Another thing I found with clf's in the past is that the number of bulbs contrubutes to heat more than higher wattage. IE it seems that a 14w cfl gets as hot as a 23w. So it would make more sense that my 5 105 watt bulbs will run cooler than say 23 x 23watt bulbs. I would also think that is why your 7 23 watt bulbs are giving you heat problems as supposed to adding another 2 125w?
Is a CFL cabinet @ 525w (actual) 30,000 lumen in a 18"x22" cabinet too many lumen?
- Thread starter jusblazed
- Start date
Catchin22
Well-Known Member
If you take 1 CFL @ 26w and light up a pitch black area outside and measure that area, then take 2 and do the same what happens? How about after enough to equal up 400W? How much further does the light extend? Now take 1 single 400W HPS and what happens? I can promise you, much further light penetration. 400w of CFL is NOT going to give you the same penetration as 400w of an HPS. If you were to measure the power via a photocell created by 1 26w CFL it will be nearly the same as 2, or 3. There's a reason why HPS preforms better, produces better denser nugs in higher quantity over CFLs...
electronug
Active Member
No, my 125W bulbs are WAY hotter than my 23W or even my 42W.
Just finished adding a larger inline fan from homedepot. The cabinet has a main large grow chamber, that is then vented into a smaller top "vent chamber" with the home depot inline fan/duct booster rated at 80cfm (the whole cabinet is only 8cfm so it should vent out 10x a minute keeping the temps down I hope). The top chamber will have a negative ion generator in it that will flow out of a 4" hole capped with a static charged carbon filter element. So far testing without the negative ions (waiting for the mail), the carbon filter element does an amazing job of filtering out the hefty smell of dryer sheets when they are sealed within the grow chamber. I just hope it wont kill the flow too much. If it does I will add another top vent and filter until the pressure in, is equal to pressure out.
this: cut to size http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ12kx/R-100011568/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 flows real nice. The ion generator came in the post today as well. Interesting device, clears smoke in a room well, I will be interested on how much effect it will have on green smells to come. Lights came into the shop today, I am picking them up tomorrow, string them up and get some temp readings.
Lights got in, I only had a few min to play with them. 4 x 2700 and 1 x 6500. all at 105w rated on box @ 6900 lumen a piece. The bulbs are spiral and a little larger than spec out on their website. total lumen: 34,500 @ 525w. I plugged 3 in to see what temps would be without any vent on, just open ports. The temps stayed at 72 over a 15 minute period. I am going to hook all 5 up with the vent running for a few hrs tonight to get a steady temp baseline before I throw the clones in there to reduce shock/stress. I will then let the clones root @ 20on/4 off for 5-7 days then switch to 12/12. The clones at my dispensary are all over 4 nodes high. So I hope that will be enough veg. time for good yield in a tight space.
I cant decide. 4 smaller plants in 4 x 6" pots or 2 larger plants in 2 x 12" pots? I am aiming for a couple oz... Think it can be done? Tips? I was thinking of LST but the veg time is too long. I am not sure about topping. Is it too much stress on a rooting clone to top? Will it stunt or slow growth? THANKS!
Also for soil I plan on "Black Gold" or Foxfarm if I can get it and a half/half mix of pearlite. Nutes will be a start of Superthrive mixed in 1 drop to a gallon. Supplemented with a small 1/4-1/8 strength veg. formula for the rooting/veg state. Then followed up @ 12/12 with another hit of superthrive, and added basic bloom formula started at 25% boosted throughout to 75% then followed with a week long flush to finish.
I was going to try the wick system by adding a lower tupperwear res. for the pots to sit on and 3/8" rope for the wick, but I cant find enough info, just a really crappy MS paint diagram posted over and over with no specifics on nutrients or success rates....
I cant decide. 4 smaller plants in 4 x 6" pots or 2 larger plants in 2 x 12" pots? I am aiming for a couple oz... Think it can be done? Tips? I was thinking of LST but the veg time is too long. I am not sure about topping. Is it too much stress on a rooting clone to top? Will it stunt or slow growth? THANKS!
Also for soil I plan on "Black Gold" or Foxfarm if I can get it and a half/half mix of pearlite. Nutes will be a start of Superthrive mixed in 1 drop to a gallon. Supplemented with a small 1/4-1/8 strength veg. formula for the rooting/veg state. Then followed up @ 12/12 with another hit of superthrive, and added basic bloom formula started at 25% boosted throughout to 75% then followed with a week long flush to finish.
I was going to try the wick system by adding a lower tupperwear res. for the pots to sit on and 3/8" rope for the wick, but I cant find enough info, just a really crappy MS paint diagram posted over and over with no specifics on nutrients or success rates....
Rottedroots
Well-Known Member
All I know is that the four plants I have growing at just over 500 actual watts of CFL's are doing very well!! I might even be able to burn one down when I'm done.
However the first chance I get I'm gonna get myself a 400 or 600 watt HID set-up with and HPS bulb and a MH bulb as well as a bunch of other wallet emptying chit. . I guess I don't understand why it is or isn't an improvement but wtf I'm hoping it qualifies as an up grade.
I will say blaze that you are wise making sure your temps are solid before introducing your babies. I was surprised at how much heat the cool burning CFL's through off. Took me to PC fans sucking out and one sucking in. Temps still suck the dirty SOB's so I'm grateful they are a tough weed. Good luck
However the first chance I get I'm gonna get myself a 400 or 600 watt HID set-up with and HPS bulb and a MH bulb as well as a bunch of other wallet emptying chit. . I guess I don't understand why it is or isn't an improvement but wtf I'm hoping it qualifies as an up grade.
I will say blaze that you are wise making sure your temps are solid before introducing your babies. I was surprised at how much heat the cool burning CFL's through off. Took me to PC fans sucking out and one sucking in. Temps still suck the dirty SOB's so I'm grateful they are a tough weed. Good luck
Catchin22
Well-Known Member
Yeah after a few hundred watts of CFL it is not worth it. I just picked up one of these:All I know is that the four plants I have growing at just over 500 actual watts of CFL's are doing very well!! I might even be able to burn one down when I'm done.
However the first chance I get I'm gonna get myself a 400 or 600 watt HID set-up with and HPS bulb and a MH bulb as well as a bunch of other wallet emptying chit. . I guess I don't understand why it is or isn't an improvement but wtf I'm hoping it qualifies as an up grade.
I will say blaze that you are wise making sure your temps are solid before introducing your babies. I was surprised at how much heat the cool burning CFL's through off. Took me to PC fans sucking out and one sucking in. Temps still suck the dirty SOB's so I'm grateful they are a tough weed. Good luck
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003810CVA/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=jbe04-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B003810CVA
400w HPS & it includes the MH bulb! For under $150 that is the best deal around IMO. Though time will tell how reliable it is, reviews are a bit mixed.
sso
Well-Known Member
even though, lights do combine in intensity.
that is. 1400 lumens plus 1400 lumens does equal 2800 lumens.
you still have 2800 lumens that dont extend too far from the bulb. (the Actual intensity (power) of the light, does not increase)
even when you have higher wattage cfls (which do get less efficient the bigger they go, the 26w one is actually the most efficient by all the numbers ive seen.while the hps tops out at 600w and starts to degrade in efficiency after that.)
you still dont have that much room to play with.
plus, alot more of the cfl´s spectrum is usable. its very green. usually spiking in green or around it (the biggest spike)(green is the color we see best and cfls are designed with that in mind)
even when you buy aquarium cfls or something designed for plants, the price is often excessive and not that much of an improvement.
that being said. cfls have their place.
if i only need the occasional smoke, something on the weekends, i might go with cfls.
unless i had easy access to 70-150w hps.
though id probably supplement them with a 6500k 26w clf or 2, for a fuller light spectrum. (wouldnt use more and not really with even bigger hps, more blue in flowering just = more leaves, though a bit is useful for healthier plants.)
that is. 1400 lumens plus 1400 lumens does equal 2800 lumens.
you still have 2800 lumens that dont extend too far from the bulb. (the Actual intensity (power) of the light, does not increase)
even when you have higher wattage cfls (which do get less efficient the bigger they go, the 26w one is actually the most efficient by all the numbers ive seen.while the hps tops out at 600w and starts to degrade in efficiency after that.)
you still dont have that much room to play with.
plus, alot more of the cfl´s spectrum is usable. its very green. usually spiking in green or around it (the biggest spike)(green is the color we see best and cfls are designed with that in mind)
even when you buy aquarium cfls or something designed for plants, the price is often excessive and not that much of an improvement.
that being said. cfls have their place.
if i only need the occasional smoke, something on the weekends, i might go with cfls.
unless i had easy access to 70-150w hps.
though id probably supplement them with a 6500k 26w clf or 2, for a fuller light spectrum. (wouldnt use more and not really with even bigger hps, more blue in flowering just = more leaves, though a bit is useful for healthier plants.)
OldGrowAddict
Member
Yes, the 400W HPS will "penetrate" a longer distance, but only because it has more lumens at the STARTING POINT (the bulb), which means it has more lumens longer away too.
Simply said: Lumens will fade VERY quickly by distance:
every doubling of the distance reduces lumens with 1/4!
(that is a LOT, think about it how much that is, and how small distances we are talking about)
A CFL has low lumens even at the starting point (bulb), and laws of physics apply here too, so a CFL bulb gets weaker by distance more than HPS - but only because is has a shitty starting-point-lumen compared to HID.
This is the reason HPS penetrates better, lumens (intensity) is starting high at the bulb - so high that even a 1/4-reduction every doubling of distance doesn't matter as much as with CFL's.
CFL might give good results, but that is only because you keep them very close to the plants at all times during all months.
scroglodyte
Well-Known Member
a box that size will become an oven, with those bulbs in there
Rottedroots
Well-Known Member
My box with the same number of watts As well as the same dimensions did get pretty warm. It required a bit more tweaking but an oven it was not. Just have to balance out the sucking and blowing.
So I got 4 hung up via 2 x2 bulb splitters (the 45 degree angle ones) and I gotta say the angular v is not the best for the heat dissipation. I am pulling anywhere from 84 to 90 degrees (too hot) depending on configuration. I will definitively need to use more filter screen area/opening, as it was cutting flow too much with just a 4" hole. I added a total of 3 holes, flow is ok, but I might just do the whole back panel of the top compartment. I am going to get a plank tomorrow and screw the sockets parallel to one another so all the air will go up through the bulbs/ballasts, a more even light spread, and a few more inches in height. Will report back tomorrow...
glockdoc
Well-Known Member
fuck what the people say. use cfl, in the future do a hps run if u want. ur bud wont be as big as a bud from hps but it will be as dense. when i grew with cfls i liked my result. matter of fact i had a buddy who does big ass grows with numerous dual bulb 600w hid come and check out my shit he was so impressed with the results of cfl. so impressed he was shocked and said its a must for him with a smaller grow. do what you gotta do bro, its ur grow not theres. if people insist on you using hid tell them to buy it for you. and then u need ventilation for just the bulb nvm ur grow room...shit adds up fast and large cuz the shit aint cheap. on my last grow my temps weee pushin the same numbers even 100 sometimes and my plant did fine. co2 helps the plant withstand some heat so incorporate it in ur grow. then show these hid riders that u can pull a qp with cfls of quality dense buds.
The box is sealed up pretty well, so I think I can rig a poor mans co2 system, and my girl can make some bread lol. I think Ill be able to get her into the 84 steady range after I finish rigging the lights to individual sockets and mount them horizontal. We shall see! I had success with CFL's in the past with the quality being top notch but the quantity not quite there netting about 1/4 per single cola plant (6 plants) flowered after 4th node under a teepee of 4x 4ft. double tube t8's and 1x 45w cfl 2x 23w. So I hope that by adding double the lumen output of this rig, it will out do the last micro I did... If I can pull 1oz a plant I would be happy! Think that is doable?
Rottedroots
Well-Known Member
blaze im working with 500watts as well over four nicely shaped plants. I would be more than thrilled to get an oz off of each plant. I'm not willing to set my sights quite yet. What your thoughts? ?
Rottedroots
Well-Known Member
What are you expecting to gain from your "poor man's" CO2 producer? Just curious. You think you are lacking good fresh sweet air for the girls. As important as breathing is I would be surprized if there was a tangible improvement.
Let me know what you come up with. I may be a little bit of a sceptic but if it works I will follow. Rock On my friend and remember No Guts No Glory!!!
Let me know what you come up with. I may be a little bit of a sceptic but if it works I will follow. Rock On my friend and remember No Guts No Glory!!!