5x5 LED - T-Time grow time

Prawn Connery

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
Like I said, EC is just a number. Just because a certain amount of nutrient is available to the plant, doesn't mean it will use it all. Never mind TDS/EC meters measure total salt concentrations and don't actually tell you which salts are present in what ratios. You could well be within your "EC limits" and have a toxic concentration of phosphorous with no calcium or magnesium - that's not going to end well.

Which is one of the reasons I've never used EC/TDS meters. However, I don't grow in a recirculating system, so I don't need to worry about it too much.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Prawn Connery said:
Like I said, EC is just a number. Just because a certain amount of nutrient is available to the plant, doesn't mean it will use it all. Never mind TDS/EC meters measure total salt concentrations and don't actually tell you which salts are present in what ratios. You could well be within your "EC limits" and have a toxic concentration of phosphorous with no calcium or magnesium - that's not going to end well.

Which is one of the reasons I've never used EC/TDS meters. However, I don't grow in a recirculating system, so I don't need to worry about it too much.
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Ebb n flood is a recirculating system and proper nutrient ratios aren't hard to attain these days.

You'll notice that I'm not saying you're wrong, just that high EC isn't required when the rest is dialed in.
 
Prawn Connery

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
I completely agree. A well-balanced nutrient for a particular stage of growth is likely to show a lower EC for optimum growth as there would be no excess ratio of salts in solution.

EC's just a guide to how well the plant is feeding and when to replenish nutrient in a closed system. But as we all know, you still have dump your reservoir and start afresh on a regular basis because your EC/TDS meter doesn't tell you exactly what's in the tank or how much build-up there is of potentially toxic elements.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Prawn Connery said:
I completely agree. A well-balanced nutrient for a particular stage of growth is likely to show a lower EC for optimum growth as there would be no excess ratio of salts in solution.

EC's just a guide to how well the plant is feeding and when to replenish nutrient in a closed system. But as we all know, you still have dump your reservoir and start afresh on a regular basis because your EC/TDS meter doesn't tell you exactly what's in the tank or how much build-up there is of potentially toxic elements.
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True. That interval grows longer the closer to optimum your nutrient mix is.

That ebb n flood setup gets a changeout once a cycle, about ten weeks or so.

The rest of the time it just gets topped up with the same ratio of nutrients, EC reset to 1.5 or so and run it. Stoooopid simple!
 
Prawn Connery

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
I wonder if you'd get better results if you changed more often? Are you using RO water? Most tap water has salt in it which builds up due to evaporation the longer you let it run.

But let me just reiterate: if something works, it works! You won't get any argument out of me! :bigjoint:
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Prawn Connery said:
I wonder if you'd get better results if you changed more often? Are you using RO water? Most tap water has salt in it which builds up due to evaporation the longer you let it run.

But let me just reiterate: if something works, it works! You won't get any argument out of me! :bigjoint:
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Better results than green plants and good yields after 10 weeks? They don't want something they're constantly having to screw with; they wanted as close to autopilot as possible and this system delivers!
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Humple said:
Man... I respect you hydro growers, and can appreciate the tinkering and setup, but I'll stick with LOS! (Though I might give DWC a shot one of these days.)
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Whatever works for you! I'm not the guy who says it's my way or the highway; I've seen too many wildly different, yet highly successful grows for that.
 
wietefras

wietefras

Well-Known Member
Prawn Connery said:
However, here is a study of hydroponic tomato plants that proves that in fact plants use a higher concentration of nutrient to water consumption during the dark period than during the light period. Meaning they actually require a higher EC at night than during the day (because they are transpiring more during the day).
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So how is this relevant? is no relation between the two. At night they barely take up water at all. So yes then they will relatively take up more nutrients than water with lights out, but that's a tiny amount to of their total nutrient intake. My plants drink 6 liters of water per m2 during the day and 500ml during the night. The drop in EC overnight is not easy to measure since it's so small.

Plants do take up more nutrients when they get a lot of light then when they get a bit of light. That's where the big difference is and it's easily quantifiable with a regular EC meter.
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Humple said:
Man... I respect you hydro growers, and can appreciate the tinkering and setup, but I'll stick with LOS! (Though I might give DWC a shot one of these days.)
Click to expand...

I've been a confident soil grower for many many years but I can no longer close my eyes to the truth, I have seen too many incredible good results and tasted and compared bud quality.
I've finally decided to switch to a coco DTW system.
I got an Octogrow system for free(eight 8,5l pots, wick system + 4" deep insert pan + root barrier, 110x 55cm), which I can easily convert. Needs some time to order pumps, tank and stuff but till the end of the year it should be done. Maybe earlier!
@Prawn Connery
It will be my first hydro experience, so please do not be mad with me if I ask you a 2nd hole in your booboo, lol!
Lots of your wisdome I've already sucked up from your GoP threads but I'm pretty sure there is still enough room to get issues... at least for an assie like me. But at least I am determined to become a master...sometime...!
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
I've been a confident soil grower for many many years but I can no longer close my eyes to the truth, I have seen too many incredible good results and tasted and compared bud quality.
I've finally decided to switch to a coco DTW system.
I got an Octogrow system for free(eight 8,5l pots, wick system + 4" deep insert pan + root barrier, 110x 55cm), which I can easily convert. Needs some time to order pumps, tank and stuff but till the end of the year it should be done. Maybe earlier!
@Prawn Connery
It will be my first hydro experience, so please do not be mad with me if I ask you a 2nd hole in your booboo, lol!
Lots of your wisdome I've already sucked up from your GoP threads but I'm pretty sure there is still enough room to get issues... at least for an assie like me. But at least I am determined to become a master...sometime...!
Click to expand...
If it's hard you're doing it wrong. Simplify and you'll be fine.
 
SSGrower

SSGrower

Well-Known Member
T-Time said:
Guys...
Just keep the conversation civil and I won't mind if You post here :)

:peace:
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Nice light. Does the rack move or how do you work on plants?

As a soil grower I appreciate the info and (I won't say short but) reasonable length posts discussing ec, PPM, tds....
 
Humple

Humple

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
I've been a confident soil grower for many many years but I can no longer close my eyes to the truth, I have seen too many incredible good results and tasted and compared bud quality.
I've finally decided to switch to a coco DTW system.
I got an Octogrow system for free(eight 8,5l pots, wick system + 4" deep insert pan + root barrier, 110x 55cm), which I can easily convert. Needs some time to order pumps, tank and stuff but till the end of the year it should be done. Maybe earlier!
@Prawn Connery
It will be my first hydro experience, so please do not be mad with me if I ask you a 2nd hole in your booboo, lol!
Lots of your wisdome I've already sucked up from your GoP threads but I'm pretty sure there is still enough room to get issues... at least for an assie like me. But at least I am determined to become a master...sometime...!
Click to expand...
Yield and time are the two aspects of hydro that appeal to me. But the prospect of messing with pumps, hoses, and bottled nutrients keeps me in soil, at least for the time being. Also, I'm given to understand that organic hydro is a bit more challenging than synthetic? The wife does insist on organic meds...
 
Cold$moke

Cold$moke

Well-Known Member
Humple said:
Yield and time are the two aspects of hydro that appeal to me. But the prospect of messing with pumps, hoses, and bottled nutrients keeps me in soil, at least for the time being. Also, I'm given to understand that organic hydro is a bit more challenging than synthetic? The wife does insist on organic meds...
Click to expand...
Hydro can be as complicated or simple as you like it to be

.......although its a long road after you get hooked on hydro :)
 
Prawn Connery

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
Well, most soil growers add nutrient/fertiliser at some point, so there's not a lot of difference. In many respects hydro is easier than soil because a good nutrient takes a lot of the guesswork out of feeding - just follow the directions! It's as easy as mixing up a bucket of water with a few ml per litre of Part A and Part B and adding a few drops of pH Down (usually) or pH Up to bring your pH to around 5.8.

Perhaps the easiest way to start would be to simply fill your soil pots with coco and hand-water using an organic-based hydro nutrient like BioCanna or Canadian Xpress (CX). I use CX, which is made up of a mineral salt micronutrient Part A and an organic macronutrient part B, so it's not completely organic like BioCanna, but I've used it for over 10 years with great results. Prior to that I used a fully organic nutrient (A&B Organics), but they went out of business.

You can buy a small pond pump from any hardware store, as well as a digital timer, and then all you need is a reservoir (I prefer food grade plastic) and away you go. Again, run-to-waste is easy because you don't really need to keep check of your reservoir once you've set it up - it just keeps watering the plants, which take the nutrients they need, and the rest is flushed out. All you need to do is top up with fresh nutrient solution and maybe check your pH every now and then (as it will gradually rise in an organic system).

DWC is perhaps the easiest form of hydro and for that all you need is a bucket and an aquarium air pump. You will see the difference in growth straight away. DWC only gets tricky if you grow in a hot environment and have to manage your nutrient temperature. You can still use organic based nutrients if you like. Some people even make their own. Again, it can be as simple as adding Part A and Part B, or as complex as making your own organic tea.
 
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