Grow Room From Scratch?

[Swisher Sweet]

OK so I have the opportunity to build a grow room from the ground up with constraints being as follow: Stand alone 12X16 building (all usable)-want to keep costs under control but would rather build with quality equipment and add as I go. In other words I want to begin with base needs (lights,fans,heat,venting,appropriate wall covering etc.). So the question is if two scenarios are being considered lightring with 1000's or 600's how many (I have an idea but would like other opinions) will I need for this space if it is broken into three rooms (veg (6'x6'), flower (6'x6'), dark/drying/supplies (4'x12'). What will be the best way to vent it (I have the ability to punch a whole any where I want)? Wall covering's I have always used flat white but am open to any recommendations? I know in time I can add to the room co2, humidifier etc. etc. but just want to get a solid base environment to start with. Any other recommendations would be appreciated! Thanks in advance.

My Bad Room sizes : Drying 4x12 veg 6x12 flower 6x12

Oh yea electrical. Should I run 120 and 240?

 

[Dubdeuce]

Should you run 120 and 240?

Yes! If you can EVER use a piece of equipment at 240 you should. It only uses half the amperage on your circuit that a 120 does essentially doubling the amount of power you can run through a circuit, but 120s are completely necessary due to the number of consumer products available at this voltage.

I would look into running a few 240 plugs and looking into a powerbox. Check out the DPC-7500 powerbox. They have 240/120 combos, or straight 240, or straight 120 units. They have a ton of models though and surely something that fits your needs.

Wall Coverings
You have 3 choices. Paint bright white. Mylar. or white Vinyl Sheet like polyfilm.

Venting
The best way to vent hot air is where the hot air is. Hot air rises and so if you are just using a standard exhaust fan with a hole to exhaust warm air from the environment then place the hole as close to the roof as you can really. If you are talking about venting lights, then you would want the holes closest to the horizontal line where your lights will most likely be at, or at least somewhere in that neighborhood.

Lighting
I would recommend 600's over 1000's just because the sheer amount of heat that 1000's put out. I'm assuming your structure doesn't have a/c so correct me if I'm wrong. I've been doing side by side comparisons of dual 600's against single 1000's on movers and even just in PAR/heat testing, the 600's outperform the 1000 without generating as much heat.

 

[phillipchristian]

Hey Swisher, stop by my Grow Room Floor Plans thread that is in my signature. I'll design something for you.

Lighting depends on room footprint and ceiling height. 6x6 will be an odd shaped room. If you are growing in the entire space and don't need any room to walk around or open the door then you will have an unven light spread with almost any wattage combination unless you went with 4 x 400w ballasts. Gotta know exactly how tall the ceilings are and how much of the space ill actually have plants to make a fair recommendation.

Whether or not to use 120v or 240v really depends on how many ballasts you have etc... If you have 1-2 in flowers and 1 in veg with some CFL's or a T5 for clones then you'll be fine using 120v. Chances are you are going to need 120v anyway for all of the other equipment. If anything you bring in a 240v subpanel of the main loadcenter and then wire out from there. Cost you about $200 if you can do it yourself. I can help with this.

If you are going to build a permanent room then do yourself a favor. Frame out the walls 16" between studs; lay CDX plywood over them, run the electrical, and then line the inside walls with duct insulation wrap. You will not be dissappointed. Better insulation, actual place to hang things, no exposed wiring, and no worries about tearing the plastic.

Venting will depend on the available options around the space. Are there exterior wall or windows you can vent out of; is their an attic above the space; etc...

 

[Rottencrotch]

600s are the most efficient, and I'm starting to suspect that almost everybody over-lights (including me until very recently). I would go with two 600w HPS and a 400w ceramic metal halide (I'm probably risking some serious hater fallout with that suggestion, but my plants [particularly the Super Silver Haze] think CMHs are tight butthole) and some 4' T5 strips (54w ea.) scattered throughout to provide an environment with multiple, diverse light sources. I find this helps in particular when you are growing larger, or standalone plants, since their very size can block overhead light all too effectively.

It would be nice if you could partition off a veg area, but if you grow smaller plants, this area can be the size of a small closet. This could be constructed pretty cheaply with a thin wooden frame and panda film (thick plastic film with black on one side, white on the other--I think it's also called poly film?) which is what I would also line the walls with. For veg, CMHs work great, but plants love the T5s, too. You can grow some lovely shit under an 8-bulb T5 light, although a lot of people switch at least half the bulbs to 3000K red bulbs when flower starts, so that's an additional expense to keep in mind.

You'll probably need an 8" fan with ducting running outside (preferably up high so heat is vented) attached to a carbon filter during flower, if the building isn't isolated. An oscillating fan is a must, although multiple stationary fans can also work. Air movement is important! Especially if you're in a high humidity area like I am--battling PM every day is fucking bullshit.

Remember that electricity isn't nearly as expensive as the end product is, but "watts is weight" is definitely overdone a lot of times. I find that once each (large) plant has about 150w-200w of light apiece, you're probably going to start getting diminishing returns with additional energy investment (depending on your strain). In my high-humidity situation, I think that the extra amperage on the breaker is better utilized running a dehumidifier most of the day, so consider how many usable amps you have before you start buying lights.

Anyway, it feels like I'm rambling now, so I'd better have a safety meeting to take care of that. Peace out, best of luck, hope it all turns out well.

 

[Gastanker]

3 room 16x12 with 600w lights over 3x6 tables. What kind of wattage were you thinking of running? AC? CO2?

 

[Gr0wGreen]

you will need a real AC come summer in that place. not one of the shitty plastic 12,000 BTU but a real AC. standalone buildings are known to get sweltering.

 

[Gastanker]

Sealed with CO2, a scrubber, and an AC unit:

 

[Swisher Sweet]

Hey Swisher, stop by my Grow Room Floor Plans thread that is in my signature. I'll design something for you.

Lighting depends on room footprint and ceiling height. 6x6 will be an odd shaped room. If you are growing in the entire space and don't need any room to walk around or open the door then you will have an unven light spread with almost any wattage combination unless you went with 4 x 400w ballasts. Gotta know exactly how tall the ceilings are and how much of the space ill actually have plants to make a fair recommendation.

Whether or not to use 120v or 240v really depends on how many ballasts you have etc... If you have 1-2 in flowers and 1 in veg with some CFL's or a T5 for clones then you'll be fine using 120v. Chances are you are going to need 120v anyway for all of the other equipment. If anything you bring in a 240v subpanel of the main loadcenter and then wire out from there. Cost you about $200 if you can do it yourself. I can help with this.

If you are going to build a permanent room then do yourself a favor. Frame out the walls 16" between studs; lay CDX plywood over them, run the electrical, and then line the inside walls with duct insulation wrap. You will not be dissappointed. Better insulation, actual place to hang things, no exposed wiring, and no worries about tearing the plastic.

Venting will depend on the available options around the space. Are there exterior wall or windows you can vent out of; is their an attic above the space; etc...

So much info to digest. OK. In the next month I will be designing. Again as I expressed money is important but I'd rather put it together right (RELATIVELY) at the risk of slowing down the actual grow. What I have is this. A prefab building 12'x16'x8'. Three rooms from this space (veg, flower, dark/drying/clone cabinet). I can place doors where I want an windows (if I want them). I thought I would do a venting system in each individual room (high-out, low-intake). The whole buildings devoted! I broke it up the way I did because I thought it most efficient. I can put walls and doors where I want. Oh, by the way The veg and flower rooms were 6'x12'x8'. The dark/dry room was 4'x12'x8'. Maybe this is not the best use? I've already decided to run both 120/240. I thought I would use new 600's or 1000'sinitially. I thought it would take 2 600' sin each room to maximize coverage.I think 1 1000 is not enough and 2 are too much. The space will be full of plants (dedicated space)

 

[phillipchristian]

I think your flower room could be bigger then your veg room. You will have moms, clones, and vegging plants in there but you still don't need the same amount of space. How big are you growing your plants? How tall and how wide and how many in flower? That's really the deciding factor on how to layout your space and lighting.

 

[Swisher Sweet]

I think your flower room could be bigger then your veg room. You will have moms, clones, and vegging plants in there but you still don't need the same amount of space. How big are you growing your plants? How tall and how wide and how many in flower? That's really the deciding factor on how to layout your space and lighting.

Ok. So I can grow 45 total at one time ( clones,veg and flower) .3-4 ft but haven't vegged them longer because of height restrictions. Oh yea 2 feet wide.Thanks in advance.

 

[Swisher Sweet]

3 room 16x12 with 600w lights over 3x6 tables. What kind of wattage were you thinking of running? AC? CO2?

Decided on 600's.Know I am going to need AC but I live in a marine climate that rarely gets above 75-80 so I think I won't need it until July. One step at a time. Goal is to establish quality environment with quality equipment to begin initial grow. Will add co2, AC and scrubber over the next several months. Looks like a efficient setup.Thing is I am a legal to grow 45 plants. That includes clones (rooted, veg and flower. Ta first I thought your method would not maximize yields. But, in looking at it looking at the complete growth of plants at all stages it would.

 

[Gastanker]

Was just throwing up one idea while working on my CAD skills. With 45 plants in a continuous grow with 4 flowering lights I personally would recommend just 4 of 5 plants per light. 16-25 flowering plants at a time, another 16 in veg and then a few mothers.

The veg room shouldn't need to be anywhere as large as the flower room as the plants will only need a maximum of ~4weeks veg and being at four different stages in maturation, most will take up very little room. Would be easy to put in a shelf or two as well with some T5s over them for clones in the veg area.

Toss me some ideas and I'll draw them up. No desk? Another light/table? No sealed room? Right now it's drawn up to pull air from outside, pass them through the hoods, and vent back outside - no air exchange between indoors and outdoors which maximizes AC and CO2 use. I could draw it up with the room being vented through a scrubber versus the scrubber just recirculating room air...

 

[phillipchristian]

If you do 24 in flower, 12 in veg, and 12 clones on a perpetual cycle you are going to need a larger space if you plan on growing them 2' wide. Do you LST and TOP them to be that bushy? You said 3-4' tall, if you are just topping them then they won't be that wide. What king of a/c are you putting in? Minisplit, window unit? Will you need a dehumidifier? Are you venting the lights with air from outside or from in the room and then exhausting it outside? How many moms and what kind of lighting for them?

 

[Swisher Sweet]

Was just throwing up one idea while working on my CAD skills. With 45 plants in a continuous grow with 4 flowering lights I personally would recommend just 4 of 5 plants per light. 16-25 flowering plants at a time, another 16 in veg and then a few mothers.

The veg room shouldn't need to be anywhere as large as the flower room as the plants will only need a maximum of ~4weeks veg and being at four different stages in maturation, most will take up very little room. Would be easy to put in a shelf or two as well with some T5s over them for clones in the veg area.

Definotely need somework space

Toss me some ideas and I'll draw them up. No desk? Another light/table? No sealed room? Right now it's drawn up to pull air from outside, pass them through the hoods, and vent back outside - no air exchange between indoors and outdoors which maximizes AC and CO2 use. I could draw it up with the room being vented through a scrubber versus the scrubber just recirculating room air...

45 mqx including rooting clones.This is good I appreciate your input and CAD skills I have none so I see the advantage. Ineed ork space I know peopleforget about that. However, not much as I can work in tight spaces when to my advantage. Don't need it to be the penthouse at the Ritz. Mostly, a working operation that make sense. I see the exhaust you propose. I may need to vent from the top/bottom until I can move forward with the ideal venting/odor system but I want to do that in a way that takes advantage of the venting system I started with (High-out, Low-In). I am devoted to my out come so I spend alot of time daily but I would like the initial setup to allow me to make further changes easily and inexpensively (relativly).

 

[Swisher Sweet]

If you do 24 in flower, 12 in veg, and 12 clones on a perpetual cycle you are going to need a larger space if you plan on growing them 2' wide. Do you LST and TOP them to be that bushy? You said 3-4' tall, if you are just topping them then they won't be that wide. What king of a/c are you putting in? Minisplit, window unit? Will you need a dehumidifier? Are you venting the lights with air from outside or from in the room and then exhausting it outside? How many moms and what kind of lighting for them?

Ok. Have 5 strains may only keep 4 (Moms at 400 MH). I grow primarily Indica with 2' probably not accurate (maybe 1.25'- 1.5'). I sometimes will take the main cola and continue in flower as 3 of my strains produce one large Cola. I am interested in learning the LST and Sgrog method however. AC won' tbe needed until July but the building can be built with no windows/or windows. Don't need a humidifier now but will add if needed (Humidity in my region 45-60). Venting the lights from in the room initially but eventually will upgrade ! Thanks in advance.

 

[Gastanker]

High out low in is great for a house where you're pulling from a basement or understory and exhausting the hotter air, but for a detached building outdoor ambient temp is outdoor ambient temp, there is no degrations between hot and cold as you increase in height. You're far better off with at least sealing the lights from the rest of the enclosure. If you want to vent the room in addition instead of AC that's understandable but I'd recommend adding an additional fan for that versus venting through your lights - essentially the ony change would be attaching the fan/filter to some ducting leading outside. Negative pressure around the door will likely be enough of an inlet.

 

[Swisher Sweet]

High out low in is great for a house where you're pulling from a basement or understory and exhausting the hotter air, but for a detached building ambient temp is ambient temp. You're far better off with at least sealing the lights from the rest of the enclosure. If you want to vent the room in addition instead of AC that's understandable but I'd recommend adding an additional fan for that versus venting through your lights - essentially the ony change would be attaching the fan/filter to some ducting leading outside. Negative pressure around the door will likely be enough of an inlet.

Definitely will add AC just won't need it until July (more I think about it May). Live right on the water and temp rarely over 75. I know with the lights I will need AC! Will add. Or maybe it makes sense to vent throught the lights. I want to look long term (AC) or venting through the lights and the actual expense to do both. I wonder which makes better sense-probably AC vs. venting each light. Thanks in advance.

 

[Gastanker]

So your outdoor temps will always be lower than indoor temps unless you are running AC. Here your lights are sealed off from the room pulling outdoor (cooler) air and exhausting back outdoors. You also would have a fan pulling through your carbon filter pushing room air outside which in turn will draw fresh air indoors.

When it gets hot stop exhausting outdoors and turn the AC on + CO2.

 

[Swisher Sweet]

So your outdoor temps will always be lower than indoor temps unless you are running AC. Here your lights are sealed off from the room pulling outdoor (cooler) air and exhausting back outdoors. You also would have a fan pulling through your carbon filter pushing room air outside which in turn will draw fresh air indoors.

When it gets hot plug stop exhausting outdoors and turn the AC on + CO2.

What do you think ballpark expense would be on such a system excluding the lights (I am assuming I have to get the vented hood 600's to make it work). So, I guess I can get it priced. I'll need the co2 filter, ducting, AC, scrubber and 600's (4). Anything else?

 

[Gastanker]

How are you growing? Soil? Hydro? You'll need building supplies like 2x4s as well as ventilation fans, trays, tables, cloning material, domes,... There are countless small things you need i guess.Ball park for you to do it yourself? FOr someone else to do it for you? On the cheap? According to code?