DiY LED - Cree CXA3070

[JavaCo]

How long after they take the order and payments before I know if digi key will be able to deliver?


One more question. Since the hlg-120h-c350 max volt is 430 and I will be running 350ma or lower I thought 13*33 is 429V and once warmed up will run closer to 400V, why do you say 12 is the max for the driver.

Should be ok, Overvolt protection kicks in between 475 to 495 volts on the HLG-120H-C350

 

[SupraSPL]

When I tested the HLG-185H-C1050A, it let me go far below the minimum Vf range, but when I tried to go above the maximum Vf (190) as soon as I went past 191V the current output dropped like a rock. So I suspect Alesh is right, the COBs would not get a chance to warm up. So we have to size our builds based on the Vf at Tj 25C, we have to treat the max Vf as a hard cap and we have to take into account that you might get a pack of outliers with a high Vf. I have some CXAs with very high and very low Vfs relative to the "typical" figures. Thankfully, it also coincides with output, the high Vf CXAs put out a lot more light as well so it is not a direct change in efficiency.

 

[avnewb]

I created an 8 CXA3070 like the one specified by Gaius (6x 3000k Z2, 2x 5000k Z4, All @ 1.4a from 8x LPC-60-1400 mounted on Arctic alpine 64 GT r2 cpu coolers). These are mounted on a ~4'x2' frame in :-:-: pattern (dots 3000k, dashes 5000k).

I used 2x RAD bike lifts for pulley system:

The fixture is used to cover a ~44"x68" area (20sqft). It is ~480w so currently @ 24w/sqft. Area to be lit in future by this light is 44"x 98" (30sqft) so I will likely need to add some more COBs to cover that area properly. This is to be the final veg and flower light.

Plants are hybrids.

Posting as I need to figure out a second light for a veg only area which will be somewhere between 14.5 and 18.3sqft. I was going to go with 4x CXA30700N00Z240F on 4x LPC-60-1400 and same cpu coolers. Cant afford or find higher bins. Will this be good for new clones to almost fully vegged? Or is there a better plan?

Eventually this veg area will be almost 30sqft of floor but 12sqft of it wont have good height. May add T5s eventually to take advantage of the area with low height.

Cost would be ~ $300 with everything for this second light vs close to $600 I spent for 8 COB light.

About to order but mouser out of drivers so have to get from jamco or TRC which will cost a few more $s due to shipping. Dont want to go with ebay drivers due to perfectdeal_US sending different drivers recently.

 

[SupraSPL]

Sounds like a nice setup! If you are going to run the veg light with large COBs, I would recommend either HLG-185H-C1400 (94% efficient) or the generic 1.45A that i can vouch for (89%). The LPC-60-1400 is a good driver but only 85% efficient and not power factor corrected. A 4-5% improvement in driver efficiency has about the effect as a bin increase in the COBs.

As far as vegging COBs, if you were willing to run softer, you could use the Vero 10 5000K 70 CRi at 280mA very cheaply. It would give yo a better spread and actually more efficient than the CXA3070 4K Z2 (42% vs 38.2%). You could use $7 drivers that could run up to (5) Vero10s each.

Great heatsinks for the Vero 10
http://www.heatsinkusa.com/2-079/

 

[caretak3r]

I am not sure, someone ordered the CXA3070 2700K Z4 and the order got canceled eventually. I think it was @caretak3r ?

not me - I'm all vero. 16 vero10s, 6 vero 18s

 

[SupraSPL]

Aha it was @CannaBare

 

[SupraSPL]

Awesome setup avnewb, good improvisation and I bet it gets the job done! Have you considered some DIY reflectors? I did some testing and was astonished at the light increase at 1.4A.

 

[avnewb]

Awesome setup avnewb, good improvisation and I bet it gets the job done! Have you considered some DIY reflectors? I did some testing and was astonished at the light increase at 1.4A.

Thanks,
As I said I copied Gaius DIY. Dont want to get off topic in here but will look into that (I have other issues and questions; I will create a new thread).

Sounds like a nice setup! If you are going to run the veg light with large COBs, I would recommend either HLG-185H-C1400 (94% efficient) or the generic 1.45A that i can vouch for (89%). The LPC-60-1400 is a good driver but only 85% efficient and not power factor corrected. A 4-5% improvement in driver efficiency has about the effect as a bin increase in the COBs.
As far as vegging COBs, if you were willing to run softer, you could use the Vero 10 5000K 70 CRi at 280mA very cheaply. It would give yo a better spread and actually more efficient than the CXA3070 4K Z2 (42% vs 38.2%). You could use $7 drivers that could run up to (5) Vero10s each.
Great heatsinks for the Vero 10
http://www.heatsinkusa.com/2-079/

I wish I had gotten the generics but I will deal with upgrades/mods at a later date. The HLG-185H-C1400 are too expensive for me so...

I like the idea of the Vero 10s and that $7 driver but not sure due the cost of heatsink...

I have started to read your heatsink thread but @ page 5 and cannot find what I am looking for.

Dont expect to be spoon feed but trying to figure out what spacing and cooling to use for the BXRC-50C1000-B-04. Is that the correct COB? @ $4.37 from digikey
If I were looking to do 20sqft @ 10w/sqft I would want ~ 5.5 of those drivers, so 6 drivers @5 Vero 10s each would be 30 Vero 10s.
30x$4.37=$131+$14ship=$145
6 drivers
=6*$7+$10ship=$52

So in heatsink thread you show 2.08" info but no the 2.79" info.
I calculate ~93.935296 cm2 so 293.5478cm/$ for the 2.79" which is better priced than 263.85cm/$ on the 2.08".
To keep under $300 leave ~$80 for heatsinks, buys 20' of heatsink, depending on ship cost, which seem like more than I would need and a few fans and power supply for $20 to $40.

TIA for help.

 

[SupraSPL]

Yes that is the correct COB and just a few days ago it was $4.64. Looks like th Vero line just got another price drop

I just call the 2.079" the 2.08" for short

For vegging I normally recommend passive cooling and that is very do-able with the Vero 10 and the 2.08" profile. In the next day or two I will be testing a setup with (2) Vero 10s, driven by the $7 driver, mounted on a 2.08"X16" heatsink, passive cooled. I will report back with the temp droop results.

 

[REALSTYLES]

Guys you will never guess what? When I ordered more Cree CXA3590's, That sent me 2 36v 3000ks they wouldn't fire up on the driver and the driver works on the others from Dig-key.com. What happened is I ordered extra and they sent me 36v I gotta get a hold of them tomorrow to get this fixed. I also found out I can run four CXA3590's off one HLG-185H-700A. Thank you Supra for your help.

P.S. I was freaking out because I did the same thing with my first light no problems and now I'm gonna add 2 more COB's to my first light now that I know I can run 4 off one driver. I will use my kill-a-watt to test the draw.

 

[REALSTYLES]

1 driver 4 CXA3590's 204 watts

 

[JavaCo]

When I tested the HLG-185H-C1050A, it let me go far below the minimum Vf range, but when I tried to go above the maximum Vf (190) as soon as I went past 191V the current output dropped like a rock. So I suspect Alesh is right, the COBs would not get a chance to warm up. So we have to size our builds based on the Vf at Tj 25C, we have to treat the max Vf as a hard cap and we have to take into account that you might get a pack of outliers with a high Vf. I have some CXAs with very high and very low Vfs relative to the "typical" figures. Thankfully, it also coincides with output, the high Vf CXAs put out a lot more light as well so it is not a direct change in efficiency.

I got some HLG-185h-C1050B's sitting here, But no way to test them yet. I hope mine are not like the one you tried out. Adding up my chips i get a 190.2 volts. Data sheet has Over voltage kicking in between 210- 225 volts. Meanwell usually give you 110% of the listed specs. I guess time will tell.

 

[avnewb]

Yes that is the correct COB and just a few days ago it was $4.64. Looks like th Vero line just got another price drop

I just call the 2.079" the 2.08" for short

For vegging I normally recommend passive cooling and that is very do-able with the Vero 10 and the 2.08" profile. In the next day or two I will be testing a setup with (2) Vero 10s, driven by the $7 driver, mounted on a 2.08"X16" heatsink, passive cooled. I will report back with the temp droop results.

So looking to do aprox 18sqft:
18sqft x 10w/sqft = 180watts required
180w/sqft / 36w = 5 arrays
5 vero 10s per array = 25 vero 10 COBS

So above calc was wrong as missed a decimal (I used 2.79 rather than 2.079).
So my quick calc I get these # which are close to what you got
13.138 in2
84.7611208 cm2 per inch of 2.8wide heatsink
264.8785025cm2/$

@110cm2/watt
7.2w/cob
7.2*110cm2
=792cm2 required per cob
792cm2 / 84.76112cm2/in heatsink
9.343907 in per cob

So 10in x 5cobs-50"

So figure five 50" heatsinks for 5 arrays. ?

Then I will weld the five heatsinks together with eight 1-inch sections of the 6.080" heatsink which will put 8" between center of LEDs across arrays (have to fit in space I have so tighter than I want but will work).

Going to order this stuff if all looks good.
Calculate $271.64 shipped for 25 cobs, 5 drivers and heatsinks.


This weekend need to deal with smell as even thou 6 plants only 2' tall my DIY filter is not working.

Next thought was to cover the other 10sqft that has low ceiling height (4' down to 0)
Thought of getting this:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002JQBQZQ/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=2E7MQVTAJ1S3Q&coliid=I3F5S24YDSC321&psc=1

I want the 8 bulb one really but the 4 bulb one is already more than I want to spend and the 4 bulb is at lowest price ever according to CCC:
http://camelcamelcamel.com/EnviroGro-FLT44-4-Tube-Fixture-Included/product/B005H1C7NA?active=price_amazon

However, I could just get another 5 Areo 10s + 1 driver + heatsinks for $44 which would be about the same as the 4' 4 tube in terms of light, I think, but more heat (I think?). But think I might as well go with more vero10s assuming they will work on babys/clones. Just have to decide 1 more array, 2 or 3...

Sorry for long post, thanks for all the help.

 

[SupraSPL]

Yes that is a very solid design, overkill even, you might be able to get away with 85cm²/W and still get very good cooling for the COBs if there is a any breeze hitting the heatsinks.

Are you using air phase coconut carbon for the filter? I tried the aqaurium carbon and it did not work well for me. When I switched to coconut carbon it made all the difference and I have been able to reuse it by cooking it in a kettle on campfire coals. It can get glowing hot and as far as I can tell so far it can be reused many times.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5lbs-Pure-Virgin-Granular-Activated-Carbon-GAC-Coconut-Shell-Charcoal-/301309474831?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item462771b80f

Heck ya man go for more Veros. They will give you more headroom, twice as efficient as the fluoros, need only 1/3 the Wattage to do the same job and they will never fade, never burn out.

 

[randomlygrow]

I'm genuinely exhausted. I think i've pretty much read everything from start to finish in this thread. But i'm overwhelmed.

I'm not even sure what is on or off topic any more and if I'm even worthy of posting in this thread. But just in case!....

Obviously the more I read the more I keep changing my mind. But I think I'm going to settle of a fully scalable solution. KISS style

Now lets assume a classic CPU cooler, 3070AB and mean well CC (or ebay bargain if i'm being really cheap) 700mA driver powered from a 240VAC (UK) source. What is the best way to power the fan?, but still keeping it all scalable and individual? DC-DC buck step down from the output of the mean well driver, or an AC-DC converter from 240VAC source? Assuming that I'd want to power the fans at or around 5/6vDC. Considering running them 700mA isn't going to require much cooling, righty? I mean even better would be individually controllable through 5-12v. What's efficient here? What should I be looking at? (My head hurts from data sheets and websites).

I'm basically planning on making one, working with what i've got, and then scale up from there, and move these individual units around to which ever tent/area needs them. I'm hoping this will make them efficient in terms of use, and as i said ultimately scalable, and things should only get cheaper over time.

Proof is in the pudding, but once i crack one, i'll just go ahead and scale up and tbh, if it works, i know for a fact my friends will be asking too, and whatever makes offering them a solution easier for me is good in my books too.

Sorry if i've taken this off topic, ignore if so, and get ready for many more thoroughly confused posts in the near future i'm sure! Sorrrrry!

 

[avnewb]

Yes that is a very solid design, overkill even, you might be able to get away with 85cm²/W and still get very good cooling for the COBs if there is a any breeze hitting the heatsinks.

Are you using air phase coconut carbon for the filter? I tried the aqaurium carbon and it did not work well for me. When I switched to coconut carbon it made all the difference and I have been able to reuse it by cooking it in a kettle on campfire coals. It can get glowing hot and as far as I can tell so far it can be reused many times.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5lbs-Pure-Virgin-Granular-Activated-Carbon-GAC-Coconut-Shell-Charcoal-/301309474831?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item462771b80f

Heck ya man go for more Veros. They will give you more headroom, twice as efficient as the fluoros, need only 1/3 the Wattage to do the same job and they will never fade, never burn out.

Thanks so much, bough some of that carbon.

Stuck with 10 inches/cob cause design was easy compared to changing it and bought 35 vero 10s, 7 power supplies, five 50" heatsinks and ten additional 10" heatsinks to make 2 additional arrays.

Thanks again.

Need to start taking cuttings ASAP as thing are getting bushy. And yes I am vegging under the CXA lamp which is probably not ideal as has caused burning along with FFOF causing burning due to it being too hot...

I'm genuinely exhausted. I think i've pretty much read everything from start to finish in this thread. But i'm overwhelmed.

I'm not even sure what is on or off topic any more and if I'm even worthy of posting in this thread. But just in case!....

Obviously the more I read the more I keep changing my mind. But I think I'm going to settle of a fully scalable solution. KISS style

Now lets assume a classic CPU cooler, 3070AB and mean well CC (or ebay bargain if i'm being really cheap) 700mA driver powered from a 240VAC (UK) source. What is the best way to power the fan?, but still keeping it all scalable and individual? DC-DC buck step down from the output of the mean well driver, or an AC-DC converter from 240VAC source? Assuming that I'd want to power the fans at or around 5/6vDC. Considering running them 700mA isn't going to require much cooling, righty? I mean even better would be individually controllable through 5-12v. What's efficient here? What should I be looking at? (My head hurts from data sheets and websites).

I'm basically planning on making one, working with what i've got, and then scale up from there, and move these individual units around to which ever tent/area needs them. I'm hoping this will make them efficient in terms of use, and as i said ultimately scalable, and things should only get cheaper over time.

Proof is in the pudding, but once i crack one, i'll just go ahead and scale up and tbh, if it works, i know for a fact my friends will be asking too, and whatever makes offering them a solution easier for me is good in my books too.

Sorry if i've taken this off topic, ignore if so, and get ready for many more thoroughly confused posts in the near future i'm sure! Sorrrrry!

I got this power supply for $5.30 (now $8.95 FSSS w/prime or $35 order):
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0023Y9EQC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
And it works well and has no issue with 8 arctic alpine 64 GTr2 fans.
Too many bad reviews on another popular one so I went with something else. If near Frys this one is recommended:
http://www.frys.com/product/7613847?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Main thing I was worried about was it not being able to output the amps. Only needed like 2amps max so not hard to do but many reviews one another power supply showed it could not handle multiple fans even thou specs said it should. Im sure others can point you to something that will work.

 

[SupraSPL]

Good plan AVnewb, looking forward to see the build, that will be a serious veg lamp

I'm genuinely exhausted. I think i've pretty much read everything from start to finish in this thread.

I remember how long it took me to read KNNAs DIY LED threads on Gardenscure and ICmag, it was exhausting but in a good way. You are correct, with CXA3070s at 700mA the CPU cooler will barely need any air movement and the heatsink will stay close to ambient. 5V would do the job and they tend to be easier to find and cheaper than 6V. Something like this could power 43 Alpine 11 fans for $6 or this for 16 fans or this would be the most efficient choice for powering just a few fans.

 

[randomlygrow]

Yeah, ok I was thinking something like old phone chargers and network box power adapters maybe. But ultimately I was hoping there would be a little something like:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3PCS-Buck-Step-down-Power-Converter-Module-DC-4-40-to-1-3-37V-LED-Voltmeter-TE99-/171635230782?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item27f641c83e

That I could use in series (or parallel, now that actually makes me wonder what would happen) with the CXA? Possible?

As I said I want to keep it all repeatable small and simple, so I can daisy chain as i build them up and add to what i've got.

 

[Abiqua]

Yeah, ok I was thinking something like old phone chargers and network box power adapters maybe. But ultimately I was hoping there would be a little something like:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3PCS-Buck-Step-down-Power-Converter-Module-DC-4-40-to-1-3-37V-LED-Voltmeter-TE99-/171635230782?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item27f641c83e

That I could use in series (or parallel, now that actually makes me wonder what would happen) with the CXA? Possible?

As I said I want to keep it all repeatable small and simple, so I can daisy chain as i build them up and add to what i've got.

The best thing to do would be to tap into the main and wire in parallel with the + input of the LED driver. This is what I did for a small 12v 300ma CV power supply.
fyi Fans need constant voltage and LED drivers are Constant current.....so voltage can range all over the place if you were to tap into the + output of the driver.

Transforming constant current into constant voltage thru a buck, is beyond my pay grade...sorry, Im curious though too!....

 

[SupraSPL]

Ya I am wondering the same, how would that behave on a constant current circuit?