Your CXA3590 Mission Should you Choose to Accept It !
- Thread starter JavaCo
- Start date
Tristan Rogers
Member
I have hit the books. However there are people in here with more knowledge than i'll ever have. So I thought i would get a group of opinions, and then formulate a plan from there.. Discussion is great, especially after reading so much..
Well if you mean the hlg-120h-1400 , like JavaCO and others said, it'll cost 70$ per driver.
on 108V output , you will use 84V max for a 108V output driver , which isnt the best ... but read some post you will see .
For the cxa3590 , read some post again , there is not a lot of choice .
In 3000k , Z4 bin are available and now i see BB bin are available on digikey !!!
in 2700k AD bin only .
Tristan Rogers
Member
http://www.digikey.ca/product-search/en?vendor=0&keywords=cxa+3590
if you check out the top 5, which i can order in quantities of 1.. I'm curious as which one would be best for both veg and flower, or if there is a suggested mixture.. the other choice is just to plunk down the 450 (cdn) for a Mars II 900w
if you check out the top 5, which i can order in quantities of 1.. I'm curious as which one would be best for both veg and flower, or if there is a suggested mixture.. the other choice is just to plunk down the 450 (cdn) for a Mars II 900w
Hmmm , i think COB led is designed to replace HPS/MH in street light ect ..
If you take a look at cxa3590 datasheet , you will that the 2700K have a big part of blue , and lot of green ect ...
The peak in red is 620 i believe by memory ...
And , in my opinion , i would make , and thats what i'll do , not mixing for veg/bloom
Serious , the veg phase , its so easy , and you don't need lot .
Something like hans panel motherplant will do great veg for example.
And you can do better with some cobs , with just neutral and cool white , no need the "hardcore" series like 3590 for this i think
Pro would say this better than me , and also if i'm right or not
nogod_
Well-Known Member
Probably the 3000k. (BB)
Its going to cost you more than double the mars to build a lamp for 4x4 out of cxa3590. Also @ 1.4a the 3590 is not very efficient so youre going to be producing a lot of heat.
Why did you choose that chip?
Its going to cost you more than double the mars to build a lamp for 4x4 out of cxa3590. Also @ 1.4a the 3590 is not very efficient so youre going to be producing a lot of heat.
Why did you choose that chip?
Tristan Rogers
Member
I'm thinking 6 3k's would put out a lot more lumen than the Mars II which i believe is rated at 24k from 12 or 18 inches.. I just liked the specs of that chip, lot's of lumen, which i know isn't the idea measurement. I've also thought about vero 29's or cxa 3070's.. That's why i'm open to suggestions, and discussions is the best way..
nogod_
Well-Known Member
SupraSPL, post: 11115561
DB, as you probably know the CXA3590 dissipates a lot of power at 1.4A, about 112W. The CXA3590 efficiency is mind blowing when running soft and cannot be beat in that situation, but when it comes to driving them hard with large dissipation, the Vero29 really takes over.
Here is how they compare using the "typical" figures
CXA3590 3000K BD (top bin) at 1.4A is 35% efficient and cost $1.42/PAR W.
To match the cost of the CXA and increase efficiency, at 1.4A the 3000K Vero29 is 41% efficient and cost $1.53/PAR W.
Or to beat the cost and efficiency of the CXA, at 2.1A the 3000K Vero 29 is 38.1% efficient and cost $1.06/PAR W.
So if you are not set on the CXA, you might be able to do even better with the Vero in this case and drivers would be much cheaper as well.
if you insist on doing a light for both veg\flower you will end up with a mediocre light that does neither the best.
You should really think of building a great flowering lamp. and a different lamp for veg.
Well , here I am
for cxa3590 module
-4x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CXA3590-0000-000R00BB30F/CXA3590-0000-000R00BB30F-ND/4501398
or
4x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CXA3590-0000-000R00AD27F/CXA3590-0000-000R00AD27F-ND/4501389
or 2x bin BB 3000k + 2x bin AD 2700k
cost = 224$
-driver : 4x http://ledpower.en.alibaba.com/product/60026746951-219201998/PFC_EMC_waterproof_constant_current_ip66_85v_1750ma_150w_high_current_power_supply.html
cost : 243$ ( 73$ shipping included )
fan : 4x alpine 11 rev2 8$ + thermal grease , solder , reflector and wires , well above 550-600$
power between 77V@1.2A and 83V@1.7A = from 92W to 141W x4 for 600$
For vero29 module :
-5x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/BXRC-27E10K0-L-03/976-1153-ND/3913136 = 150$
driver :
5x http://www.satisled.com/80w-power-led-driver-ac180265v-input-dc2438v24a-output_p1123.html = 130$ (2.4ma)
or
5x http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&pa=2122001&productId=2122001&CID=findchips&utm_source=supplyFrame&utm_medium=buyNow (2.1A) = 200$
more expensive but its meanwell
+ fan ect .. total cost above 350-400$
powered at 36V@2.1A or 38V@2.4 ( depend of the driver choice ) = from 75W to 91W x5 for 400$
*note that for the cxa 3590 module the 80$ of shipping for drivers, it raised a lot the price, without this , price between the 2 solutions are pretty closed
for cxa3590 module
-4x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CXA3590-0000-000R00BB30F/CXA3590-0000-000R00BB30F-ND/4501398
or
4x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CXA3590-0000-000R00AD27F/CXA3590-0000-000R00AD27F-ND/4501389
or 2x bin BB 3000k + 2x bin AD 2700k
cost = 224$
-driver : 4x http://ledpower.en.alibaba.com/product/60026746951-219201998/PFC_EMC_waterproof_constant_current_ip66_85v_1750ma_150w_high_current_power_supply.html
cost : 243$ ( 73$ shipping included )
fan : 4x alpine 11 rev2 8$ + thermal grease , solder , reflector and wires , well above 550-600$
power between 77V@1.2A and 83V@1.7A = from 92W to 141W x4 for 600$
For vero29 module :
-5x http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/BXRC-27E10K0-L-03/976-1153-ND/3913136 = 150$
driver :
5x http://www.satisled.com/80w-power-led-driver-ac180265v-input-dc2438v24a-output_p1123.html = 130$ (2.4ma)
or
5x http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&pa=2122001&productId=2122001&CID=findchips&utm_source=supplyFrame&utm_medium=buyNow (2.1A) = 200$
more expensive but its meanwell
+ fan ect .. total cost above 350-400$
powered at 36V@2.1A or 38V@2.4 ( depend of the driver choice ) = from 75W to 91W x5 for 400$
*note that for the cxa 3590 module the 80$ of shipping for drivers, it raised a lot the price, without this , price between the 2 solutions are pretty closed
Positivity
Well-Known Member
Yea the shipping sucks on alibaba. I got the same shipping quote for 2 drivers so you came out a little better than me..
I wouldnt try and cool 150w of 3590 with a arctic 11 though. Going to need a heatsink usa slab of aluminum or a bigger cpu cooler.
Im going to try a few different cooling options...not sure how well it will work at full draw. Like i said before...it will be hard to run at full draw...im doing it more out of curiosity than anything. The arctic 11 would probably run at 70c plus..
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nogod_
Well-Known Member
Remember the efficiency numbers supra quoted you for the 3590 were for the BD bin. The BB bin is an even less efficient cob when driven hard. Add in the shipping and all signs point to v29.
SupraSPL
Well-Known Member
DB, are you set up for 240V, I noticed that a few of those drivers are not compatible with 120V, not sure if that affects you. Also, the CEN-75-36 maxes out at 36Vf but the Vero29 at 2.1A would be about 38Vf at startup temp. And finally, that SatisLED 2.4 driver might not put out as much current as it advertises. I am in the process of ordering and testing drivers in that range to see how they perform.
The CXA3590 3000K BB bin at 1.8A = 28% efficient (typical) and dissipates 150W.
The Vero 29 3000K at 2.4A = 37% efficient (typical) and dissipates 92W.
I agree POS, the 150W setup might be too much for the Alpine 11, I have not tested them that high. You would probably be better off with something with a larger capacity. The 92W setup would be good to go.
The CXA3590 3000K BB bin at 1.8A = 28% efficient (typical) and dissipates 150W.
The Vero 29 3000K at 2.4A = 37% efficient (typical) and dissipates 92W.
I agree POS, the 150W setup might be too much for the Alpine 11, I have not tested them that high. You would probably be better off with something with a larger capacity. The 92W setup would be good to go.
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ok guys I get it 
Anyway I will go vero29 , I just post cxa3590 config for someone just in case .
Yeah for the fan I would habe been going on dynatron like JavaCO
Hmm I miss something with V and A
the V is automatic adjust by the driver right ?
the right voltage depends on the A current right ?
Mean "dimmable driver" , what is dimmable its only the A right ?
So by this way , I was supposed for the cxa3590 by example , 77V@1.2A typical
On a dimmable driver outp V84V Max current 1.5A , we could dim the current to 1.2A so the driver will adjust automatically at 77V the cxa , right ?
Anyway , you right for the vero29 , dunno why , I was blocked on 36V@2.1A .
Its 38V , damn , gotta go again on searching for driver ...
By the way , the 2700K CRI80 looks damn good running 39V@2.8A , make 110L/W
just 8L/W diff compare when 38V@2.1A and when Tj is 25°
Anyway I will go vero29 , I just post cxa3590 config for someone just in case .
Yeah for the fan I would habe been going on dynatron like JavaCO
Hmm I miss something with V and A
the V is automatic adjust by the driver right ?
the right voltage depends on the A current right ?
Mean "dimmable driver" , what is dimmable its only the A right ?
So by this way , I was supposed for the cxa3590 by example , 77V@1.2A typical
On a dimmable driver outp V84V Max current 1.5A , we could dim the current to 1.2A so the driver will adjust automatically at 77V the cxa , right ?
Anyway , you right for the vero29 , dunno why , I was blocked on 36V@2.1A .
Its 38V , damn , gotta go again on searching for driver ...
By the way , the 2700K CRI80 looks damn good running 39V@2.8A , make 110L/W
just 8L/W diff compare when 38V@2.1A and when Tj is 25°
SupraSPL
Well-Known Member
Ya the way I see it, we can run the Vero29 as hard as we can find an affordable driver to do the job. So if 2.1A turns out to be the cheapest decent driver than that will be the best way to go. But if we can track down a 2.4A or 2.8A that actually puts out what it says and is cheap (~$30) then that will be the way to go.
Regarding Volts and Amps, on a constant current circuit things work a lot differently that what we are normally used to on constant voltage circuits. So the driver has a minimum and maximum Vf that we have to stay between. The COB has a "native" Vf that it will "draw". That Vf will vary quite a bit depending on the drive current and it will vary slightly from COB to COB. It will also decrease slightly as it warms up and it may shift a bit as it ages LOL.
So most constant current dimmable drivers allow you to adjust the current output (Amps) and that is the basic thing for most of us to know. But there are some CC drivers that also have a voltage adjustment because they have constant voltage characteristics. The Mean Well HLN series is an example. Here is how they explain it but it leaves me with questions. I tried to order one from TRC but they were sold out and didn't tell me until after I ordered.
Regarding Volts and Amps, on a constant current circuit things work a lot differently that what we are normally used to on constant voltage circuits. So the driver has a minimum and maximum Vf that we have to stay between. The COB has a "native" Vf that it will "draw". That Vf will vary quite a bit depending on the drive current and it will vary slightly from COB to COB. It will also decrease slightly as it warms up and it may shift a bit as it ages LOL.
So most constant current dimmable drivers allow you to adjust the current output (Amps) and that is the basic thing for most of us to know. But there are some CC drivers that also have a voltage adjustment because they have constant voltage characteristics. The Mean Well HLN series is an example. Here is how they explain it but it leaves me with questions. I tried to order one from TRC but they were sold out and didn't tell me until after I ordered.
AquariusPanta
Well-Known Member
Customization is a beautiful thing. Being able to alter both potential (voltage) and current (amps) sounds ideal as far as a driver goes.
I have a meanwell hlg 100H with both the current and voltage adjustments. It was in limp mode on a light that was spec'd really close to the max voltage. I tried adjusting first dimming current, then dimming voltage and back and forth, but got really confused and gave up. I ended up taking off a couple of leds to keep it from going into limp mode.
I didn't understand when the driver was working in constant current or when it was in constant voltage.
I didn't understand when the driver was working in constant current or when it was in constant voltage.
SupraSPL
Well-Known Member
Good info. What I get from the PDF, if you set current to max then also max out the Vf, but not high enough to set off the over voltage protection, you should be able to adjust the max voltage range higher than the constant current range max setting. But if you reduce the current setting from max, you have to observe the max vF of the constant current range or else go into limping mode.
That paragraph makes it sound very confusing and I don not know that I have it correct, my curiosity is enough I am going to have to order one and test it.
That paragraph makes it sound very confusing and I don not know that I have it correct, my curiosity is enough I am going to have to order one and test it.
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Since there are now cxa3590 with 36V, wouldn't it be easier to just go with those ?
@SupraSPL ; could one for example use HLG-185H-C700B to connect 8 x cxa3590's ? Max voltage = 286, but 36V x 8 = 288V, will it go into limp mode if I try to connect them ? how's that overvoltage-protection work ?
Also, what's most dangerous : high voltage or high current ?
@SupraSPL ; could one for example use HLG-185H-C700B to connect 8 x cxa3590's ? Max voltage = 286, but 36V x 8 = 288V, will it go into limp mode if I try to connect them ? how's that overvoltage-protection work ?
Also, what's most dangerous : high voltage or high current ?
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Observe & Report
Well-Known Member
In this instance, high voltage strings are more dangerous. It doesn't take much current to stop your heart but it has to get there first. Fortunately you're surrounded by an insulator, your skin. Higher Voltage means higher potential to go through your skin into your body. Wet skin has much lower resistance than dry skin.