FranJan
Well-Known Member
Bueno what are you going to run with that driver? 300mA output isn't a lot of amperage so unless you are running a stealth PC box they probably aren't what you want.
IF you are new to LED and want help choosing what to buy, POST HERE!
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rob333
Well-Known Member
i have a voucher from ap for one of there lights
Bueno Time
Well-Known Member
2 Vero 10s per driver ~26vF each at .3A = 7.8w per COB x 2 per driver. 24 Vero 10s total, 12 drivers, 3 extras/spares.
Abiqua
Well-Known Member
I picked these up:
http://www.fasttech.com/products/1739206....a clone most likely...probably runs a little under 300mA...Supra had some @280mA....88% efficiency.
I have x3 drivers going to run 6 Vero10's.............3 sets of 2 in series.
You should be fine. At fast, you can get a bulk discount....
FranJan
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't use those. IMO you want better efficiency from your drivers if your running more than one COB on a circuit. And I think they're just plain weak for a Vero 10. 350 is spec, but they will run very efficiently up to 700mA and those 10s running under spec just may not be enough intensity, enough photons being generated for growing, at least flowering. But I really don't know exactly what you're doing with them but if you're cooling is good you're probably better off running them around 500mA. But that's just my .02 cents.
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Abiqua
Well-Known Member
Fran, check out Mr. Flux's grow, using Vero10's @300mA.....should be fine. They pack a punch.....I have a 5K V10 that puts out 130/lumens @350....they definitely surprised me...
A v13 or v18 @ 700mA is much more recommended. I wouldn't run 10's @ 700mA, considering the low price and efficiency jump to the V18.
mauricem00
Well-Known Member
Someone has surely tried these drivers out, right? Supra I think mentioned them testing within specs but that shipping took a long time on them. I just want to make sure they are good before I order like 15 of them.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/390696103437?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT I have 2 of these and they work good.I have them driving 30 3watt 660 nm diodes and have had no problems with them
FranJan
Well-Known Member
Thanks bro will do. And I figured 700 is still OK since you're still in LM-80 country with the Vero but if you want efficiency then yeah you're right about going up in emitter size or more emitters at a lower mA. Intensity vs efficiency. The new logic gameFran, check out Mr. Flux's grow, using Vero10's @300mA.....should be fine. They pack a punch.....I have a 5K V10 that puts out 130/lumens @350....they definitely surprised me...
. Me, I want it all 
.
Bueno Time
Well-Known Member
The idea of running these drivers 30-65v 300mA rated is a few, they are cheap, 300mA drive current would be right where I want it to be power wise and for heat reasons, and being able to run pairs on them (which I will explain more about why it matters).
Right now I have a 2ft x 3ft flowering footprint and running 3 CXA3070 3000K AB bins @ ~1450mA each on Alpine 11 CPU cooler modules, spaced evenly along the center line of the footprint with a 24" heatsink bar on either side of those with 660nm 630nm 450nm LEDs @ ~30w total. The only problem I have with my current setup is that the light is so intense along the center of the tent that it is really a losing battle against yellowing/light bleaching directly under the COBs. Too much focused energy towards the center of the tent coupled with much less light on the sides of the tent because of the angle the light is being emitted and the distance off to the side is a bit great for 3 3070s in my experience. 6 3070s 1 per sq ft would be ideal at maybe 700mA or a hair more but I dont want to purchase twice the components (2x cost) of what I currently have to upgrade to 6 3070s.
I feel like I am better off for my goals for spreading out light intensity more evenly across the entire canopy, taking care of my issue with the intense light under the "big boy" COBs and also the issue with lack of intensity off to the sides further from the COBs which are in the center of the tent.
I was thinking to do like Mr Flux did and run 5x heatsink bars with 5 Vero 10s per bar on a single HLG-185H-C1400 running the 5 strings in parallel and the COBs in each string of 5 also in parallel I believe. Each COB would run at about 280mA theoretically but I dont really like the idea of binning and linking that many leds together on one driver.
Also a 4x heatsink bars x 6 Vero 10s per bar is a better coverage for my 2x3 ft space. Each COB would be spaced roughly 5" apart from each other and from the side walls of the tent. I would run 3 drivers per bar and would feel comfortable linking pairs of two Vero 10s in series on each driver. 12 of those spec drivers would run the 24 Veros I need for the setup evenly more or less. I am not dead set on these drivers by any means, all input is appreciated, just explaining my train of thought so far so this whole thing might make a little more sense.
Heres the layout of the 4x heatsink bars, 32" long each, 6x Vero 10 4000K per bar, 24" x 36" footprint, 4.8" on center front to back and 5.14" on center side to side, so roughly 5" on center between each COB and reflective side wall, like I said.
Instead of mycurrent setup, you can see it is far from ideal for light spread. I actually had started my LED project with 2x 3070s and then was adding the r/b bars in an 18"x30" tent so it was more ideal for that space, I just added a third COB and upgraded to the AB bins for the new tent. The lighting setup wasnt designed for the space from the start unfortunately. Heres the current layout.
The current setup is 3x CXA3070 3000K AB @ ~1450mA each and 18x 660nm 630nm 450nm
LEDs @ just over 600mA total dissipation wattage ~190w. The total dissipation wattage of 24x Vero 10 @ ~300mA each is ~187w so it should do as well if not better in my opinion being a little less efficient LEDs but MUCH better/even coverage.
Thats my theory on the situation so far. Curious to see what else you guys think.
Right now I have a 2ft x 3ft flowering footprint and running 3 CXA3070 3000K AB bins @ ~1450mA each on Alpine 11 CPU cooler modules, spaced evenly along the center line of the footprint with a 24" heatsink bar on either side of those with 660nm 630nm 450nm LEDs @ ~30w total. The only problem I have with my current setup is that the light is so intense along the center of the tent that it is really a losing battle against yellowing/light bleaching directly under the COBs. Too much focused energy towards the center of the tent coupled with much less light on the sides of the tent because of the angle the light is being emitted and the distance off to the side is a bit great for 3 3070s in my experience. 6 3070s 1 per sq ft would be ideal at maybe 700mA or a hair more but I dont want to purchase twice the components (2x cost) of what I currently have to upgrade to 6 3070s.
I feel like I am better off for my goals for spreading out light intensity more evenly across the entire canopy, taking care of my issue with the intense light under the "big boy" COBs and also the issue with lack of intensity off to the sides further from the COBs which are in the center of the tent.
I was thinking to do like Mr Flux did and run 5x heatsink bars with 5 Vero 10s per bar on a single HLG-185H-C1400 running the 5 strings in parallel and the COBs in each string of 5 also in parallel I believe. Each COB would run at about 280mA theoretically but I dont really like the idea of binning and linking that many leds together on one driver.
Also a 4x heatsink bars x 6 Vero 10s per bar is a better coverage for my 2x3 ft space. Each COB would be spaced roughly 5" apart from each other and from the side walls of the tent. I would run 3 drivers per bar and would feel comfortable linking pairs of two Vero 10s in series on each driver. 12 of those spec drivers would run the 24 Veros I need for the setup evenly more or less. I am not dead set on these drivers by any means, all input is appreciated, just explaining my train of thought so far so this whole thing might make a little more sense.
Heres the layout of the 4x heatsink bars, 32" long each, 6x Vero 10 4000K per bar, 24" x 36" footprint, 4.8" on center front to back and 5.14" on center side to side, so roughly 5" on center between each COB and reflective side wall, like I said.
Instead of mycurrent setup, you can see it is far from ideal for light spread. I actually had started my LED project with 2x 3070s and then was adding the r/b bars in an 18"x30" tent so it was more ideal for that space, I just added a third COB and upgraded to the AB bins for the new tent. The lighting setup wasnt designed for the space from the start unfortunately. Heres the current layout.
The current setup is 3x CXA3070 3000K AB @ ~1450mA each and 18x 660nm 630nm 450nm
LEDs @ just over 600mA total dissipation wattage ~190w. The total dissipation wattage of 24x Vero 10 @ ~300mA each is ~187w so it should do as well if not better in my opinion being a little less efficient LEDs but MUCH better/even coverage.
Thats my theory on the situation so far. Curious to see what else you guys think.
Bueno Time
Well-Known Member
Another bad thing I dont like about the 3x 3070s setup trying to cover a 2' wide space you have to run the COB up higher to get coverage off to the sides of the tent and also to keep the intense area below each COB from bleaching the tops. Just overall not a good spread of light for my space. 6x 3070s 1 per sq ft on dimmable drivers would rock but I dont want to spring the coin for that setup.
Id like to limit the height I need between the canopy and the COBs to closer to half since I have a short headspace to start with. Another good reason to spread out the light with multi COB setup. For me anyway in my particular situation/setup.
Id like to limit the height I need between the canopy and the COBs to closer to half since I have a short headspace to start with. Another good reason to spread out the light with multi COB setup. For me anyway in my particular situation/setup.
AquariusPanta
Well-Known Member
The price for 3x Brigdelux V10's is around the same price you would pay for a single V18 (~$13), so cost and performance is justified when choosing the former selection.
The only thing is that the V10's have the same 120 degree angle spread as the V18's, so I think your still going to have some issues with concentrating an effective, spread-out light emittance across the theoretical/proposed canopy.
Yes, I believe that the individual 9W COBs spread out in your proposed fashion would be a better setup in comparison to your current but I'm not sure if it's the best layout when all things are considered.
I'd keep drawing new layouts, including what you already have and what you want to add. You may want to keep the big COBs and place them on the outside, with the addition of some lenses (60 ~ 90 degrees?).
The only thing is that the V10's have the same 120 degree angle spread as the V18's, so I think your still going to have some issues with concentrating an effective, spread-out light emittance across the theoretical/proposed canopy.
Yes, I believe that the individual 9W COBs spread out in your proposed fashion would be a better setup in comparison to your current but I'm not sure if it's the best layout when all things are considered.
I'd keep drawing new layouts, including what you already have and what you want to add. You may want to keep the big COBs and place them on the outside, with the addition of some lenses (60 ~ 90 degrees?).
Bueno Time
Well-Known Member
Not sure what you mean by putting them on the outside. I appreaciate the input. I mean the current setup isnt bad but it (the lighting system) could be a lot better designed and executed for the space.
Heres a pic from tonight day 15 12/12 as best as I can get of the canopy in one picture.
Looks like a mess (because it is). Getting short on extra height.
Heres a pic from tonight day 15 12/12 as best as I can get of the canopy in one picture.
Looks like a mess (because it is). Getting short on extra height.
rob333
Well-Known Member
think i said this earlyer in the post but i have been running to 180w 3 w ufo's really impressed me all i gota say thinking maybe i might ditch my 600w hps and replace with 2 more 180wNot sure what you mean by putting them on the outside. I appreaciate the input. I mean the current setup isnt bad but it (the lighting system) could be a lot better designed and executed for the space.
Heres a pic from tonight day 15 12/12 as best as I can get of the canopy in one picture.
Looks like a mess (because it is). Getting short on extra height.
PSUAGRO.
Well-Known Member
http://www.photometrictesting.co.uk/File/blog_LED_colour_difference.php .................I hate Google too
AquariusPanta
Well-Known Member
http://www.photometrictesting.co.uk/File/blog_LED_colour_difference.php .................I hate Google too
"So when an LED supplier proudly claims to offer you LEDs binned to a 4-step MacAdam ellipse tolerance (or 4xSDCM), keep in mind that this is better than LEDs that are binned to 5-steps but you will still see a colour difference over the range of LEDs supplied to that specification."
Basically all that is needed to be known. LOL the rest of it is fancy talk.
The plants are looking good and looking fresh.Not sure what you mean by putting them on the outside. I appreaciate the input. I mean the current setup isnt bad but it (the lighting system) could be a lot better designed and executed for the space.
Heres a pic from tonight day 15 12/12 as best as I can get of the canopy in one picture.
Looks like a mess (because it is). Getting short on extra height.
What I meant by the "outside" was using your design, with the four heat-bearing bars and incorporate having the BIG COBs inside the design near the outsides parameters.
FYI, my lady is a few days ahead of your gals in motherdom (day 17). It's cool being able to compare looks!
epicfail
Well-Known Member
For the CXA3070 1 per/sf is what is I needed in my opinion. When got my first 2 COBs and hung them I couldn't believe how bright they were they lit up an empty cab very nicely. The problem was as soon as I put a plant under them I noticed some really dark shadows. I had used HID w/reflector, T5, CFL and A51 RW panels before these and they all do a better job at evenly spreading the light than only a few COBs. Though I might have had more photons in the space they were mostly concentrated in one area. The parts directly under the light would be great but everything else was showing lots of stretch from shade avoidance. I realized that lowering the current and adding more was the solution. With 1 per/sf @700-1050mA I don't get anymore real shadows due the amount of overlap from each.
I see people using 1 per 4/sf @2A+ and I'm sure they will quickly experience what I have explained. though the wattage/photons are there the lack of spread will be the downfall. These things are awesome but not as a single light source, you need a bunch spread out or there will be lots of shadows and plants will be stretching towards the light which can add up in cost. One good thing is you can start with a few driven harder then just get more reduce the current when its affordable. I am going to take some par readings of my setup later today if I have time and see if I can put together a little graphic but I don't have a 2A+ driver for comparison.
I see people using 1 per 4/sf @2A+ and I'm sure they will quickly experience what I have explained. though the wattage/photons are there the lack of spread will be the downfall. These things are awesome but not as a single light source, you need a bunch spread out or there will be lots of shadows and plants will be stretching towards the light which can add up in cost. One good thing is you can start with a few driven harder then just get more reduce the current when its affordable. I am going to take some par readings of my setup later today if I have time and see if I can put together a little graphic but I don't have a 2A+ driver for comparison.
Bueno Time
Well-Known Member
Couldnt have said it better myself.
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