Medicinal Garden [WhiteWidoW] 6clones-Outdoor Monsters in ground w/ Organic soil(PIX)
- Thread starter BooMeR242
- Start date
SOG
Well-Known Member
did you test this?
correct me if im wrong
the only issue with growing Mblaze style trees with T5 is light penetration
you'd probably need the space, what if you train them early in veg
he can still get excellent penetration with up to the nose T5 fixtures
he can also mix 3k and 6.5k in the same fixture to get the stretch needed
I'm not sure the differences will be other then maybe few more days under floro
between the heat buildup from 6 x 1000w, here in CA
the equipment needed to then keep the temps in check
the initial coasts, then coasts of operating it, then top it off with the clutter it adds to the room and the maintenance routine
in my opinion is negligible for few more days in veg
I'm witnessing amazing growth in my veg unit
in just two days since i upgraded from 10k to 32k lumens
didn't expect the T5 to perform so well
i was told they need to go to flowering ASAP
since they exploded the way they did
perfect note, on the money
BooMeR242
Well-Known Member
true true durign the winter heat wont b so bad but like right now its 100+ and thatyll b ridic to fight but no i havent tested it. its all theoru lol thats part of the grow challenge i like.
im def gonna have to check the lumens and spectrum charts on the t5 compared to the MH lamps then cuz obivously ur method works and mine isnt in opertation yet haha.
but its gonna b a work in preocess and im prepared to spend ridic amount of funds as is
im def gonna have to check the lumens and spectrum charts on the t5 compared to the MH lamps then cuz obivously ur method works and mine isnt in opertation yet haha.
but its gonna b a work in preocess and im prepared to spend ridic amount of funds as is
GypsyBush
Well-Known Member
No I didn't test growing trees with a fluoro, but I have grown my moms under one for almost a year now...
And it's easy to see that anything less than full coverage will not do...
And when you are vegging a plant that is 6'x6'... you would need lots of them...
I cringe at the thought of having to adjust that many lights... in a room full of trees...
I actually have very little experience with trees.. but my current grow is teaching me a lot...
and I dare say that with trees it pays to veg with just the same amount of light (per sqft of canopy) as you do to flower...
You want VIGOROUS GROWTH... wood branches... which require HID.. in my opinion...
Can you do it with T-5s... sure... I guess... but not as efficiently..
In tree growing... T-5s are kinda like CFLs on a bigger version...
and if you really want mixed spectrum, you can use MH & HPS...
Funny to see you talking about too many gadgets...
But I must say that you have ZERO clutter...
But I agree that it's a lot of heat to deal with...
But IT CAN BE DEALT WITH...
Even more easily if you have access to 30 and 40 below air...
I say YOU GUYS MOVE TO AK... let's start a revolution and overgrow!!!
They do well for small plants bro...
But they lack the punch needed for HUMONGOUS SUPER CHARGED GROWTH...
Not that I have experience with such things...
The max I have used for veg was 3x 600w... one per plant..
nickbbad
New Member
you could do a mix of the metal halides and the t5's you could use the t5's as side lighting and the metal halide on top t5's only get about 18 inches of light penetration so for those big ladies they may not be the best option but they are killer lights for veg. < I found I like them much better for my smaller plants then I did my metal halide so it might be something to look into. As far as having yellow leaves on your outdoor plants its pretty normal to start getting them at about this time. They tend to start showing up once they fully gone into flowering and will continue throughout the rest of your grow.
strictly seedleSs
Well-Known Member
I know of a setup with 4 x 4' 6 bulb HO T5 fixtures, over 2 4x8 tables, and those do very well. But T5s only get the job done if your not vegging very long. I have 2 8 bulb fixtures over 2 4x4 areas, I like it, but im not going for trees indoor. Boomer, if you get the same success ID as you have OD then you will have your trees.
SOG
Well-Known Member
i was only referring to vegging with T5
you can also look at it this way
replace the exact canopy I'm lighting now with 32k lumens (36 girls); with one of Mblaze tree's
you still feel its not enough? now double by 2.5+, still not enough per tree?
when considering the lumens PAR with 1k MH
i can almost say with certainty more lumens are preserved
and directly delivered to the plant with T5 due to lack of heat radiation from the bulb
the girls can be nosing the bulbs with no issue or heat burn
I'm running 2 x 28 New Wave's with all 8 slots loaded with 6500k side by side
its sitting no higher then a foot and a half off the tray
that's 32000 lumens in the right band directly on the plants
lighting an area of about 2" x 4"
I'm restricted by my cage other wise
id go with 2 48 New Wave's with all 8 slots loaded with 6500k = 80000 lumens
to be picky, electricity wise its less then running 1000k MH with the same 80000 lumens
16 x 54w = 810w! for the same lumens
another very small minor benefit running 80k T5 setup over 1k MH
the entire 80000 lumens can be deliver at zero distance with minimal to non PAR loss
as much handle as you got on the heat from one 1k MH your still cant bring it as close as you'd a T5
heat wise Therese nothing to compare between the two scenarios
comparing with a full blown 1000k MH bulb
that's the same lumens, for less initial coast, maintenance, and everything i mentioned before
i have a full 1k MH sitting here I'm not using, a Digital Lumatek 1k ballast 240v with the true EYE Blue 1k
a Sun Tube and AAW to go with it, that's over 1k setup just for my MH
just the thought of what needs to be done to get it running properly after i got my flower room dialed in
had me running to the shop and getting a T5 setup,
beside thinking about it now in hindsight; i dont see how a 1k MH
will deliver more lumens then the T5 scenario i mentioned above
you can also look at it this way
replace the exact canopy I'm lighting now with 32k lumens (36 girls); with one of Mblaze tree's
you still feel its not enough? now double by 2.5+, still not enough per tree?
when considering the lumens PAR with 1k MH
i can almost say with certainty more lumens are preserved
and directly delivered to the plant with T5 due to lack of heat radiation from the bulb
the girls can be nosing the bulbs with no issue or heat burn
I'm running 2 x 28 New Wave's with all 8 slots loaded with 6500k side by side
its sitting no higher then a foot and a half off the tray
that's 32000 lumens in the right band directly on the plants
lighting an area of about 2" x 4"
I'm restricted by my cage other wise
id go with 2 48 New Wave's with all 8 slots loaded with 6500k = 80000 lumens
to be picky, electricity wise its less then running 1000k MH with the same 80000 lumens
16 x 54w = 810w! for the same lumens
another very small minor benefit running 80k T5 setup over 1k MH
the entire 80000 lumens can be deliver at zero distance with minimal to non PAR loss
as much handle as you got on the heat from one 1k MH your still cant bring it as close as you'd a T5
heat wise Therese nothing to compare between the two scenarios
comparing with a full blown 1000k MH bulb
that's the same lumens, for less initial coast, maintenance, and everything i mentioned before
i have a full 1k MH sitting here I'm not using, a Digital Lumatek 1k ballast 240v with the true EYE Blue 1k
a Sun Tube and AAW to go with it, that's over 1k setup just for my MH
just the thought of what needs to be done to get it running properly after i got my flower room dialed in
had me running to the shop and getting a T5 setup,
beside thinking about it now in hindsight; i dont see how a 1k MH
will deliver more lumens then the T5 scenario i mentioned above
SOG
Well-Known Member
groputillor
Active Member
This discussions got me thinking about my plans for my first real op (ya I wanna jump on the Mblaze train too). I'd side with SOG if it wasn't for the fact that we're talking about growing trees ie. vegging for a long time. Ya you can put them way closer so the whole plant recieves more of the lumens put out, but when the plant is three feet tall and nearly as wide, I think having it so close would cause the top of the plant to still recieve more lumens, but the middle and bottom to recieve much less than would be delivered by a 1000 watt MH at a greater distance from the top. Of course, for a small price you could add a lot of side T5's that could be placed exactly where needed and as close as you want. I don't know much about how the merits of the light spectrums of each option stack up, but I imagine that wouldn't make enough of a difference to effect the decision. So what about adding the side lighting to a T5 setup, would the extra cost make it a wash? Does it make the 1k MH setup worth it? Or would the extra cost of cooling a 1k MH setup (we're talking 6-12 of em) make it way more? (in Boom's climate, 100+ in the summer)
SOG
Well-Known Member
for sure running 6 MH 24/7 will be an issue even with a 24k AC
you'll be pushing 21k BTU heat just from the lights
when its 100+ outside and the AC is sweating
i doubt you'll get half of those cooling BTU's
heck, my whole house with its central AC is having a hard time keeping temps inside the house
at 74 during the hot hours of the day, I'm not running any lights in my house
just a regular insulated house in the SoCal area
now to the trees
i totally see the issue with penetration when the girls gets fat
but there's a but, aren't the branches trained to spread wide to allow light in during the veg period with Mblaze tree's?
if so; is penetration still an issue with T5?
you'll be pushing 21k BTU heat just from the lights
when its 100+ outside and the AC is sweating
i doubt you'll get half of those cooling BTU's
heck, my whole house with its central AC is having a hard time keeping temps inside the house
at 74 during the hot hours of the day, I'm not running any lights in my house
just a regular insulated house in the SoCal area
now to the trees
i totally see the issue with penetration when the girls gets fat
but there's a but, aren't the branches trained to spread wide to allow light in during the veg period with Mblaze tree's?
if so; is penetration still an issue with T5?
GypsyBush
Well-Known Member
It's not penetration Bro..
It's intensity of light...
It's the same reason that we flower with HPS instead of cfls...
Trees require ridiculous lighting to get ridiculously big..
It can be done... I'm sure...
But just ask M Blaze if he would switch his HPSs for fluoro...
Maybe he'd say yes.. but I really seriously doubt it...
You want a stalk as thick as your chin? and buds the size of footballs?
Gotta do it up... I don;t think fluoros will cut it...
and just remember ... I use and preach T-5s for vegging SOG Moms...
I am not knocking them down..
Just saying they have their place.. and that they are not the right tool for the job when growing trees...
...
Again.. all my opinion...
Just a silly Gypsy that doesn't know shit...
fucking gypsies...
It's intensity of light...
It's the same reason that we flower with HPS instead of cfls...
Trees require ridiculous lighting to get ridiculously big..
It can be done... I'm sure...
But just ask M Blaze if he would switch his HPSs for fluoro...
Maybe he'd say yes.. but I really seriously doubt it...
You want a stalk as thick as your chin? and buds the size of footballs?
Gotta do it up... I don;t think fluoros will cut it...
and just remember ... I use and preach T-5s for vegging SOG Moms...
I am not knocking them down..
Just saying they have their place.. and that they are not the right tool for the job when growing trees...
...
Again.. all my opinion...
Just a silly Gypsy that doesn't know shit...
fucking gypsies...
BooMeR242
Well-Known Member
lol this is an intersting discussion switched from outdoor to indoor but all good info and points. the thing i like about growin and learning is everyones got their method thats works but for growin m blaze style (which im trying to attempt) ill most likely stick with HID lamps and maybe just double up the AC units then. my pops owns an AC company so everything i do will be designed up with him helpin and figuring the best possible scenario out. but well see when it happens if i can get it dialed in or not.
im headin out in a few for havasu for the weekend feel free to continue discussin the light options if u guys want ill b bak monday! happy labor day guys peace
im headin out in a few for havasu for the weekend feel free to continue discussin the light options if u guys want ill b bak monday! happy labor day guys peace
Zig Zag Zane
Well-Known Member
Boomer, just saw the pics of the flowering....WOW...looks beautiful...love those colas shooting up towards the sky...
keep it up cant wait to see the harvest...
keep it up cant wait to see the harvest...
SOG
Well-Known Member
are we talking PAR?
let me see if i got this right,
so you want them to stretch from the word go; with Mblaze style tree's,
interesting
i hear you bra
ooh stfu, should i feel sorry for you now; or laterAgain.. all my opinion...
Just a silly Gypsy that doesn't know shit...
you lucky ....
ty bra, much appreciated
enjoy your weekend, and happy labor everyone
GypsyBush
Well-Known Member
no... we're talking fluoroescent vs HID...
you GOTTA agree there is a BIG difference...
You want stretch so your branches can become long...
If you look at M Blaze's trees... they are not compact...
They stretch out far and wide...
With lots of "lollipops" growing vertically from the horizontal branches...
If you had everything super tight... by the time flowering comes... you would have created a barrier impenetrable to airflow... causeing ALL kinds of problems...
I am seeing that with the fullest of my girls...
Bunches of leaves overlapping... you can lift one and see the leaf WET... RH in room is 45% with 800+ cfm exhaust in a 8x11 room...
Stretching is important for spacing...
Things I say usually get ignored cause I'm weird...i hear you bra
ooh stfu, should i feel sorry for you now; or later
and don;t know how to explain well...But trust me bro... if you want a MASSIVE TREE... you need MASSIVE LIGHTING..
In a tree, the structure created in veg is as important as the flowering...
..
Well...
I gotta go press some hash now... my kief jar is full...
BooMeR242
Well-Known Member
finally bak in town long ass weekend but glad to come home and see my ladies doin well.
flowering looks like its gettin more dense.
i sprayed the spinosad spray to kill off bugs and shit before i left early morning and looks like a a couple smaller colas got a lil mold going? like its kinda light brown and falls apart at the touch. its minor mold or watever but ill take pic soon and show u guys. should i leave it or cut it off?
thanks for the help guys.
thanks Mcone glad u could stop by hope u stay tuned for the harvest coming up in a month or so.
flowering looks like its gettin more dense.
i sprayed the spinosad spray to kill off bugs and shit before i left early morning and looks like a a couple smaller colas got a lil mold going? like its kinda light brown and falls apart at the touch. its minor mold or watever but ill take pic soon and show u guys. should i leave it or cut it off?
thanks for the help guys.
thanks Mcone glad u could stop by hope u stay tuned for the harvest coming up in a month or so.