Mars 2 LED 1st time grow

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Alright everyone I am officially starting a grow journal. This is technically my second grow, but the first one got derailed pretty quick and I just put them outside in a bucket and let them be after a few weeks of just being on a sun porch so I'm not counting that. At the time I had just ordered a mars 2 900, but didn't have a room setup to where I could do it. So I just let them be. Anyway here we are about 2.5 years later with the same light and a tent ready to give it another shot.

My current setup:
-39"x39" mars grow tent(very happy w the quality and cost of this tent)

-Mars 2 900 LED(jrsaw's spectrum)

- single oscillating fan

-space heater if it gets too cold

-soil mixture is 2.5 year old mix of POTting soil and pro mix, with some granite dust sprinkled in(more to come in following posts)

My current girls:
2x Jack herer(sex unknown)
1x Cheese(feminized)
1x Kalishnakova(feminized)
2x Random seeds from high quality nug I get( there were 3, but 1 was really stunted and doesnt look like it's gonna make it.

I will give a general rundown of what the grow has been like so far, then I will post some pics in subsequent posts in a chronological order with some more details.

So the girls were all started from seeds December 21st or 22nd in soil in solo cups. They then started sprouting dec 24. There were some other seeds that I tried to start, but never germinated. The seeds were also 2.5 years old, at least the ones that I know exactly what they are.

Anyway the ones that got out of the dirt got moved under a cool daylight standard led bulb. At first they seemed to be doing ok but after a week or so, they didn't seem to be thriving and a couple of them were looking like they were getting worse. I then switched bulbs to a warm day light cfl and they seemed to like that lift better but was anxious to get them under the mars 2. At first it was too cold in tent so I had to turn on a space heater which got it up to about 79, before I could transplant them. That's when I got my tent heated up and transplanted them into 1/2 gallon containers and finally got them under the mars 2 led.

I had posted some problems( my plants seemed to be stunted/ not growing). And some people were concerned that my medium wasn't adequate and also that they were probably overwatered. So I let them dry out for a few days and it didn't seem to hurt them. I suspected that there was probably transplant shock and light shock at first. I had my mars 2 approximately 36" from the tops of the girls.

Despite looking a little healthier they still
Didn't really seem to be growing. I posted again and someone said they look thirsty so I have them a nice bottoms up watering so they could soak it up for a couple hours and watered the top after a few hours of soaking. I also left the water in the pan and raised the plants up by about 2" on top of bricks out of the water. I thought that maybe moving the light closer would help plus the pan should raise the humidity which had been sitting consistently in the 30s. In addition I turned off the space heater. The temp was staying pretty constant at 81 and it hasn't been that cold. 36 hours later the plants had shown some very noticeable growth and seemed to be doing better the temp has been maxing out @ 77 now with a low of 55 over the last 24 hours.

I will be out of town the next few days and hopefully the girls will be ok for the next few days without my attention. I hope they don't drink their water too quickly!

Thanks for taking the time to check out this post. Anyway, please feel free to make suggestions, tips, and comments. I won't be able to do this on my own. More pics and details to come in the next 24 hours.

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Ok first things first. I made up a mix 50/50 of the following 2 bags. This medium was made up 2.5 years ago. I do not know if this will have negative consequences. If anyone has good information on this please share! There is also a little bit of granite dust sprinkled in as well. It should also be of note I am not 100% sure this is the same mix! I do believe it is tho.

Ok so my medium is a wild card right now(at least in my mind). Maybe someone can guide me in the right direction, should I use the same soil when I uppot or a new mix. I'm not really sure. Anyway o decided to use the medium to germinate in solo cups. I pre-moistened the soil, wrapped some plastic wrap around the top, and placed them on a warm surface. Almost all of them emerged 3 days later on Dec 24. Here are wee pups!

I wrapped some panda film around a 10 gallon aquarium and put an led bulb cool daylight bulb above the girls.

For the first few days the little girls seemed to be doing well. This is dec 27, 3 days after they sprouted.

Then here they are 2 days after that. 5 days old in total. The cheese is in the top right corner; it's had really skinny leaves from the get go. Also you can see in the top left(those are the 3 random seeds from nugz) that one of them is stunted. This one isn't going to make it! The jack herer are the 2 in bot left and the Kalishnakova is the bot right

Ok so after a week or so the girls weren't looking like they were thriving. So I decided to switch the bulb to warm cfl(2700k, it's what I had on hand), meanwhile I ordered a tent and they stayed under the cfl for 4-5 days until the tent came. I uppotted them into real containers and finally got them under the mars. The next 3 pics are the girls a few hours after moving to their new home. They are finally under the Mars 2


So I watered them and put aqua globes in them. They weeent thriving so at this time I posted some pics in the plant problems forum. People suggested my soil was the problem and they were probably overwatered. A pic of the girls under normal light.

A close up of one of the girls.

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Ok so some experienced members thought they were overwatered so the next day(Jan 14) I pulled the aqua globes and left them alone for a bit. I was also able to get my hands in a ph test so I could check the ph of the soil to make sure that wasn't the issue. I'm colorblind so I'm not confident in my ability to accurately match the colors to the ph rating, but I'm pretty confident this should be ok.

I did a second test, because I was not super careful the first timeI measured. Here is the second test.. still looks good to me

A pic of one of the girls Jan 14, you can see some leaf droop

This one is the cheese on Jan 14. She is not looking great here, but is showing some new growth

Another girl on Jan 14. She is actually looking pretty good

still they were starting to look better but still seemed pretty stunted and didn't really seem to be getting bigger. I was hoping that it was a combination of overwatering, light shock and and transplant shock. A few of them even got knocked over out of their mediums and I had to repot them! So I got back on the plant problem forum posted and someone said they look hungry and that the soil was wrong. So since it had been 5 days I decided to soak them I filled up the container/reservoir with a couple inches of water and let the girls soak it up for a couple hours. I then watered them from the top and finally I decided t put several bricks underneath. This would serve the purpose of raising the plants a couple inches to see how they would respond and also have more surface area of water, which would hopefully raise the RH. Well about a day and a half after this was Friday the 20th and I decided to check on the girls. They were looking much better. The next 4 are different girls on Jan 20. This first one is cheese and she looks to be recovering well.

I can't identify which plants these are but I will try to come back and update this so we have a reference.

This one looks pretty good beside the bottom leaf which seems to be fried!

And here's a picture of the last girl I photographed that day.


So the tray I'm usin can only hold 4 plants, which is why you will only be seeing 4 of them at a time. Hopefully I will start doing all 6 soon. Needless to say I'm still looking for advice on what I can do to improve the growth rate and health of the plants. I may get some superthrive and calmg to start?? advice is appreciated!!

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Alright so this will be the last update on the grow for a few days. I'm out of town. I took pictures late Sunday night about 48 hours later and the girls look like they are doing so much better and showing some significant leaf growth, despite minimal height growth. I included a bic lighter for reference. I will try to get these plants identified for you guys in the next 24 hours. Tonight or tomorrow sometime probably.

Plant 1


Plant 2


Cheese

Plant 4


Ok I took a few more pics before I left town Monday afternoon. Here is a pic of the grow room

Here is the thermometer / hygrometer showing the temp/RH current and last 24 hours.(that low temp is 59)

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Hi everyone. I just returned home today. I certainly was excited to check on my girls after not seeing them for 3 days. Good news is they were looking good and have definitely been growing since I left. So here's my tent info:

Temp range over 24 hrs: 66-74
RH over 24 hours: 51-59

Also because the girls responded well when I moved the light closer. I decided to move the light a couple inches closer and plan to keep doing this every 2-3 days until they respond negatively. I had the time and means to get pics of all the girls as well as have them all identified. Anyway on to the pics!

The first pic is cheese. This is the girl that was in pretty sad shape. She has recovered quite nicely.

The second pic is of Jack Herer(2). Looking pretty good.

The third pic is Jack Herer(1). There is some noticeable, albeit small, distinct yellowing on the tips.


The fourth pic is kaishnakova. Also looking good the lower leaves are fainter.

The fifth pic is of RNG(1). Random Nug 1
Another plant that overall seems to be doing well


The sixth pic is of RNG(2). A bit smaller but seems healthyish

Well they seem to be doing well, but I'm thinking I may have a nitrogen deficiency. Of note is the soil is really moist still(I have successfully got the RH up into the fifties) if this could be leading to the issue. It only seems to be minor, but the lower leaves on the plants being fainter as well as some of the tips starting to yellow indicate N deficiency? Any help would be appreciated.
Some other things I'm curious about:

1)Should I get nutrients and add them?(thinking possibly superthrive/CalMG)
2)Should I cut off the bottom lower leaves that look like they are dying or wilting?
3)when is appropriate to top them?
4) when should I put them into bigger containers? What size? If/when I do, should I use the same soil? Amend it with perlite? Transplant into newer, more appropriate soil?

That's all I can think of for now, I'll throw in one more pic of Jack Herer 2. This one is under the Mars 2 LED, it shows the yellowing on the tips of this girl better than the standard light

 

[ColoradoCheshire]

Everything looks good so far buddy. Trust me overwatering is such an easy mistake to make. I've done it numerous times. When you have less than three nodes of growth either use a little cup for watering or mist the top soil until it's nice and moist. Topping can be done anytime after 3rd node, but you want to make sure your plants are healthy enough to recover in a fair amount of time. This early keep all leaves, if they get too sick they'll naturally fall off. IMHO top these after transplanting and they recover if you wish to top. And when you transplant hit them with a dose of superthrive to get the roots running through the new medium. Seedlings can be tough since they're so fragile, but once they're past that it's smooth sailing.

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Everything looks good so far buddy. Trust me overwatering is such an easy mistake to make. I've done it numerous times. When you have less than three nodes of growth either use a little cup for watering or mist the top soil until it's nice and moist. Topping can be done anytime after 3rd node, but you want to make sure your plants are healthy enough to recover in a fair amount of time. This early keep all leaves, if they get too sick they'll naturally fall off. IMHO top these after transplanting and they recover if you wish to top. And when you transplant hit them with a dose of superthrive to get the roots running through the new medium. Seedlings can be tough since they're so fragile, but once they're past that it's smooth sailing.

Appreciate the good vibes and good info Cheshire. I'll take all I can get. Do you think it's a bad idea to try to feed them now?

I guess my question is: do you feed them only when they are starting to show some deficiency? Or will keeping them chalked full of nutes make them grow bigger faster?

 

[ColoradoCheshire]

I'd wait until you transplant before 'feeding' them. I do very little as far as 'feeding' a plant. If you have good soil your best bet is to let your roots spread and break down the yummyness in the soil. Main reason I'm not a fan of hydro, no nutes in water so you HAVE to add them.
Look at Fox Farms products for good organic materials. Also Vermifire soil once they start vegging good.
Feeding nutes should only be done when deficiencies are seen. Having them think it's a 'nute keg party' will make them grow crazy, but the medicine you make will need to be taken with aspirin for the headache. Bud doesn't 'sweat' nutes during a flush so it's going to stay there.

 

[ColoradoCheshire]

As for the yellowing leaves it could be:
1. Overwatering
Or
2. Lower N levels than P K in the soil could do it.
Seedlings really are the toughest part of the grow because they are so delicate. I've gotten mad before and thrown some plants in a dumpster.....My buddy said I was just wigging out and took em out later that day and they still lived fine. But once a sprout is hurt you have to be very careful to keep it alive.

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

I'd wait until you transplant before 'feeding' them. I do very little as far as 'feeding' a plant. If you have good soil your best bet is to let your roots spread and break down the yummyness in the soil. Main reason I'm not a fan of hydro, no nutes in water so you HAVE to add them.
Look at Fox Farms products for good organic materials. Also Vermifire soil once they start vegging good.

Ok so I thought my soil would be ok. see 2nd post for my soil composition. The main thing is that the soil is 2.5+ years old. And to be honest I am not 100% sure its is even that mix. What I am wondering is would it be beneficial to transplant them up to larger containers? In doing so I could be sure that 70%+ of me new soil composition would be good soil. I could also just mix with the soil that they are already, thereby minimizing their exposure to shock? At the end of the day I think altering the soil composition would be worth the risks. I also bought some perlite which I intend to add either way. But im not sure if I should wait to do it or if I should just do ASAP. Any advice here would be appreciated.

The soil holds water well, its been moist for a ~week now. Part of that is certainly attributable to me putting a tray of water on the floor. It worked like a charm to raise humidity, but now the reservoir had dried and the RH is slowly dropping. Still the plants are certainly doing better than they were 2 weeks ago. They are showing some yellowing of the tips. I'm not sure if this is a major concern or could be ongoing as well as how bad it is for the plant?. Should I see it go away or just not spread if it is getting better. I also noticed the tips were wilted where the yellowing was also and seemed dead? For now I hope it is mainly just overwatering. The ph of my tap water is 9.4 not sure how problematic this is. I also intend to drop the lights again soon and every 2-3 days depending on how they are responding.

Ok I have pics of the girls progress. The first girl is Kalishnakova. The lower leaves that were starting to fade to yellow are now starting to shrivel and die. She is showing better vegetative growth, but is still very small. I will also be adding some soil around ber base to encourage her to grow taller. Hopefully a closer light will benefit her too.



The second girl is Jack Herer(2). She is the biggest plant, but also showing the most yellowing of leave tips. Maybe this is related to her growth rate? She also has some discoloration on the left leaf. Still she looks relatively healthy to me.

The 3rd girl is Jack Herer(1). Also looking mostly healthy, but not as big as the other Jack Herer. it has a couple spots of leaf tips yellowing. Her leaves have some interesting curving geometry.


The fourth girl is cheese. Still really small, but she had made strides from where she was 3 weeks ago.


My specs the last 24 hours:


As you can see its been relatively chilly here. I think I will turn the space heater back on.. How does an extra 10 degrees sound?

 

[ColoradoCheshire]

Sorry I didn't reply sooner, phone's being annoying. Looking good. Lower to mid 70's is ideal for where you're at right now. The fact that the soil is older just means more nutrients are unlocked and immediately available to the plant, probably attributed to the early yellowing. Early on use basic happy frog soil, then once they get bigger use happy frog ocean forest or vermifire. Don't worry about adding perlite, all the of the soils I mentioned have generous amounts of perlite for water retention.
You're more than welcome to follow my thread and pick my brain if you have questions. The rule of thumb I have for light spacing is keep it high, but if they start stretching nodes in vegging then lower the lights a few inches a day until your nodes tighten up. Once you're in full veg. you should have a new node showing every day or so. When you flip to 12/12 and they sex every female node from that point is 1-5 axial bud nodes and your cola/colas. If you worry about humidity, misting is the best option. People say it can leave burn spots, but only if you're at like mid 80's for temps. Generously mist until preflowering is done, then keep the humidity under 45% tops. Hope this helps some.

 

[ColoradoCheshire]

In full veg. I've had humidity up to 80-90% with no problems. But my setup is different. I run a closed 600w with ducting and a fan and some shop lights in a 6x6x6 Mylar tent. I know LEDs aren't meant for high humidity applications so you'll have to be the judge on how much humidity those units can be exposed to.

 

[TheSonsofHarpy]

Sorry I didn't reply sooner.

No worries. I'm just glad that someone is looking and giving me a little guidance. I do appreciate it. I will check on the girls later this evening and possibly post an update.

 

[MerionMatt]

IMO they look terrible because #1 why were there 3 seeds in your starter pots? Should have been in their own pots and #2 were transplanted into bigger pots way too early. Should have let them grow a little before the shock of repotting. Probably will catch up but not off to a good start!