Greenthumb Gangsta
Active Member
WOW! I never new poppy flowers were so beautiful.
They make you fell good too. Sounds like another plant I know.
They make you fell good too. Sounds like another plant I know.
Opium poppy
- Thread starter diehlerman
- Start date
abso1utepain
Well-Known Member
where can these be aquired in the states, not ebay. would garden stores have them? probably not, grocery stores? any specific brands sell them?
natmoon
Well-Known Member
I would like to grow these poppies ready for when i am really old and infirm or ill so i don't have to lie in my bed in pain until the doctor or nurse arrives each day to inject me with morphine.
Sounds like a better idea to me to make your own Nepalese hash and get a big stash ready for your dying days.
Does anyone know when and why and how it became illegal to grow your own medicine and/or medicate yourself?
Does anyone know why they wish us to feel pain and suffer so they can make a few more quid out of us before we die?
Does anyone know why we put up with it
Sounds like a better idea to me to make your own Nepalese hash and get a big stash ready for your dying days.
Does anyone know when and why and how it became illegal to grow your own medicine and/or medicate yourself?
Does anyone know why they wish us to feel pain and suffer so they can make a few more quid out of us before we die?
Does anyone know why we put up with it
goatamineHcL
Well-Known Member
i can come give you morphine shots its pretty easy
sYxJesters
Active Member
For all of you wanting to grow some Papaver Somniferum, I suggest you check this FAQ located at the Lycaeum: Lycaeum > Leda > Opium FAQ
It'll answer all of your questions.
For those who will be growing this plant, I suggest that you smoke it instead of taking it orally, this way there is less of a chance of overdose. Start out with a match-head size dose and work up (very) slowly.
It'll answer all of your questions.
For those who will be growing this plant, I suggest that you smoke it instead of taking it orally, this way there is less of a chance of overdose. Start out with a match-head size dose and work up (very) slowly.
granitestate
Well-Known Member
the cannabis heaven site didnt really tell you how to make codeine. it said you had to start with codeine tablets, im guessing thats only to make a more concentrated form. it didnt say anything about turning raw opium into codeine or hydrocodone or anything to the affect. and anyone that wants to make heroine, imo, is a lil out there. just stick with the opium haha
granitestate
Well-Known Member
The Lycaeum site is much more informative as to how to actually harvest the opium. score it then ignore it! (set it and forget it). sorry, bookoo blazed
kochab
New Member
so....how can i learn more a bout em.anyone know if the plant god erowid has anything about their lifecycles? Id like to learn when an how to collect seed from them, and if the resin is formed at a different time, before or after the seed, etc....in generall comparrison so i can avoid trying to be caught with "opium" on my hands because of some b/s federal law governing natural plants
fuck it ill go look me self.
fuck it ill go look me self.
granitestate
Well-Known Member
im pretty sure that the seed pods are developed, or are available, after the pod opens up. so as long as its not slit, and it flowers up, then you should be straight. im no expert tho
kochab
New Member
gotta looove the plant god.
hope this aint aginst the rules....if it is then just edit the shiat. im stoned......
LEGALITIES:
Being no expert on legalities I can suggest you try the following:
The legalities of Papaver cultivation depends entirely on the law in the state where you live. If you live in a city, you might want to check with your local council, who will usually have a list of banned and/ or noxious weeds on file. You could try requesting a list, saying, for example, that you intend to set up a herb garden and want to grow St John's Wort (which is a noxious weed in many places) and would they mind sending you a list?
If you're in a rural area, try one of those Lands/Agriculture department type government agencies for a similar list.
Most Papaver species are legal to grow: some are NOT and are listed merely as weeds, which means that you _must_ take steps to eradicate them on your property and must not _cultivate_ them. In some instances their presence on your property is not a problem PROVIDING that you are not cultivating them directly, i.e. they are classed as weeds, but not noxious weeds. Somniferum is most likely to be problematic, but other papaver spp may also cause legal problems depending on the paranoia of your government agencies.
And it is a question definitely worth following up.
PROPAGATION:
Several varieties of opium yielding poppies exist -- Persian White has the largest bulb and subsequently highest yield. Another more common variety called Hungarian Blue has purple petals with a white centre, often with a bit of yellow in the middle. It is a much easier variety to find than the white, but with smaller pods and a lower opium yield.
Papaver somniferum is basically a winter crop in the Southern hemisphere, preferring cool nights and warm days and will stand slight frosts. It is possible to germinate seeds in summer using plant tissue culture processes and Murashige & Skoog basic medium -- stick the cultures in the fridge until they germinate. I have no successful experiences with planting these on -- possibly due to the short lifecycle of the poppy, but this could be a useful starting point for experiments where the object is to cultivate poppies year round. I have tried to stratify the seed in my refrigerator with a view to inducing germination for early plantings- this has not been successful, but has not seemed to compromise the fertility of the stratified seed in any way.
All poppies like sandy soils (or at least well drained ones) with a little bit of shelter and not too much shade. Prepare beds in advance by digging fertilizers and any claybreak leaving about six weeks between each dig. Cover the beds with mulch and let them sit for a month or so. You CAN fully mulch the beds, and sow into rows where the mulch has been completely removed to about 7cm away from both sides of the seed row. DO NOT MULCH OVER SEEDS OR MULCH TO THE STEMS OF ADULT PLANTS- this makes them susceptible to fungal infestations of the browning-off type!
Plant on or around Mayday (in the Southern hemisphere) by raking into prepared beds. Broadcast seeds or sow thickly in rows. Young poppy plants resemble lettuce seedlings. Stronger plants will become apparent at about 7cm high. Wait until about 10cm high and thin as follows:
Poppies DO like a bit of companionship, so thin around a clump of 2-3 strong plants. Two thinnings about four weeks apart will ensure that plants have enough 'companionship ' (i.e. shelter, shade and whatever allopathic conditions favour clumps as opposed to individual plants). I tend to thin seedlings progressively, over a month or so, leaving only enough room for strong plants to grow into, without leaving vast spaces between plants. Poppies do not like to be moved and it is better to sow directly into beds than to transplant, which can result in stunted growth and a later, shorter flowering season.
Interplanting with ranunculus and/or anemone, which flower at the same time and have a similar leaf and flower formation, may reduce flower visibility: this is important in areas where cultivation of opium poppies is illegal.
Keep the beds well weeded (poppies hate too much competition though shorter type groundcover weeds such as chickweed can keep the soil moist). Keep the water up to them in dry areas. Opium poppies (particularly the purple ones) are weeds in many places and can stand a bit of neglect. For some strange reason the tallest and most vigorous poppies are often the ones that got walked on by accident in their youth.
The plants may look a bit weedy when the flowers start to happen, don't worry, flowering gives the plant a bit of a boost.
You will get a lot of thinnings: young plantlets which have been removed from the garden bed to make room for stronger plants. If you're keen you CAN make use of them. I have references which list young plants 10-20cm high as having up to 71mg/100g dry weight of alkaloids. This can seem insignificant until you consider that opium is only about 12% alkaloids, and you can end up with a kilo of thinnings or more in your home garden. I estimate a couple of grams of smokeable opium type extract can be extracted using methanol. And given that thinnings usually appear prior to flowering commencing, why would you waste a chance?
On the other hand you CAN drop the thinnings into hot water and allow to steep for 10 minutes, which produces a vile tasting tea. Opium tea, in my humble opinion, is fucked. It tastes horrible, needs fresh flowers to be halfway potent, and does not store well. All alkaloids are apparently present in such a tea in roughly equal proportion to that which occurs in crude opium, but this improves the taste not one whit. Potency varies with opium tea: you can drink a glass and feel nothing, or drink a glass and discover in half an hour that you've had too much. Smoking O is a more immediate route and allows for better dose control. Smokeable O is also easier to store and has a long shelf life.
The alkaloids in papaver somniferum are present in the plant their pure form, and are combined with so called vegetable acids. Combined with acids, alkaloids tend to be more soluble than the free bases. An early method for the extraction of morphine involved addition of calcium chloride to the filtrate of opium 'soup'. The calcium would precipitate the calcium salt of these vegetable acids as a sort of soap scum leaving a crude morphine hydrochloride.
Opium varies in alkaloidal content from batch to batch, and between regions. The British Pharmacoepia 1954 lists Yugoslavian opium as the most potent at 15-17% alkaloid content, followed by opium from Turkey, Iran, and Indian opium was at the bottom of the list with a 9- 10.5% alkaloid content.
hope this aint aginst the rules....if it is then just edit the shiat. im stoned......
LEGALITIES:
Being no expert on legalities I can suggest you try the following:
The legalities of Papaver cultivation depends entirely on the law in the state where you live. If you live in a city, you might want to check with your local council, who will usually have a list of banned and/ or noxious weeds on file. You could try requesting a list, saying, for example, that you intend to set up a herb garden and want to grow St John's Wort (which is a noxious weed in many places) and would they mind sending you a list?
If you're in a rural area, try one of those Lands/Agriculture department type government agencies for a similar list.
Most Papaver species are legal to grow: some are NOT and are listed merely as weeds, which means that you _must_ take steps to eradicate them on your property and must not _cultivate_ them. In some instances their presence on your property is not a problem PROVIDING that you are not cultivating them directly, i.e. they are classed as weeds, but not noxious weeds. Somniferum is most likely to be problematic, but other papaver spp may also cause legal problems depending on the paranoia of your government agencies.
And it is a question definitely worth following up.
PROPAGATION:
Several varieties of opium yielding poppies exist -- Persian White has the largest bulb and subsequently highest yield. Another more common variety called Hungarian Blue has purple petals with a white centre, often with a bit of yellow in the middle. It is a much easier variety to find than the white, but with smaller pods and a lower opium yield.
Papaver somniferum is basically a winter crop in the Southern hemisphere, preferring cool nights and warm days and will stand slight frosts. It is possible to germinate seeds in summer using plant tissue culture processes and Murashige & Skoog basic medium -- stick the cultures in the fridge until they germinate. I have no successful experiences with planting these on -- possibly due to the short lifecycle of the poppy, but this could be a useful starting point for experiments where the object is to cultivate poppies year round. I have tried to stratify the seed in my refrigerator with a view to inducing germination for early plantings- this has not been successful, but has not seemed to compromise the fertility of the stratified seed in any way.
All poppies like sandy soils (or at least well drained ones) with a little bit of shelter and not too much shade. Prepare beds in advance by digging fertilizers and any claybreak leaving about six weeks between each dig. Cover the beds with mulch and let them sit for a month or so. You CAN fully mulch the beds, and sow into rows where the mulch has been completely removed to about 7cm away from both sides of the seed row. DO NOT MULCH OVER SEEDS OR MULCH TO THE STEMS OF ADULT PLANTS- this makes them susceptible to fungal infestations of the browning-off type!
Plant on or around Mayday (in the Southern hemisphere) by raking into prepared beds. Broadcast seeds or sow thickly in rows. Young poppy plants resemble lettuce seedlings. Stronger plants will become apparent at about 7cm high. Wait until about 10cm high and thin as follows:
Poppies DO like a bit of companionship, so thin around a clump of 2-3 strong plants. Two thinnings about four weeks apart will ensure that plants have enough 'companionship ' (i.e. shelter, shade and whatever allopathic conditions favour clumps as opposed to individual plants). I tend to thin seedlings progressively, over a month or so, leaving only enough room for strong plants to grow into, without leaving vast spaces between plants. Poppies do not like to be moved and it is better to sow directly into beds than to transplant, which can result in stunted growth and a later, shorter flowering season.
Interplanting with ranunculus and/or anemone, which flower at the same time and have a similar leaf and flower formation, may reduce flower visibility: this is important in areas where cultivation of opium poppies is illegal.
Keep the beds well weeded (poppies hate too much competition though shorter type groundcover weeds such as chickweed can keep the soil moist). Keep the water up to them in dry areas. Opium poppies (particularly the purple ones) are weeds in many places and can stand a bit of neglect. For some strange reason the tallest and most vigorous poppies are often the ones that got walked on by accident in their youth.
The plants may look a bit weedy when the flowers start to happen, don't worry, flowering gives the plant a bit of a boost.
You will get a lot of thinnings: young plantlets which have been removed from the garden bed to make room for stronger plants. If you're keen you CAN make use of them. I have references which list young plants 10-20cm high as having up to 71mg/100g dry weight of alkaloids. This can seem insignificant until you consider that opium is only about 12% alkaloids, and you can end up with a kilo of thinnings or more in your home garden. I estimate a couple of grams of smokeable opium type extract can be extracted using methanol. And given that thinnings usually appear prior to flowering commencing, why would you waste a chance?
On the other hand you CAN drop the thinnings into hot water and allow to steep for 10 minutes, which produces a vile tasting tea. Opium tea, in my humble opinion, is fucked. It tastes horrible, needs fresh flowers to be halfway potent, and does not store well. All alkaloids are apparently present in such a tea in roughly equal proportion to that which occurs in crude opium, but this improves the taste not one whit. Potency varies with opium tea: you can drink a glass and feel nothing, or drink a glass and discover in half an hour that you've had too much. Smoking O is a more immediate route and allows for better dose control. Smokeable O is also easier to store and has a long shelf life.
The alkaloids in papaver somniferum are present in the plant their pure form, and are combined with so called vegetable acids. Combined with acids, alkaloids tend to be more soluble than the free bases. An early method for the extraction of morphine involved addition of calcium chloride to the filtrate of opium 'soup'. The calcium would precipitate the calcium salt of these vegetable acids as a sort of soap scum leaving a crude morphine hydrochloride.
Opium varies in alkaloidal content from batch to batch, and between regions. The British Pharmacoepia 1954 lists Yugoslavian opium as the most potent at 15-17% alkaloid content, followed by opium from Turkey, Iran, and Indian opium was at the bottom of the list with a 9- 10.5% alkaloid content.
granitestate
Well-Known Member
thats kinda misleading tho, cuz it says the alkaloids are usually joined with veg. acids. so if you grow the plant, and cut it, can you just collect that an let it dry then presto? or do you have to have theose certain acids or are they already present in the plant or am i just too stoned?
kochab
New Member
basically the tar that is in them.....dry that and smoke it. it goes on to explain that there are various chemicals and that there are various means of extraction. I was just trying to give you "seed" collection information. lol
the flavor was kinda harsh if i recall the substance in my high school days correctly so they suggest drying it on a bud......
granitestate
Well-Known Member
for those interested in seeds, found this.
Seed Collecting:
Allow pods to dry on plant; break open to collect seeds
Properly cleaned, seed can be successfully stored
And i just thought of thise. if someone wanted to slice the pods but it would be visable to passer-by's......could you score the pod then cut it off, and bring em inside to collect? or is it a more time-intesive collection.
Seed Collecting:
Allow pods to dry on plant; break open to collect seeds
Properly cleaned, seed can be successfully stored
And i just thought of thise. if someone wanted to slice the pods but it would be visable to passer-by's......could you score the pod then cut it off, and bring em inside to collect? or is it a more time-intesive collection.
granitestate
Well-Known Member
well for nayone wanting to know the proper way to actually harvest the opium, i read an ineresting article....
You're poppies will grow and eventually flower. The petals will fall off shortly after, about a week or a little longer. When the petals fall off the flower, there should be a small pod remaining in the center. This is the not-yet-fully-grown seed pod. Let this pod grow, and it will quickly and in a grand scale. The seed pod will grow into a large, green, bulb. This bulb will "frost" over, or appear a lighter green in time, this is said to be when the opium is ready for harvest.
Another way to tell when the seed bulb is ready to be slit; you will see spots on the pod that look like bruising. If you scan through the last couple pages of this post you will see FDD's poppies, you can see little black "holes" that the seeds are coming out of. The black goo around these holes is the opium. The holes are natural; this would be the way the seeds spread, by flowing and traveling however from the there (air, dirt, animal, etc.) When this occurs, you can slit them and the goods will flow freely.
It shouldnt take too long for the opium to dry. After slitting the goo (ranging in color from redish, to pink, to white) will eventually harden up after meeting with the air. ( A faster dry can be attained through pointing a small fan at the slit pods if indoors). As the opium dries, it will blacken, or brown-en haha. It can then be gathered (through scraping off the pod with a dull object) and rolled into balls for storage. Its a very workable medium, make some shapes out of it, be creative.
Hope this helps with anyone wanting to know such information. I'm not advocating its use; merely educating those who it.
NOTE: It is important when slitting the pods not to pierce the inside of the pod wall. The cut should barely break the skin, maybe a millimeter deep. If the interior wall is broken, your opium will ooze inside the pod. It can still be smoked, but the addition of the seeds will make it much more harsh a smoke.
You're poppies will grow and eventually flower. The petals will fall off shortly after, about a week or a little longer. When the petals fall off the flower, there should be a small pod remaining in the center. This is the not-yet-fully-grown seed pod. Let this pod grow, and it will quickly and in a grand scale. The seed pod will grow into a large, green, bulb. This bulb will "frost" over, or appear a lighter green in time, this is said to be when the opium is ready for harvest.
Another way to tell when the seed bulb is ready to be slit; you will see spots on the pod that look like bruising. If you scan through the last couple pages of this post you will see FDD's poppies, you can see little black "holes" that the seeds are coming out of. The black goo around these holes is the opium. The holes are natural; this would be the way the seeds spread, by flowing and traveling however from the there (air, dirt, animal, etc.) When this occurs, you can slit them and the goods will flow freely.
It shouldnt take too long for the opium to dry. After slitting the goo (ranging in color from redish, to pink, to white) will eventually harden up after meeting with the air. ( A faster dry can be attained through pointing a small fan at the slit pods if indoors). As the opium dries, it will blacken, or brown-en haha. It can then be gathered (through scraping off the pod with a dull object) and rolled into balls for storage. Its a very workable medium, make some shapes out of it, be creative.
Hope this helps with anyone wanting to know such information. I'm not advocating its use; merely educating those who it.
NOTE: It is important when slitting the pods not to pierce the inside of the pod wall. The cut should barely break the skin, maybe a millimeter deep. If the interior wall is broken, your opium will ooze inside the pod. It can still be smoked, but the addition of the seeds will make it much more harsh a smoke.
kochab
New Member
why wait seem old enough to myself.....When im old i am going to grow my own as medicine
natmoon
Well-Known Member
Im certainly older than you thats for sure
Rope Smoker
Well-Known Member
So you can buy seeds at the grocery store? are they the right kind to get opium from?
peace man