Starting a new mix got questions.

I've been growing for awhile and decided to start a new mix for better results. I currently have about 45 gallons of a mix that i've been using thats mostly peat with some perlite and vermiculite and has a decent colony of composted roots and Jobes Tomato stuff (with the micorizzah and archae, etc) that I could add to my new mix.

I bought a 3 cu ft bag of the Lowes peat moss (Fafard)
I also bought Jobes bone meal and blood meal. I still have plenty of the Tomato pellets that have the fungi.
I bought some Vermiculite got about 5 quarts might need more. Want to use Vermiculite instead of perlite because of availability.
I also bought some Azomite (Better Earth i think, the compostable box)

Here our water is very hard with lots of Calcium and Magnesium and the PH of this stuff is like 8-9.

I was thinking of mixing this stuff together and using 50/50 RO/aired tap. I was hoping the high PH would balance the PM out.

Should I be alright or should I still amend something basic like lime?

Also should I get some sort of organic material like compost bags or steer manure for the fungi to feed off or should the PM suffice?

I'm going to start my own compost soon from scraps.

Its an indoor grow got a 2x4 area for veg with 1 gallon pots and 4x4 flower with 5 gal lowes buckets for flower. Using a single ViPAR Spectra "300w" (135w actual) for veg and 2x "400w COB" (200w actual) for flower if it matters.

I'm starting a few seeds this weekend and want to make sure I've got my mix right. I'll be starting them in RR plugs.

phillk6751 said:

Also should I get some sort of organic material like compost bags or steer manure for the fungi to feed off or should the PM suffice?

I'm going to start my own compost soon from scraps.

Its an indoor grow got a 2x4 area for veg with 1 gallon pots and 4x4 flower with 5 gal lowes buckets for flower. Using a single ViPAR Spectra "300w" (135w actual) for veg and 2x "400w COB" (200w actual) for flower if it matters.

I'm starting a few seeds this weekend and want to make sure I've got my mix right. I'll be starting them in RR plugs.

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whats up man
so what i'd do is just reamend/refortify that 45 gallons
if there are roots in it, that's a plus.
how much soil are you needing in total?
and with water that crazy you may want a rainwater collecting system (provided it's legal), mix that half and half with you RO.
maybe 1/4 tap water and 3/4 RO?
and with that much peat involved you will want some sort of liming agent, I don't like d-lime personally (especially if you have hardwater)
oyster flour, and crab meal are what I prefer
I would highly recommend not using bovine bone meal.
the blood meal is fine, but if you plan on planting this weekend... you'll need to age the soil
i'd use that old soil for the seeds, while the soil is cycling.
a gallon pot of old soil will grow them just fine, assuming your old soil isn't all fucked up from hydrochems or something

Yeah i think the water comes out about 350-400ppm

The Jobes bone meal says 100% organically sourced and prilled for dust reduction (pellets).

The only nutes the old soil has had is the Jobes Tomato and various remnants from a General Organics Go Box and an organic fish and bird poop fertilizer at one point.

I think i can pick up the oyster and crab meal from a local nursery....the same brand as the Azomite.....they're the same brand as the super soil guy has of boxes. Down to Earth.

I had thought of getting the kelp meal but being indoor i was taken away by the smell

I'm still learning a lot, so maybe someone else will chime in on my response to confirm it.

I'd probably toss the verm as your aerator for your soil since peat retains moisture and so does verm.

Perlite, lava rocks, rice hulls? Rice hulls should be cheaper then verm and should be available in any town I would imagine or even order online?

Rice Hulls don't break down over time, so it's a better option then perlite if you plan to reuse your soil (which I recommend and sure everyone else will too). Perlite breaks down overtime and creates a swampy concrete like mess in the bottom of your container over time.

DblBrryInvestments said:

I'm still learning a lot, so maybe someone else will chime in on my response to confirm it.

I'd probably toss the verm as your aerator for your soil since peat retains moisture and so does verm.

Perlite, lava rocks, rice hulls? Rice hulls should be cheaper then verm and should be available in any town I would imagine or even order online?

Rice Hulls don't break down over time, so it's a better option then perlite if you plan to reuse your soil (which I recommend and sure everyone else will too). Perlite breaks down overtime and creates a swampy concrete like mess in the bottom of your container over time.

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Ive got a ton of excess landscape rocks as well i could use...got the normal gray like 3/4" and also some redish type same size.

I live in the desert so i can also sift some sand down to about 2-3mm with an old window screen. I might have to go through a process of separating clay and salt from it but thats not difficult

So I decided to buy a bag of espoma garden lime. It looks to be mostly CaCO3 about 53%
And about 35% MgCO3

As for aeration im gonna try a few tests in some cut up water bottles:

-control test with my old soil
-50/50 peat/vermiculite

and i bought a small bag 1.5qt small lava rocks so ill try a mix of that with just peat and a mix with that and vermiculite. I'll drill some holes and water each and test after 2 days and 5 days or so and see what works best vs the control test.

Go with the small lava rock.............and not criticizing the earlier post, but rice hulls are organic, hence they DO decompose/break down, not a bad thing, but not long term aeration

DonBrennon said:

Go with the small lava rock.............and not criticizing the earlier post, but rice hulls are organic, hence they DO decompose/break down, not a bad thing, but not long term aeration

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First thing I said was that I wasn't 100% and hopefully someone else with more experience could chime in and confirm it.

So thank you

I read else where, I forget, that they didn't break down, maybe I misread it and it said it breaks down slower than perlite, it decomposes so that would be better then a perlite mess you would think?

DblBrryInvestments said:

First thing I said was that I wasn't 100% and hopefully someone else with more experience could chime in and confirm it.

So thank you

I read else where, I forget, that they didn't break down, maybe I misread it and it said it breaks down slower than perlite, it decomposes so that would be better then a perlite mess you would think?

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I haven't seen any rice hulls around though....is that maybe a feed store item? There aren't many feed stores in this area....probably a 30 min drive to the closest one.

I decided to not test the existing soil...i could only scrounge 3 eqal containers. Initial results (used a bit of algebra to solve for each ingredient)

The peat held about .51 cups water to a cup of peat.

The vermiculite was .49

The lava rock was .14 (the actual rock volume was less due to air gaps in measurement of 1 cup)

I weighed everything using grams and am filling a chart. I'll post results after 3 days...one test per day.

The 3 tests were:
1C peat & 1C Lava Rock
1C peat & 1C Vermiculite
1C each peat, Lava Rock, Vermiculite

So I forgot to check the weights yesterday (day 2) but it's looking like the results from day 3 and observations I made through these containers kinda does it. The volcanic rock makes pits of air below them and that worries me that it may cause pockets of air that could go anaerobic.

I'll go with a test of the existing soil too but I'm probably going 50% vermiculite and 50% peat.

I'll post a picture of my chart soon.

So after 24 hrs the 1/3 each was drying quicker but now at day 3 the vermiculite is helping it dry out quicker than both other methods.

DblBrryInvestments said:

First thing I said was that I wasn't 100% and hopefully someone else with more experience could chime in and confirm it.

So thank you

I read else where, I forget, that they didn't break down, maybe I misread it and it said it breaks down slower than perlite, it decomposes so that would be better then a perlite mess you would think?

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yea, you got that a bit mixed..
it's all good though man
perlite pretty much NEVER breaks down, volcanic rock doesn't, vermiculite will to a degree (much slower though), pumice doesn't, rice hulls DO, in fact the ricehulls degrade rather quickly, probably a yr or so and they are gone

phillk6751 said:

So I forgot to check the weights yesterday (day 2) but it's looking like the results from day 3 and observations I made through these containers kinda does it. The volcanic rock makes pits of air below them and that worries me that it may cause pockets of air that could go anaerobic.

I'll go with a test of the existing soil too but I'm probably going 50% vermiculite and 50% peat.

I'll post a picture of my chart soon.

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huh?
pockets of air that are anaerobic? isn't that a contradiction my friend?
gotta remember that soil isn't air tight, hence the whole need for aeration to begin with
volcanic rock is probably the aeration of choice for most. that include pumice.
vermiculite is GREAT but absorbs and holds lots of water, so keep that in mind.
I have a mixture of almost every type of aeration out there, I recommend a mix of them all.
pumice, perlite, vermiculite, coco wool, rotted tree-log chunks, volcanic rock, rice hulls...

Hello fellow gardeners... I was wondering about 1/2 inch red landscaping stones for aeration... I'm having to aerate 1200 gallons of soil and am looking for the cheapest way... Would there be any cons to using red landscaping stones?

BillyBlanks420 said:

Hello fellow gardeners... I was wondering about 1/2 inch red landscaping stones for aeration... I'm having to aerate 1200 gallons of soil and am looking for the cheapest way... Would there be any cons to using red landscaping stones?

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only if they have been colored or treated..
otherwise it's just volcanic rock, unless you are using something different

Cool thanks for the reply greasemonkeyman theyre just regular red stone, going to mix it with premium compost and happy frog soil conditioner... but i go to call my local soil place and they tell me theyre no longer putting horse manure in there premium mix just leaf mold grass clipings and humus which is wierd right shouldnt there be some form of manure for nutrient value?

BillyBlanks420 said:

Cool thanks for the reply greasemonkeyman theyre just regular red stone, going to mix it with premium compost and happy frog soil conditioner... but i go to call my local soil place and they tell me theyre no longer putting horse manure in there premium mix just leaf mold grass clipings and humus which is wierd right shouldnt there be some form of manure for nutrient value?

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ah you'd be surprised how much leaf mold and grass clippings have in them my man
more than manure in fact, especially grass clippings.
most composts are just grass and leaves anyway, better than manure in my opinion, better CEC, and no salt issues, no de-wormer concerns, antibiotics, etc

So I shouldn't dump a bag of organic manure in with my mix? Like 1 bag per yard of mix?

From what Ive read it helps with the biodiversity