Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I don't know why you think it's a US based forum - the internet's a big place, mate 
5x5 LED - T-Time grow time
- Thread starter T-Time
- Start date
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
Interesting, that would be a very hot mix on most nutrient lines and plants that size wouldn't like it.
Something in the megacrop must register high in ec without causing burns etc.
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
Don't see the issue, Blue Lab and other pens convert to 700.
EC is a more universal language but it is @T-Time 's thread so he can use whatever measure he wants
wietefras
Well-Known Member
Geez I ask a simple question, because I suspect a conversion mixup and I get the third degree from the keyboards warriors squad. What the fuck?
Yes, but he's surprised his PPM is so high when his EC values looks perfectly reasonable to me.it is @T-Time 's thread so he can use whatever measure he wants
T-Time
Well-Known Member
Easy guys 
No need for that. I've started using .7 conversion when I first got my pen. It was set up like this from the factory and I didn't know how to change the setting or knew that there was other settings, so it stuck. I didn't knew it was australian, chinese , french or american. Later on I've learned that there are other conversion factors and cause some ppl use EC some ppm i always state at which conversion I'm measuring. If its easier for You to read EC, its fine with me. I will be stating the EC
No need for that. I've started using .7 conversion when I first got my pen. It was set up like this from the factory and I didn't know how to change the setting or knew that there was other settings, so it stuck. I didn't knew it was australian, chinese , french or american. Later on I've learned that there are other conversion factors and cause some ppl use EC some ppm i always state at which conversion I'm measuring. If its easier for You to read EC, its fine with me. I will be stating the EC
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
You run an ec of 2.2 on plants that young?
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
wietefras
Well-Known Member
Like I said I was wondering more if that wasn't a reason why you thought the ppm was too high. Since you'll get higher ppm calculated values when using 700 rather than 500 based ppm values mentioned here (usually)Easy guys
No need for that. I've started using .7 conversion when I first got my pen.
I use EC myself and I've used an EC of 2.3 in veg recently under leds (usually the max is about 1.
. In veg they get 18 hours of light and a lot of it with these leds. So for me they tend to need the highest nutrient levels in late veg. Otherwise the EC of my DWC system keeps dropping like a stone.Never understood why feeding schedules use lower levels in veg and then increase at switch over to 12/12. They get 33% less light with 12 hours and I always need to drop nutrient levels by a similar percentage.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I guess the easy answer to that is, if you're using a recirculating system your plants are going to use up the nutrient faster as they get bigger. It's the same reason you can get away with light feeding when the plants are young and need to increase it as they get older.
In coco, when I switch over I use the same amount of nutrient initially and then bump it a little after two weeks but gradually start to reduce it in the last couple of weeks as nutrient levels rise in the coco and new flower production slows.
Mind you, I've never used an EC or TDS meter - I just watch the plants and get a feel for what different strains need at different stages of growth. If I go a bit hard initially, I know to back it off on the next grow.
wietefras
Well-Known Member
How is that an easy answer to what I said?
They clearly need more nutrients before the switch to 12/12 and they need less after since they get 33% less light from one day to the next. Or seen another way they get 50% more light over a whole day in veg. Yet the schedules all ramp up the nutrients from the moment you switch to 12/12 and keep it going well up for weeks into flower. My plants have never wanted that. Nothing like that at all. Highest EC in late veg, then a steep drop at switch over, then hold that level, until late flower where the uptake drops even further.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Because the hard answer means explaining basic plant physiology and the fact that plants do not photosynthesize the entire time they are exposed to light, that they use stored sugars generated from photosynthetic carbohydrates for cell division during the dark, that they continue to uptake nutrient during the dark, and that the transition from vegetative to flowering state is one of the most active periods of the plant's life when nutrient requirements suddenly increase as the plant stretches and produces hormones in preparation for flowering.
All that stretching literally happens overnight.
Never mind that EC is just a number that measures salt (nutrient) concentration in a solution, it is the plant that determines how much of that nutrient is absorbed. In a recirculating system, EC is simply a measure of available nutrient - that availability can go up or down, but it's only when it falls below the plant's nutrient requirements, or increases to the point where reverse osmosis begins to draw moisture from the plant, that it actually interferes with plant growth.
In a run-to-waste system, the plant takes only the nutrient it requires and the rest is (mostly) flushed away. EC then becomes relatively moot - unless you are measuring it at the root zone - because you are not using it to measure the fall of nutrient availability in a recirculating reservoir. You set it once, and then adjust it based on a number of factors, such as runoff volume, transpiration (temperature, humidity, wind evaporation), and stage of growth. Ie; reading the plant.
You're a smart fella - I'm sure you understand that photoperiods are only part of the equation. Plants grow at night, they flower at night, they transpire at night, they produce cannabinods at night, they uptake water and nutrient at night - the only thing they don't do is photosynthesise carbohydrates, because those same byproducts of photosynthesis are the sugars used by the plant to conduct all these activities during the dark period (and why plants use oxygen and produce carbon dioxide at night).
All that stretching literally happens overnight.
Never mind that EC is just a number that measures salt (nutrient) concentration in a solution, it is the plant that determines how much of that nutrient is absorbed. In a recirculating system, EC is simply a measure of available nutrient - that availability can go up or down, but it's only when it falls below the plant's nutrient requirements, or increases to the point where reverse osmosis begins to draw moisture from the plant, that it actually interferes with plant growth.
In a run-to-waste system, the plant takes only the nutrient it requires and the rest is (mostly) flushed away. EC then becomes relatively moot - unless you are measuring it at the root zone - because you are not using it to measure the fall of nutrient availability in a recirculating reservoir. You set it once, and then adjust it based on a number of factors, such as runoff volume, transpiration (temperature, humidity, wind evaporation), and stage of growth. Ie; reading the plant.
You're a smart fella - I'm sure you understand that photoperiods are only part of the equation. Plants grow at night, they flower at night, they transpire at night, they produce cannabinods at night, they uptake water and nutrient at night - the only thing they don't do is photosynthesise carbohydrates, because those same byproducts of photosynthesis are the sugars used by the plant to conduct all these activities during the dark period (and why plants use oxygen and produce carbon dioxide at night).
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Of course, the other simple answer is: indoor growers have been using those same EC guidelines for decades to no ill-effect. If what you say is true, why don't the nutrient manufacturers - who employ chemists and botanists to test their products on real plants - adjust their guidelines accordingly?
In my mind, if something works it works. If there's a better way, then the results will prove themselves.
In my mind, if something works it works. If there's a better way, then the results will prove themselves.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
OK, this is someone else's thread and I'm mindful of turbo-posting and/or going off on a tangent - this argument is perhaps best left for another thread.
However, here is a study of hydroponic tomato plants that proves that in fact plants use a higher concentration of nutrient to water consumption during the dark period than during the light period. Meaning they actually require a higher EC at night than during the day (because they are transpiring more during the day).
Apologies to Mr T-Time - I'll leave it at that.
However, here is a study of hydroponic tomato plants that proves that in fact plants use a higher concentration of nutrient to water consumption during the dark period than during the light period. Meaning they actually require a higher EC at night than during the day (because they are transpiring more during the day).
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jjshs1925/60/3/60_3_547/_pdf
Apologies to Mr T-Time - I'll leave it at that.
Cold$moke
Well-Known Member
Looking tits bud
Randomblame
Well-Known Member
I like short, but relevant content conversations. Good way to learn and profit!!!
Not the endless discussions alá GLR / nf2g, with lots of insults..
but short, concise and full of truth!
Each one would be glad if his/her thread were so clean and free of useless conversation.
Not the endless discussions alá GLR / nf2g, with lots of insults..
but short, concise and full of truth!
Each one would be glad if his/her thread were so clean and free of useless conversation.
Cold$moke
Well-Known Member
It did bring this to the first page helping.me.find it again hahaI like short, but relevant content conversations. Good way to learn and profit!!!
Not the endless discussions alá GLR / nf2g, with lots of insults..
but short, concise and full of truth!
Each one would be glad if his/her thread were so clean and free of useless conversation.
Randomblame
Well-Known Member
There should be a "watch the thread" button in the upper right corner. Easy way to stay informed!
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Funny how running EC down for both veg and bloom has shown better results for me of late. My buddy's ebb n flood grow- one that I set up for him and help him maintain- went from EC 2.4 down to 1.6 in both veg and bloom stage with no ill effects. Yield and quality were either similar or better.