I answered your Descartes quote in that forum so I won't bore you with a rerun.
You know, I believe you to have some intelligence. Won the war and chose defeat. "Chose defeat" does that even sound like any USA you've ever heard of? They were defeated by an insurgency, a little different than the one in Iraq, but an insurgency nontheless. And negative coverage, does that mean real time photography that the US finally got out of there because it showed them losing? There is no real time photography in Iraq at present, so were told were winning and you believe it. Man. you need to change channels and get off that Fox network bandwagon, try something to expand your knowledge instead of pure brainwash. I suggest LINK TV for an informative view of the world, forget US jingoism for a change. We live in the whole world, a small planet with many different types of people and governments, Live and learn. come on Johnny, I know you are intelligent enough to change. If you arent changing, you're standing still.
You completely missed the point and ignore my comment. The terrorists attacked us, not Iraq. We have no business going into Iraq.Quote:
Originally Posted by Parker
The death toll in Iraq should have been zero. The terrorists fled to Afghanistan and the US let them get away.
Actually the Taliban terrorists fled to Pakistan from Afghanistan. Say what you will about the invasion in Iraq, but once the U.S. toppled the Hussein regime, the terrorists flooded the country to fight the U.S., including Al Queda. We beat them in Iraq just like Dubya said we would do.
Non-intervention is the policy of avoiding the establishment of military alliances with other countries and avoiding all wars and conflicts that are not based upon self-defense of their national territory.Originally Posted by Parker
One of the things this country was founded on was non intervention. People seem to forget that. I know most of the politicians have forgotten it.
Where is this sacred principle in any historical document relating to the founding of the United States of America?
Even if Bush did??????? You dispute it??????? lol amazingQuote:
Originally Posted by Parker
Bush lied about non intervention being his policy.
There is a big difference between intervention and defense. Even if Bush had made such a policy claim, which I dispute, does that mean we can do nothing to further our national defense? What about a preemptive strategy?
On the contrary, Med. You are the one rooted in your own prejudices. Unable to evolve your views because you are right, period.
I would prefer to see some evidence of your claim. I did not say it was false, I merely disputed it's existence, yet you did not source your claim. If I remember correctly, Governor Bush was campaigning for president and inaugurated before 9-11. Assuming you are right, he should have rigidly adhered to such a statement in light of an attack on our soil? That's called 'Flat-Earth' thinking.
So what do you do for information? Do you live in a closet? Information is out there johnny, all you need to do is open your mind and let it in, then decide whether it fits reason or not. I have many sources I get information from, the internet is one. I don't spend all day arguing with potheads, I have other interests, one being Hot rods. There are a few sites that hold my interest besides the insanity of politics. I suggest you get a TV and subscribe to LINK TV. That will at least give you an Idea of what is really going on on our planet besides what our jingoistic government tells you. Do you like documentaries? One can learn a lot from independent documentaries.
I have many, varied sources of information, including the DailyKos and Moveon.org. I simply rejected the biased, spoon-fed pablum offered by television. Why do you think I am able to debate with the prowess I display?
Arguing with potheads? LOL! Let me tell you something personal about myself, Med. I used to be the Republican boogeyman you seem to think I am now. I strictly adhered to the party line and roundly rejected any dissent. But something happened to me in 1993. I made a conscious decision to experiment with Cannabis. At that point my horizons expanded in ways I could never imagine previously. After I started using cannabis, I quickly abandoned the Republican Party. Since then I voted Green Party in 1996, Libertarian in 2000, and Republican in 2004. This election I may even be persuaded to go with Obama. The last party primary I participated in was the New York state Republican primary in 1992.
I can't defend this statement. NO ONE should ever be punished for their beliefs.
I never said I was stupid enough to eat 1/4 Lb. of fresh peyote, I just suggested you try it. I ate what dose was appropriate at the time, up to 10-12 dried buttons, usually three or four fresh buttons would do the trick, well 3-4 huge fresh buttons may weigh near 1/4 lb come to think of it. I'd reaslly like to see you try it. I doubt you'd recover for a loooong time. I love my country, but hate what the politicians are doing with and to it. I am against what our government is doing around the world to prop up dictators and provide defense for corporations when that money is badly needed here at home. Hating our government is way far from hating our country. You need a class in civics.
Pete, you are way off base here. If someone hates America they are welcome to depart if they choose. Good riddance. However, if they wish to stay and voice their displeasure, I say MORE POWER TO THEM!
I am from England and most people I know hate Americans because of their perceived ignorance of anything non-American and.......oh yes...Bush!!! I have met many Americans as I used to work in the Tourist Industry ans unfortunately many of them ask ignorant questions that try to belittle non-Americans 'Is London the capital of Europe?'', a very rich silicone valley super nerd asked......cmon!
I did not miss the point. We fight the terrorists where it is more advantageous to our forces, not theirs. By your logic, the U.S. forces should have gone directly to Japan after Pearl Harbor. Impossible at the time because Japan ruled the Pacific. We fought them where we found them, and where we wanted to fight them. And we beat them.
So we should ignore all threats to our interests outside of our borders? Let oppression triumph throughout the world? Only we are entitled to live free?
Interesting points, and true, but not what I asked. The Jefferson quote is from his inaugural address of 1801.
The benchmarks were the Administration's if I remember correctly. They were fine to be used as a measure of success as long as we were getting our asses kicked. Nowadays, the American mainstream media is as quiet as a tomb when it comes to Iraq.
