truly understand soil and water pH!!!!

Jack Harer

Well-Known Member
So i see a lot of people defy the myth of pH'ing their feed and water, ill agree with the guy who posted before and said knowing your starting water pH is usefull but there were no such things as pH meters all those years ago.

Seriously are we overcomplicating things or getting mixed up with hydro where a plant actually grows in water which hence would be its growing medium and important to keep the right pH? Soil is my growing medium and it holds its pH well with the added dolomite lime, are people suggesting that if i dont add water i will very quickly change the pH of my soil with all that added lime? Peace

These forums are FULL of people trying to over-engineer this. No wonder newbies get screwed up!!! I consider Hydroponics an advanced growing technique, and thus a newbie has absolutely no business doing it. pH is frigging crucial there, and its a tightrope walk. Newbies need to keep it simple.
Soil is so much more forgiving, and organics are even more so. I have a pen, and I do monitor he run-off pH on occasion, but I aint anal if it drifts a bit here and there.
 

eDude

Well-Known Member
Yeah, the videos were just for the curious.

What's neat is that you can also tweak your pH to control your nutes. Not something I bother to do. We've all heard of Advanced Nutriends Bud Blood.. We'll that, as most everthing they do, is a knock off of sorts of blossom blood.
Blossom-Blood has earned the reputation as a premium floral product. The
addition of Blossom-Blood to a nutrient reservoir during the flowering stage of
a plant will promote fuller buds and flowers, utilizing selective pH control.
Developed for pH stabilization and floral production in hydroponic applications,
Blossom-Blood may also be used in soilless growing mediums. Blossom-Blood is a
specific type of pH buffer salt. It is not a plant food. It is compatible with
all quality nutrients and soilless growing media.
I think it locks your pH in a range that the P is better absorbed and that get's you a better flower responce. Advanced just threw some npk in there with it and called it their own.

Exellent summery Kingrow1!
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
I hear you dude right on.

Dont hate me for trolling the science as i simply do lots of research in order to keep it simple, i hate over complicating things but find quite often i have to to get to the simple parts.

I'll go on to say from my last post that the more acidic your feed and nute solutions are the quicker you will neutralise the lime and alkaline elements held within your soil, maybe even leaving you deficient in certain minerals such as calcium and strontium as you just neutralised them and made them useless.

Can we all chime in on my findings and interpretations of soil and water pH please, i find this to be the answer to the question i posed.

Ask not wether your water will raise or lower the pH of your soil but ask wether your soil will neutralise the acidity of your water!!! Peace and i love to learn.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
These forums are FULL of people trying to over-engineer this. No wonder newbies get screwed up!!! I consider Hydroponics an advanced growing technique, and thus a newbie has absolutely no business doing it. pH is frigging crucial there, and its a tightrope walk. Newbies need to keep it simple.
Soil is so much more forgiving, and organics are even more so. I have a pen, and I do monitor he run-off pH on occasion, but I aint anal if it drifts a bit here and there.
Right on dude, i over engineer to under engineer, keep it simple. Peace
 

neved

Well-Known Member
Nice work
i put my ph in drip system between 5.4-6.20 its not have any ph problems yet.
if u add nuts the ph level gets down by ppm result
smoke well
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Nice work
i put my ph in drip system between 5.4-6.20 its not have any ph problems yet.
if u add nuts the ph level gets down by ppm result
smoke well
And then neutralised on contact by the alkaline or lime in your soil. I am stoked to bits to finally answer this question, i need someone to throw a spanner in the works but failing that i must say this is the definative answer to pH and wether to pH your water. By all means pH water and nutes to whatever you want but all should be neutralised to an acceptable level of pH with the correct percentage of lime per soil pH per water pH per length of grow. Peace
 

Jack Harer

Well-Known Member
King, Neved is in Hydro I believe. At least I saw what I thought was Hydroton in the pots in pics of his grow.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
So he will have to regulate his medium pH which is water by adjusting that.

I dont want to stop the knowledge just there either as theres more and just when you thought it was over!lol!

''Basically, in container culture, if you put the nutrients in front of the plants they will get them. Container media pH problems are more related to a particular plant's ability to take up or limit uptake of certain nutrients than it is to pH. In other words, plants called acid-lovers don't like low pH soils because of the pH, they like it because they have difficulty limiting Ca uptake, which becomes less available as pH falls. Experiments show that if we limit the amount of Ca in the soil, you can grow happy blueberries and rhododendrons at pH levels in excess of 8.5 which are reported to need a soil pH of 4!''

Sorry but i copy pasted that from garden web as i didnt want to put it into my own words-

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/soil/msg0818221215975.html

But this has a direct correlation with nutrient uptake and pH especially calcium of which marijuana likes lots of and probably the reason why it prefers a soil pH that offers it lots of calcium.

Calcium is passive intake for plants, that is it relies on uptake passively through the xylem system by osmotic pressure (unless chelated) and so a greater pH allows plants to uptake more like marijuana and soybean but a lower pH restricts avaliability which is why blueberry plants like a pH of 4 and dont like to uptake much calcium. Make that calcium deficient in your soil (quite hard with todays storebought soils) and it will grow fine at higher pH's. I have no reference to someone growing blueberries at higher pH's though. Peace
 

TwistedGenetics

Well-Known Member
I am one to not discredit education but your not stating that college knowledge or any knowledge of any thing you mentioned is needed to grow some prime smoke are you?:
Absolutely not. I grew some really great bud outdoors two years ago. Just to see what would happen I put a plant next to a pond and didn't touch it at all. It was just as good as the stuff I cared for...

So let me say this straight forward - YOU DON'T NEED TO KNOW A DAMN THING TO GROW GREAT SMOKE OTHER THAN HOW TO PICK A GOOD OUTDOOR LOCATION AND HOW TO PLANT THE SEED.

:) :)
 

Dankster4Life

Well-Known Member
Absolutely not. I grew some really great bud outdoors two years ago. Just to see what would happen I put a plant next to a pond and didn't touch it at all. It was just as good as the stuff I cared for...

So let me say this straight forward - YOU DON'T NEED TO KNOW A DAMN THING TO GROW GREAT SMOKE OTHER THAN HOW TO PICK A GOOD OUTDOOR LOCATION AND HOW TO PLANT THE SEED.

:) :)

Thank you!

I was really hoping you weren't gonna say......yes,it's needed.

I will admit,all that shit is interesting to me but not from a growing point of view.More just cause it's cool to learn.

You mentioned some thing that put a grin on my face.I have my indoor garden,which is my thing,not an OD grower.But....i do have 1 plant OD in the back yard.nothing crazy just a 3 or so footer.The one OD has gotten the bare minimum in the "care for" department.She looks just as good as the indoor girls,smells wonderful.The longer i grow the more the "less is more" comes into play.

Keep it green
 

Izoc666

Well-Known Member
i never check ph and i use miracle gro products. am i fucked or what?
lol..i dont think you re fucked up with miracle gro products ! i have one different strain of cannabis plant...the plant really dont like the nutes from GH flora series till i fed with MG all purpose food MJ got crazy and grew bigger !
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Thank you!

I was really hoping you weren't gonna say......yes,it's needed.

I will admit,all that shit is interesting to me but not from a growing point of view.More just cause it's cool to learn.

You mentioned some thing that put a grin on my face.I have my indoor garden,which is my thing,not an OD grower.But....i do have 1 plant OD in the back yard.nothing crazy just a 3 or so footer.The one OD has gotten the bare minimum in the "care for" department.She looks just as good as the indoor girls,smells wonderful.The longer i grow the more the "less is more" comes into play.

Keep it green
I would take it indoors is so much harder because the roots are limited. Bigger roots generally means more nutes water etc. A plant can seek out what it needs normally, cactus grow in the desert no problem at all, with 40ft deep roots i would as well. I wish i could do outdoor grows but the weather and pigs say otherwise.

It is cool to learn dude although i'm with you, this thread hasn't caused me to change a single thing about my grow, i got good lime in my soil that i mix up myself and i never pH'd water any way. Peace
 

cues

Well-Known Member
I studied greenkeeping in some depth and went on to manage different types of sports surfaces, in many differing situations. What I hope I learned may of be of some use in the following analogy.
1) If it ain't broke, don't fix it, but find out everyithing about your current state, maintain it and make sure it doesn't deteriorate. Improve if you want to or have the time or inclination.
2) Keep a sharp eye out for problems. Use them to find out what is wrong. In my case, I used weeds as indicators. i.e. clover would mean low nitrogen,
2) Feed little and often.
Finally however, I would like to add that soil pH will directly relate to your yield if you are trying to grow to maximum efficiency. However, small drifts will have little bearing unless the plants are showing a deficiancy. Also remember that an excess of one nutrient can prevent a lock-out (plants ability to absorb another) nutrient.
An often-encountered example of this is an excess of phosphate that makes the roots unable to take up Magnesium. The result has the appearence of Mg deficiency but cannot be cured by applying more Mg as it's not getting to the source of the problem (excess Phosphates). Unfortunately. Mg lock-out is often mis-diagnosed as Iron deficency, which, in the case of turf, results in Fe sulphate applications which drops the pH and compounds the problem
I guess what I am trying to say is it depends on how far you want to take it, how much you want to learn, and if and how much you are bothered about the extra bit of yield.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Missing the point dude, this aint the thread for a little epilogue by you and feed no nitrogen for flowering and no such lock happens although ther plant flowers heavily deficient, still not a lock out!

Just trying to get to the bottom of some myths here, mainly "SHOULD YOU BOTHER PH'ing WATER???" and i think we did if you read the thread.

Now whereas you can decide how far or much effort you want to put into a grow that is not what im doing here, result of this thread shows that lime in soil performs the same chemical reaction as pH up dose when making up a feed or watering solution.

It really dose seem that some people dont read or take the knowledge in from the whole thread rather pick up from the last page with some apparent pearl of wisdom! Really dude thanks for your sentiments but i really think you missed the point of the thread and the answers.

Knowledge merely passes some by, please dont let it be you dude and read on again. Peace
 

truepunk87

Well-Known Member
Soil+organics+microbial life = no need to Ph

This is from general hydroponics blog about general organics nutrients and the need to Ph
"When using the GO line, pH adjustment is not necessary in a biologically active soil or soilless medium. When using Coco, it’s not a bad idea to inoculate with ( mycorrhize ) to bolster microbial populations. The biological activity which comes from microbial life within the medium, consumes the food provided by the GO line of products. Once the microbial digestion occurs, exudates from the fungi and bacteria are ingested by the plant in the form of food. This is different than feeding with traditional hydroponic nutrients, . When gardening with mineral based nutrition, pH is the basis for nutrient uptake. This is because the nutrients are ionically charged, and the proper pH is necessary for root absorption of the food. This is also why nutrient strength monitoring (EC/PPM/TDS) is a good idea when using a mineral based nutrient, whether in soil, soilless, or hydroponics. With your Coco medium, be sure to use the CaMg+. Happy Growing! "
 

obijohn

Well-Known Member
My tap water is fine, the only PH adjusting I do is when I use nutes, especially Tiger Bloom, that acidifies the water big time. Last year before I got a water PH tester, I used it for a month before the acidity started messing with the plant's health. I started adjusting and it fixed it.

But yeah, if you are growing in good soil to begin with, getting anal about PH is pointless
 
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