CSI humboldt thread

GWilliamsCannabis said:

Great explanation...but then are we getting ripped off paying 100+ for 6 fem s1s?

When we could be spending 100 or so on a pack of 10+ regs that are already hunted; worked and stabilized??

Why are S1s more expensive when you're more likely to find trash?

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Well there is more work involved with making fem seeds. Not to mention that most reversals don't make as much pollen and even then it may not be viable and you have spent both time and resources. The TK was notoriously hard to reverse. The pay off, as Spindlee818 said, is that while there is a chance to find a turd, there is also the chance of finding something truly special, ie high ceiling low floor. It seems to me at the moment you would do best with growing his hybrids. I would say they are all at least pretty solid. Good luck.

GWilliamsCannabis said:

Great explanation...but then are we getting ripped off paying 100+ for 6 fem s1s?

When we could be spending 100 or so on a pack of 10+ regs that are already hunted; worked and stabilized??

Why are S1s more expensive when you're more likely to find trash?

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I think the answer to that is a more complicated answer than just a yes or a no. I think it really boils down to what you're end goal is. If your someone who is growing for personal use and just wants to have some great smoke in a few months, I'd say that your best bet would be to go with a cross of the genetics that you like with something that would compliment it. However, if your someone who has clients that are willing to pay, then it might be worth it to you to go through that hunt. Pure genetics are, most of the times, worth more/more desirable to the end user. Remember big legal grows buy these seeds too. And finally there are many people who absolutely love the hunt, and when they find that keeper it's like panning for gold and finding a huge gold nugget!
To be fair too, how many rooms have u filled with plants that there are a few that just look weird or grow weird, even when they are clones!. So if u have a tent with 10 girls and 3 are mutants, you just cull those and stretch out the other 7. No big deal.

kwigybo88 said:

Two reasons. First reversals are not easy. And secondly, not everyone has access to elite cuts. S1's produce some plants which are almost identical or better than the elite cut without being further polluted by other gene pools.

Personally I think S1 packs should contain 15+ seeds.

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Can you name a lot of S1's that are superior to their mother plant? For as many varieties as have been s1'd. There's very few examples to show that the S1 progeny are superior plants for the grower.

originalphenohunters said:

Can you name a lot of S1's that are superior to their mother plant? For as many varieties as have been s1'd. There's very few examples to show that the S1 progeny are superior plants for the grower.

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I grew Wedding Cake S1's and found a gem but I dont have jbeezy's cut to compare it to. CSI has stated his Bombthreat is better than the Bubba Kush mother cut and tests about 10% higher thc, if that counts for anything. He also says he's found TK S1's that are better. Chem D as well. And several others.

If you grow enough seeds I dont think it's possible to NOT find a better plant than the mother. Just doesnt make biological sense to me.

kwigybo88 said:

If you grow enough seeds I dont think it's possible to NOT find a better plant than the mother. Just doesnt make biological sense to me.

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I think you hit the nail on the head. Like Bohdi says, plant more seeds

kwigybo88 said:

I grew Wedding Cake S1's and found a gem but I dont have jbeezy's cut to compare it to. CSI has stated his Bombthreat is better than the Bubba Kush mother cut and tests about 10% higher thc, if that counts for anything. He also says he's found TK S1's that are better. Chem D as well. And several others.

If you grow enough seeds I dont think it's possible to NOT find a better plant than the mother. Just doesnt make biological sense to me.

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Bomb threat has better taste but the plant is absolute trash to grow. Slow, weak branches, and tiny yield. I've yet to see any Chem D or TK S1 clones that have been named and circulated as better than the original. It's not that it's not possible, it's just statistically not in your favor in such an inbred s1 "breeding"

originalphenohunters said:

Bomb threat has better taste but the plant is absolute trash to grow. Slow, weak branches, and tiny yield. I've yet to see any Chem D or TK S1 clones that have been named and circulated as better than the original. It's not that it's not possible, it's just statistically not in your favor in such an inbred s1 "breeding"

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Bubba is a trash plant to grow to begin with and yields shit anyway. If its more potent and tastes better, thats an improvement afaic.

How exactly is an S1 going to circulate better than two of the best cultivars in the history of cannabis which have been around for 20+ years? Theyre simply not different enough to gain traction and mass appeal over their super well-known progenitors. Nobody except real purists are getting excited over "oh its like chem d but better."

kwigybo88 said:

Bubba is a trash plant to grow to begin with and yields shit anyway. If its more potent and tastes better, thats an improvement afaic.

How exactly is an S1 going to circulate better than two of the best cultivars in the history of cannabis which have been around for 20+ years? Theyre simply not different enough to gain traction and mass appeal over their super well-known progenitors. Nobody except real purists are getting excited over "oh its like chem d but better."

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Lol. Bubba is twice as vigorous, holds itself up, and will yield plenty well with a good grower at the helm. Chem D and TK, while hyped, are not as good as everyone makes them out to be. But they are nice productive plants. If they were so called best varieties of the last 20 years, then why can't you find TK or Chem D flowers grown well in any market? They're rare at best which doesn't really coincide with "best in the market". Again, show me people that have superior S1's of any mentioned clones. You won't because it's statistically difficult to find consistently better plants in S1 stock unless the S1 parent is extremely stable. In the case of most bagseed finds, they're anything but stabilized.

originalphenohunters said:

Lol. Bubba is twice as vigorous, holds itself up, and will yield plenty well with a good grower at the helm. Chem D and TK, while hyped, are not as good as everyone makes them out to be. But they are nice productive plants. If they were so called best varieties of the last 20 years, then why can't you find TK or Chem D flowers grown well in any market? They're rare at best which doesn't really coincide with "best in the market". Again, show me people that have superior S1's of any mentioned clones. You won't because it's statistically difficult to find consistently better plants in S1 stock unless the S1 parent is extremely stable. In the case of most bagseed finds, they're anything but stabilized.

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Because they dont have the bag appeal or colours that the modern market is obsessed with. Both better than Dosido tho. Whats your thoughts on ogkb being an S1, just out of curiosity?

originalphenohunters said:

Can you name a lot of S1's that are superior to their mother plant? For as many varieties as have been s1'd. There's very few examples to show that the S1 progeny are superior plants for the grower.

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Triangle ain’t in my top 5!og kush types, but I’ve found multiple in the s1’s that I prefer

originalphenohunters said:

Chem D and TK, while hyped, are not as good as everyone makes them out to be

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glad im not the only one who feels this way

I think OG in general is extremely overrated(mainly by people on the west coast) and I prefer Chem 91 and Chem 4 over Chem D anyday

originalphenohunters said:

Can you name a lot of S1's that are superior to their mother plant? For as many varieties as have been s1'd. There's very few examples to show that the S1 progeny are superior plants for the grower.

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Most people that find a keeper that is better than the original parent will just market her as the original strain. Keep in mind "better" is also subjective. For example, maybe u live in a humid climate where PM and mold are a issue. You might find a an S1 that is more resistant than her to PM and mold. Maybe she yields less or isn't as strong, but has better terps. For your situation this might be "better". Also breeders will hunt for a stud to create a breeding line from. But one of the main reasons Caleb creates so many S1 strains so to preserve the genetics since so many have been lost over the years.

Zipz55 said:

glad im not the only one who feels this way

I think OG in general is extremely overrated(mainly by people on the west coast) and I prefer Chem 91 and Chem 4 over Chem D anyday

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On the West Coast we call that rapper weed. Alot of hype, but I would argue cakes are even more popular these days gelato, runtz, kush cake.

Zipz55 said:

glad im not the only one who feels this way

I think OG in general is extremely overrated(mainly by people on the west coast) and I prefer Chem 91 and Chem 4 over Chem D anyday

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If you are looking for narcotic potency the D and a good og are hard to beat

TK cut has the flavor potency but its as fickle as they come, Scraggly half dead looking viney thing. Doesnt like warm/humid climates either.

originalphenohunters said:

Lol. Bubba is twice as vigorous, holds itself up, and will yield plenty well with a good grower at the helm. Chem D and TK, while hyped, are not as good as everyone makes them out to be. But they are nice productive plants. If they were so called best varieties of the last 20 years, then why can't you find TK or Chem D flowers grown well in any market? They're rare at best which doesn't really coincide with "best in the market". Again, show me people that have superior S1's of any mentioned clones. You won't because it's statistically difficult to find consistently better plants in S1 stock unless the S1 parent is extremely stable. In the case of most bagseed finds, they're anything but stabilized.

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Because the market is trash and most people don't know what they're doing.

I don't have a dog in the race, but using the market as the bar for what's good is like saying the top 100 on Spotify is the best music out right now.

Properly grown Og/Sour/Diesel/Chem/Kush is the best weed on the planet. I love haze too, but not most styles. If I enjoy anything new it’s because I can taste the Kush or OG or Sour or Diesel in it. Those skunky funky terps are queen. My favorite Hazes are the skunky ones that smell like dank chronic.The last week or so I’ve seen a lot of bs posted on this thread. Opinions and ideas that contradict my 20+ years experience with cannabis. Keepers everywhere for everyone! I guess it doesn’t have to coat your mouth and peel you back anymore to be a good plant or a keeper! Og is overrated!
I agree her and her kin (diesel, sour, chem) are hard to grow, but when they don’t look “fickle, scraggly, or viney” they are the peak of the mountain.

Zipz55 said:

glad im not the only one who feels this way

I think OG in general is extremely overrated(mainly by people on the west coast) and I prefer Chem 91 and Chem 4 over Chem D anyday

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Mrsmokestacks said:

Properly grown Og/Sour/Diesel/Chem/Kush is the best weed on the planet. I love haze too, but not most styles. If I enjoy anything new it’s because I can taste the Kush or OG or Sour or Diesel in it. Those skunky funky terps are queen. My favorite Hazes are the skunky ones that smell like dank chronic.The last week or so I’ve seen a lot of bs posted on this thread. Opinions and ideas that contradict my 20+ years experience with cannabis. Keepers everywhere for everyone! I guess it doesn’t have to coat your mouth and peel you back anymore to be a good plant or a keeper! Og is overrated!
I agree her and her kin (diesel, sour, chem) are hard to grow, but when they don’t look “fickle, scraggly, or viney” they are the peak of the mountain.

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I'm a haze man to the bitter end, but I just finished my chem seed collection (Chem fuego and Guerilla fume ordered yesterday) just to see what I'm missing, and if possible, breed it with some haze

blobbo said:

TK cut has the flavor potency but its as fickle as they come, Scraggly half dead looking viney thing. Doesnt like warm/humid climates either.

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My tk indoors is extremely vigorous, grows fast and tall and drinks like a sonofabitch. It’s viney but all real og’s are viney. 91 on the other hand… that’s a fickle gal

90% don't know what they're smoking or give 2 shits in my experience. as long as it has bag appeal and a decent high, it will work. most want to find a deal on some good smoke and move on with their life. very few actually know the difference between chem91 and chem d if you hand them a nug of each