First time growing, went a little overboard with defoliation. Never expected my girls to do this

Alwayslearnin

Well-Known Member
Oh. I want to add. Here is a good reason not to lollipop a short plant.

View attachment 3853469

Lowest original branches on above plant.
Very nice, well i will remember this thanks, i still have a bit to go so i hope the gjve me enough to smoke for the summer. at the moment the ones i posted are about 14" at the end of week 3. so far in week four the la confidential are griwing a bit not sure what the end result will be. Next time i wont mess with the. as much. all growers were rookies at one time or another right.
 

Nugachino

Well-Known Member
I know you're a first timer. But shit... pulling off like 80% of the leaves. Really?

The only time you want to defoliate is when the canopy is so dense there's little to no light or airflow getting through. And even then you can use lst to help improve that.

You've pretty much killed any hopes of seeing optimal yield by doing what you did there.

I will finish with saying that she otherwise looks fine. Better than mine even.
 

MichiganMedGrower

Well-Known Member
Very nice, well i will remember this thanks, i still have a bit to go so i hope the gjve me enough to smoke for the summer. at the moment the ones i posted are about 14" at the end of week 3. so far in week four the la confidential are griwing a bit not sure what the end result will be. Next time i wont mess with the. as much. all growers were rookies at one time or another right.
I have done it too. Well not quite so extreme. but the plants grew new leaves and flowered fine. No I am sure I did not get max yield or potency but I did get a whole bunch of way better than the brick weed I was smoking at the time.

I would say there may be a 2 week or more delay. Don't over feed or over water and I bet they pull through. They were really healthy to begin with.
 

SPLFreak808

Well-Known Member
@idfuckmyplants ---- Just wear protection bro. I don't want to read in High Times you got engaged.
http://www.seedsavers.org/blossom-bags


I do get your point SPL and you are certainly correct in the OP case for sure but I guess the question is which leaves open stomata more frequently and efficiently, new or old? By sacrificing certain fans the plant opens up more sites for new growth to come thus higher uptake of CO2 due to the increased stomata density of the canopy.

"Generally, plant photosynthetic apparati are only designed to function well over a rather narrow range of temperatures. When heated, cytochromes, pigments, and membranes critical to phosphorylation and carbon fixation rapidly denature (i.e., they cook). To avoid this, an individual plant may open its stomata and evaporate water which will lower the leaf temperature. Thus, one may hypothesize that leaves in the sun should have higher stomata density than do leaves in the shade - all else being equal."

http://www.esa.org/tiee/vol/v1/experiments/stomata/stomata_description.html
Newer leaves are always more efficient true.. Thats just the nature of new life, its also caused by the "boundary layer" (stiff air surrounding the leaf) The older the leaf, the thicker the boundary layer which slows it down.

Not sure how i feel about photosynthesis rate here either, i would think it highly depends on environment and strain. Outdoor or under an HPS might actually have the middle upper half of the plant doing most the work compared to the top but correct me if you got something to share.
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Last week after defoliation.View attachment 3853418
Last night
View attachment 3853420
Second and last defoliation will be next week (second week of flower).

Please take a moment to put a colored wire tie at one of those crossings of the string.
Take another picture of that, in the shot.
Please continue to take pics of that from the same spot till harvest - PLEASE!

No one ever finishes one of these defol threads with their results and the road to them!

You know what your doing grow wise......I want to see your results - PLEASE!

"I" want to see....screw the "haters"......

His plants were not going to produce a very high volume regardless but no I don't think the OP benefited at all from doing this and actually probably added 7-10 days to his flower. The bud-sites need to developed before stretch starting about 2 weeks before flip. I welcome you to come back and see my harvest brother. It is not about bigger buds, it is about efficiency of space/higher quality buds/less stick. The only thing I truly know is that I don't know everything, so I welcome your feedback, even if it is an antagonistic view like I have seen from you.
I have a friend who does the defol thing like you.....he does not have big buds, they're smaller but dense as hell and he does pull an impressive yield increase with it (for plant size)....in weight!

I like your details given and will be looking forward to your posts (if you do it) .....

I'll sub this thread if you do......I gotta see one of these actually finish.....

Thanks farmer

Doc
 

NaturalFarmer

Well-Known Member
Please take a moment to put a colored wire tie at one of those crossings of the string.
Take another picture of that, in the shot.
Please continue to take pics of that from the same spot till harvest - PLEASE!

No one ever finishes one of these defol threads with their results and the road to them!


Doc
Would a ruler be helpful? I dont know if I am following you on the wire ties but I have plenty......:)
Are you just looking for a reference? It is a 5x5 frame but I certainly will help make it easier just let me know what you think will work best.
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Would a ruler be helpful? I dont know if I am following you on the wire ties but I have plenty......:)
Are you just looking for a reference? It is a 5x5 frame but I certainly will help make it easier just let me know what you think will work best.
Yeah its a simple reference to show that it's the same spot/plants....NOT that you would cheat! I mean that!!!.....It's just that someone did cheat on that before.....another site.....

I REALLY want to see this run out!

I'm subbed in! (gives me a notice every time you post)
 

Alwayslearnin

Well-Known Member
Newer leaves are always more efficient true.. Thats just the nature of new life, its also caused by the "boundary layer" (stiff air surrounding the leaf) The older the leaf, the thicker the boundary layer which slows it down.

Not sure how i feel about photosynthesis rate here either, i would think it highly depends on environment and strain. Outdoor or under an HPS might actually have the middle upper half of the plant doing most the work compared to the top but correct me if you got something to share.
Well just like the defoliating i may be abit over the top with light, i have 4 1000wat hps going all open and i ha two intake 6" can fans and 1 8" can with charcoal filter. I have two fans going non stop during the on time so even though the lights are putting out some serious heat in able to keep thep temp at 72 degrees and my rh is 35%-45% unless depends on the weather ince im depending on the cold outside air to cool the room. I did fuck with them quite a bit cause i wanted short plants but not as short as they ended up. When i say short the tallest of the La's is 14" the shortest is 9" they never streched even in veg they never got very big. the blue dream dud what i wanted height wise about 3'6 maybe 4' and i did the same to all if em. i dont under stand why one strain is so small while the blue dream didnt. i know that some LA strains are short and compact but even then they get to 30" or better. these are the same size as they were when i flipped them i dudnt strip them till after the second week if flower. i dint get it the were healthy as can be. here are pics from this morning. i am hoping they arent ginna hermaphrodite n me one of the lights came on for no reason. i went out like i always do at 545 to be sure the lights go out the intakes are off and the heater is on. Everything went off like it should and heater went on like it should to all set to timers. i switched back to the manual timer cause the digies were shit. Sure as its winter i had to fill my humidifier i went out at 745 to get my jugs for water and ine of those fuckin lights came on i have no idea hiw or why no body can get in there. Anyway ill cross my fingers. i have two plants under each light . they litterally look like miagi treez.1481817575407740150890.jpg 14818177579101888034733.jpg 1481817872301-123405093.jpg 14818179036381762204494.jpg 14818181082241158639224.jpg1481817575407740150890.jpg 14818177579101888034733.jpg 1481817872301-123405093.jpg 14818179036381762204494.jpg 14818181082241158639224.jpg
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Well just like the defoliating i may be abit over the top with light, i have 4 1000wat hps going all open and i ha two intake 6" can fans and 1 8" can with charcoal filter. I have two fans going non stop during the on time so even though the lights are putting out some serious heat in able to keep thep temp at 72 degrees and my rh is 35%-45% unless depends on the weather ince im depending on the cold outside air to cool the room. I did fuck with them quite a bit cause i wanted short plants but not as short as they ended up. When i say short the tallest of the La's is 14" the shortest is 9" they never streched even in veg they never got very big. the blue dream dud what i wanted height wise about 3'6 maybe 4' and i did the same to all if em. i dont under stand why one strain is so small while the blue dream didnt. i know that some LA strains are short and compact but even then they get to 30" or better. these are the same size as they were when i flipped them i dudnt strip them till after the second week if flower. i dint get it the were healthy as can be. here are pics from this morning. i am hoping they arent ginna hermaphrodite n me one of the lights came on for no reason. i went out like i always do at 545 to be sure the lights go out the intakes are off and the heater is on. Everything went off like it should and heater went on like it should to all set to timers. i switched back to the manual timer cause the digies were shit. Sure as its winter i had to fill my humidifier i went out at 745 to get my jugs for water and ine of those fuckin lights came on i have no idea hiw or why no body can get in there. Anyway ill cross my fingers. i have two plants under each light . they litterally look like miagi treez.View attachment 3853980 View attachment 3853983 View attachment 3853986 View attachment 3853989 View attachment 3853992View attachment 3853980 View attachment 3853983 View attachment 3853986 View attachment 3853989 View attachment 3853992
DANGER! DANGER! I SEE PM! Treat and clean,,treat and clean!!!!
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Please take a moment to put a colored wire tie at one of those crossings of the string.
Take another picture of that, in the shot.
Please continue to take pics of that from the same spot till harvest - PLEASE!

No one ever finishes one of these defol threads with their results and the road to them!

You know what your doing grow wise......I want to see your results - PLEASE!

"I" want to see....screw the "haters"......



I have a friend who does the defol thing like you.....he does not have big buds, they're smaller but dense as hell and he does pull an impressive yield increase with it (for plant size)....in weight!

I like your details given and will be looking forward to your posts (if you do it) .....

I'll sub this thread if you do......I gotta see one of these actually finish.....

Thanks farmer

Doc
pretty sure @RM3 has done side by sides, no?
but that's relying on my THC addled brain's memory..
i never even said that defoliating is never advantageous, you can certainly "tidy up" how your plants look at the end, and sure, maybe it'll be more pleasing to the human eyes that way, but i like larf, i like weight, the larfy stuff is for hash or edibles, rosin, etc. the colas are for smoking

But to think that your buds will be bigger and your plant will yield more weight with less leaves is completely wrong.
period.
like i said, given ample light, defoliation is just slowing your plant down.

Instances where defoliating can be handy would be SOG grows, and such, where you are packing in as many one cola plants as possible and you don't want them to shade each other, but again, given ample light, that's superfluous.


For the record I've done the side-by-side, yrs ago, in my early 20s, and it "fit" the grow room better, sure.
but the yield was totally less, that plant needed less water too, the UN-defoliated plant took up way more water, grew bigger, faster, and yielded better nugs.
THAT was where i made my conclusion.
I'm not speaking out my ass, science, and botany agree, not to mention billions of yrs of evolution, if anything you can rely on mother nature to get it right.
 

Grandpapy

Well-Known Member
Oh and Op I think they look fine and will fatten up nice and dense with all the light hitting them.

The way I look at it every method has it's time and place....You just have to make sure for the type of strain you are growing you understand when those time and places are.

here check this out :D not for the faint of heart if you are one of the fan leaf lovers. :P


@ the 3 min mark.

I wonder why he doesn’t consider the Quality of his Electricity as being problematic.
 

tharoomman

Well-Known Member
I see in your method reasons to remove foliage as it would get in the way and likely hinder air flow under the screen and maybe collect moisture but why the need to remove any from the op's grow.

I keep my plants in pots movable and under 30" tall with a little space around them and grow for as much original leaves kept as possible and I get dense buds from top to bottom.

I am going to attach pics I posted in another thread to show what grows under the dense canopy for @Alwayslearnin

Removing leaves does not help light make buds bigger. The light passes through the leaves in different spectrums differently and the leaves are arranged to make the most of it.

Harvesting plant still with all leaves intact.

View attachment 3853446

She was in the flower room 13.5 weeks and her leaves look a bit rough but only a few leaves were lost during her cycle.

Here is after we removed the fan leaves.

View attachment 3853461

I hope this shows that the buds don't need fan leaves removed to flourish.

What was the dry weight off that?
 

Bugeye

Well-Known Member
I know I've read that the spectrum of light that allows photosynthesis to occur is invisible to the human eye and can pass through leaves. If this is true, why pull fan leaves off for better light? Or is my premise wrong?
 
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