Most difficult to clone strains

teoborg

Active Member
I've recently discovered the benefits of growing clones instead the whole plant and although my first time I've had a good score.
This season I'm growing the OG#18 and Herijuana, among others and I've read here in RIU that they both are quite difficult to clone. Is that true ?
Do some strains clone more difficult than others or even strains that can not be cloned at all?

Last time I've used the Rootit gel but this time I'm going with Clonex and instead of peat pellets ill use rapid rooters.
 

Redeye Bri

Well-Known Member
My OG strains are much more difficult to clone. The Kosher and Skywalker Kush both root much slower than anything else in my cab. I wish they didn't, because the smoke is superb. I guess it is one of those trade offs.

That being said, they CAN be cloned and I'm not sure if there is a secret or trick, but if there is I would love to know it.
 

skunkd0c

Well-Known Member
some strains take longer to clone maybe upto 20 days or so
to show roots, when most others would show roots in 10 days but this is quite rare
all strains can be cloned/rooted

if they take so long to show roots the cuttings can become quite weak during this time and do not veg so quickly once started in the grow area
all you can do is take many more clones than you need and pick the best ones that survive

the last strain i had like this was original misty from homegrown fantasy
about 5-6 years ago

peace
 

kinddiesel

Well-Known Member
ak 47 1 clone out out5 took, and nl skunk, 5 out of 6 root, outher strands I get 100 % success rate, it seams like, you will notice, idk if its just me the thicker them stem cloned from better success rate, I think that's why some strands are more picky getting roots, they have small pee wee herman stems,
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
Use fresh aloe gel or powder. 100% success rate. Clones rooted in 7-14 days even the laggers. Thickest whitest roots you ever had.

Clonex and all that other bottled shit is bad. The potassium nitrate and potassium silicate in that are very harmful longterm. Chems no good.

Rapid rooters are the best plugs Imo. Made from tree bark.. not as dense as root riots. Rooting is faster.

Click on link in my sig if you want to know how to use fresh aloe gel.

Stay frosty
 

Jogro

Well-Known Member
Some strains just take longer to root than others, and the longer it takes, the more likely you are to have problems along the way, lowering the success rate.

Not sure these are "news" or "secrets" but here's a few tips/tricks I've learned/found that seem to make a difference:

-Cuttings root faster when they're relatively young and in a rapidly growing vegetative phase. Older plants clone a little slower. Yes, it absolutely is possible to clone flowering plants, though its a little harder.

-If possible, you want to use cuttings that are thin and green. Once the stems harden and/or turn brown, cloning becomes much harder (and slower).

-Temp does matter. You want maybe 77-80F. To cold or too hot, and rooting takes longer and the success rates go down.

-Rooting compound does both reduce rot (which is the main enemy of slow cloning), and potentially increase rooting speed. If you have it, use it, and if you don't have it, its worth getting. You can buy a can of powder rooting compound at any gardening or big box store for $6-7.

-Fancy cloners are helpful, especially if you want to create a LOT of clones, but if you just want to generate a few clones you don't absolutely need them. With many strains, cloning can be as easy as dropping a cutting into a cup of water. Here's a Williams' Wonder where I did just that, 11 days later:



 

skunkd0c

Well-Known Member
Use fresh aloe gel or powder. 100% success rate. Clones rooted in 7-14 days even the laggers. Thickest whitest roots you ever had.

Clonex and all that other bottled shit is bad. The potassium nitrate and potassium silicate in that are very harmful longterm. Chems no good.

Click on link in my sig if you want to know how to use fresh aloe gel.

Stay frosty
sounds like a spam, hope they are paying you well lol
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
sounds like a spam, hope they are paying you well lol
How is that spam dumbass... Im telling you not use chemy products that cause cancer and upper respitory problems. That cost $20 a bottle when you can go buy an aloe plant for $3 at home depot and have free cloning gel for the rest of your life. It works better than that bottled crap.

Aloe powder is less work. When used in a foliar doesn't clog the sprayer. Its cheap on amazon

Aloe is one of the best things for plants. In a drench, foliar and as cloning gel. Its the ultimate turbo boost. Your plants will be praying all the time. You can even make healthy drinks with it.

I'm all about organics and sourcing everything locally. I don't use any bottled nutes ever. Thats the biggest waste of money. I spend maybe $50 every 6 months on nutes.

Do your home work before you make an Ass out of yourself next time


Stay frosty
 

teoborg

Active Member
How is that spam dumbass... Im telling you not use chemy products that cause cancer and upper respitory problems. That cost $20 a bottle when you can go buy an aloe plant for $3 at home depot and have free cloning gel for the rest of your life. It works better than that bottled crap.

Aloe powder is less work. When used in a foliar doesn't clog the sprayer. Its cheap on amazon

Aloe is one of the best things for plants. In a drench, foliar and as cloning gel. Its the ultimate turbo boost. Your plants will be praying all the time. You can even make healthy drinks with it.

I'm all about organics and sourcing everything locally. I don't use any bottled nutes ever. Thats the biggest waste of money. I spend maybe $50 every 6 months on nutes.

Do your home work before you make an Ass out of yourself next time


Stay frosty
I'm growing some aloe vera plants, so I will try it and see how it performs regarding Clonex. But how I'm suppose to take that gel from the plant?
 

Omgwtfbbq Indicaman

Well-Known Member
I had grown TGA's ace of spades and herijuana at the same time, Ace of spades took 4 days to root in rapid rooters! 4 days, fastest i'd ever seen. the herijuana took nearly 2 weeks to show the same results. i tossed the plant because i had super crystal which was basically the same thing except spacier high, same body high, better yield easy cloner.
 

Omgwtfbbq Indicaman

Well-Known Member
also, clonex being "bad" because it uses chems is your opinion, as far as i can tell, it WORKS and well i might add. juicy roots is also a good alternative.
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
also, clonex being "bad" because it uses chems is your opinion, as far as i can tell, it WORKS and well i might add. juicy roots is also a good alternative.

it does work but it is harmful. chem nutrients are harmful to people.... here is a study on the matter


National Organic Standards Board Technical Advisory Panel Review
compiled by University of California Sustainable Agriculture Research and Education Program (UC SAREP) for the USDA National Organic Program

http://www.ams.usda.gov/AMSv1.0/getf...TELPRDC5057629

 

Jogro

Well-Known Member
it does work but it is harmful. chem nutrients are harmful to people.... Its not opinion its fact
Stating that your opinion is a fact doesn't make it a fact.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but *ALL* nutrients are "chemicals" (and that IS a "fact"). Water is a "chemical", glucose is a "chemical", all proteins and carbohydrates are "chemicals" too.

National Organic Standards Board Technical Advisory Panel Review compiled by University of California Sustainable Agriculture Research and Education Program (UC SAREP) for the USDA National Organic Program
http://www.ams.usda.gov/AMSv1.0/getf...TELPRDC5057629

Did you actually read this review? Because if you have, I don't think you understood what it says.

I just looked at it, and not only does it NOT talk about "harmfulness" of synthetic nutrients to human beings, it actually concludes the exact OPPOSITE of what you suggest, namely that the particular agent its written about SHOULD be considered to be "synthetic" (rather than organic) for gardening purposes, but that its NOT harmful. Don't take my word for it, here are the direct quotes:

Potassium silicate has no known chronic hazards, and neither silica nor potassium appreciably bioconcentrate in the food chain (except with silica in the case of aquatic siliceous species). Potassium silicate contains no volatile organic compounds, and applications will not result in the release of any hazardous or environmentally persistent byproducts(Blumberg 2001).

. . .Therefore, I feel that there is no significant cause for concern over the use of potassium silicate, with regard to toxicity or contamination of the environment.

. . .With proper use and common-sense precautions, I feel that potassium silicates do not present a significant human health danger

...When used as an agricultural fertilizer or fungicide there should be no adverse effects on human health, provided standard precautions are followed to protect applicators from skin and eye exposure, and inhalation or ingestion.
So you don't want to rub this stuff. . .which is a lot like sand. . . into your eyes (duh) or breathe it in (duh), or eat it, but other than that, it appears to be safe and effective, even if not certifiable as "organic". Given that the same things could be said about bat guano, fish emulsion, or various other organic supplements, I'm not sure what the difference is here.
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
It says should be...... Read all 14 pages. Genius.. Read the last sentence you quoted. I don't think you understand. You cherry pick sentences. Making your own meaning. This isn't politics. It's science

from page 9

The effects of the substance on human health. Spray mist or dust may irritate the respiratory tract and cause skin itching and redness. Indigestion of dust or spray causes irritation to esophagus and stomach. Aggravates existing lung and skin medical conditions. Proper guidelines will need to
be developed for application if they do not already exist.



“Concluding remarks
Clearly, potassium silicate is a synthetic because, although the potassium carbonate and sand are mined, they require very high temperature treatment to form potassium silicate, and therefore a significant contribution of fossil fuel or fossil fuel replacement energy.
As a fertilizer, potassium silicate is highly soluble (generally a trait that puts a material in the prohibited grouping) and ‘jolts’ the soil with a rapid release of nutrients, even though the effects of a rapid availability of potassium and silica is not believed to have nearly as profound an impact as other materials such as sodium nitrate (an allowed non-synthetic material, with restrictions). As a source of potassium or silicate for soil fertility, there are several effective non-synthetic, low soluble alternatives (lack of alternatives can mitigate other prohibited traits). Although synthetic silicates of metallic micronutrients have been allowed, they are not allowed as a source of silica, and probably should remain so: the reason for allowing these synthetic metallic silicates is the lack of acceptable materials, not that they are compatible with organic philosophy. The weight of the above evidence puts potassium silicate as a fertilizer in the prohibited column.
As a fungicide, the same concerns about synthetics are present. However the amounts used are much smaller, there is no ‘jolt’ to the soil and, most importantly, effective alternatives are not available. Unfortunately, there is not convincing evidence that potassium silicate will be even as effective as the alternatives, and its mode of action is not understood. These are important considerations. Sulfur and copper are allowed synthetics because, although they have some non-target toxicity and environmental troubles, they have a well-understood mode of action and breakdown products, have been used by organic farmers for a long time, and are proven effective. Potassium silicate does not have significant non-target toxicities, environmental risks or breakdown products, but does have a poorly understood mode of action, a short history of use, and has not been proven widely effective.
Recommendations to the NOSB:
The substance should be listed as a prohibited synthetic on the National List.
However, I encourage the NOSB to reassess the material, perhaps as a restricted synthetic fungicide if, in the future, the mode of action becomes better understood, and much more significant and widespread effectiveness as a fungicide is proved.”



here's more references

Potassium silicate is not listed in the Final Rule. Synthetic silicates of zinc, copper, iron, manganese, molybdenum, selenium, and cobalt are allowed as micronutrient plant or soil amendments in cases of documented soil deficiency (§205.601(j)(6)(ii)). In processing applications, silicon dioxide (SiO2) is an allowed synthetic.
Certification
Domestic certifiers
California Certified Organic Farmers (CCOF) Certification Handbook – Not listed (CCOF 2000).
Idaho Department of Agriculture (ISDA) Organic Food Products Rules – Not listed (Section 02.06.33, 2000).
Texas Department of Agriculture (TDA) Organic Certification and Standards Materials List – Not listed. For processing, allows

silicon dioxide as a floating agent (2000).
Washington Department of Agriculture (WSDA) Organic Crop Production Standards – Not listed (WAC 16-154-070, 2000). Organic Materials Review Institute (OMRI) Generic Materials List – Not listed (2002).”
 

Jogro

Well-Known Member
It says should be...... Read all 14 pages. Genius.. read the last sentence you qutted. I don't think you understand. you cherry pick sentences. making your own meaning. this isn't politics. its science
LOL. I just cited the bits that directly contradict your baseless premise about "chemical nutrients" being harmful. Do you think distilled water is harmful? That's a "chemical nutrient".

Its not "my" meaning that this agent is safe and generally harmless, its the conclusion of the panel YOU CITED.

Yes, its bad to eat sand, inhale it, rub it in your eyes, or into your skin, because it could be "irritating". So if you're spraying a bunch of it onto a field, you might want to wear safety goggles and a respirator. Thank goodness we have "scientists" like yourself to point that out.

Meanwhile the report you cited as "science" is not even research AT ALL, let alone peer-reviewed science. Its a bunch of people on a panel deciding which substances should or should be considered "organic" for labelling purposes, based on somewhat arbitrary criteria.

This is EXACTLY politics.

Again, if you actually understood what they were saying, you'd get that the same panel has already approved a bunch of OTHER synthetic substances for "organic" farming that by their admission are far more toxic than this one. The reason they aren't approving this one YET is NOT because its harmful (they explicitly say it isn't), but because it hasn't been used long enough for them to know how effective it is. From YOUR summary, above:

Potassium silicate does not have significant non-target toxicities, environmental risks or breakdown products,[ie, its mostly harmless] but does have a poorly understood mode of action, a short history of use, and has not been proven widely effective.
 

Jogro

Well-Known Member
also, clonex being "bad" because it uses chems is your opinion, as far as i can tell, it WORKS and well i might add. juicy roots is also a good alternative.
Clonex is probably the best product of its type on the market.

It CAN be harmful, though. . .to your WALLET!

Never tried, "juicy roots" and can't comment on it, but cheap Schultz "take root" rooting powder is inexpensive, easily found at any big-box hardware or dept store, and works well.
 
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