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How was it a useful experiment? You discovered that 24h provides similar or worse results than 18h and concluded it was because of the length of day, didn't even consider that reducing DLI could have had that effect. For all you know, the DLI was too much at 24h and was just right at 18h.

So no, you haven't tested this while keeping DLI constant. Thank you for your answer. So your evidence is pretty much useless. In the future, instead of keeping your overly powerful veg lamp on for a shorter time, make a smaller veg lamp for less money. Get the same DLI.

You're confusing 2 people. I never said that was my aim nor was that reason included in any of my points.

Now you're talking about upgrading HPS to even bigger HPS makes me think you still haven't read the title of the thread. You've basically making my point. If you're worried about total production more than efficiency, just get a bigger HPS lamp. If you're going to upgrade the size of your...

When you did this, did you keep DLI constant (using a weaker lamp for 24 hour days and a stronger lamp for 18 hour days, etc). If not, the experiment was completely flawed.

Frequently you will see people post about their amazon blurples and the consensus will be that those can be used as veg lamps. If they're going to use the blurple as a veg lamp, they should probably get an HPS lamp for flowering until they have enough money to replace that shitty mars veg lamp...

Nothing is stopping people from upgrading their flowering lamp, afterwards. It's very cheap to get a 44W LED setup to replace the 100W of CFL. Why put it off? First get the 44W lamp, then get 420W worth of flowering lamp because the first 44W are a better value in initial costs.

This makes sense, unless you're using T5/T8/T12 or CFL, or even an amazon blurple for veg, then it just seems like a contradiction to act like you care about efficiency.

Why bother with LED at all? If you have a 600W HPS, why not upgrade it to a thousand watter and call it a day? (probably what I'd do in this case)

Okay I'll get to your argument now. You're saying that in michigan, you need the heat anyway so efficiency isn't a problem, right? So why would you be upgrading your flowering from HPS to LED? I think you're missing the point. The argument only applies if you're looking to upgrade flowering...

This assumption is also a given. What you're saying is true, yet irrelevant. There are people who ONLY have veg areas to flower giants outside. If you only have 1 lamp, then my argument clearly doesn't apply to you. My argument only applies IF you have a crappy veg light.

This part I'll agree with. If you have a small veg area like most growers, you'll be getting a 90% efficient driver instead of a 94% efficient one.

According to the chart Rahz likes to post, plants produce photosynthesis more efficiently at a lower ppfd. This means that if you keep DLI constant, it's more efficient to use lower ppfd for more time than higher ppfd for less time. Intuitively, this means that 24 hours is the best way to...

READ THE THREAD TITLE AGAIN. That assumption is GIVEN.

The whole point is that people are spending tons of money upgrading flowering with expensive LEDs while using shitty lamps in veg. If you're not doing that, it doesn't apply to you.

Hopeless.....

That means you have to use a more powerful lamp (more expensive) to get the same DLI as a weaker (cheaper) lamp that's on for 18 to 24 hours a day.

For example, lets say you have a 600W HPS lamp in flowering and 100W of CFL in veg. They both operate every day, flowering for 12 hours a day and veg for 24 hours a day. Assume it costs 1 dollar/W for a 50% efficient lamp to make the numbers easier. This is what you're upgrading to...

See my comment about paying off higher interest loans first even if the loan is "too small to matter". You pay it off first, period, or you have no financial sense at all. A veg lamp gets twice as much utility as a flowering lamp, thus for every watt you buy, you get double the value for your...

Excuse me, but if you have a veg area, you NEED to put a lamp over the plants. It's not an accessory. Your analogy is bad and you know it. Both a veg lamp and a flowering lamp use energy. People don't have a veg area for decoration as you suggest... It's part of producing buds or nobody...