Jacks (JR Peters) nutrients

[shahomy]

The MKP (monopotassium phosphate) I see being talked about here, is the jacks product 5-50-18 UltraViolet, the same thing?
if so, what weeks during flower would you give it?

 

[Dave455]

I literally just finished mapping out my feedcharts and have ordered the final 2 products I need to complete my regimen. Well, I still might need/want to get Silica, but haven't found what I'm looking for so I'll use the rest of my GH silica till I find what I'm looking for. Also, I'd like @im4satori to verify my charts to make sure everything is everything as they say. I did my best to keep the errors to a minimum and believe I got them very close.

Also, here are links to products in my charts minus Epsom Salt because you can find that at your local local pharmacy.

Jack's A Pro 5-12-26 (non-discrete shipping)
Jack's B Calcium Nitrate (non-discrete shipping)
*Biomin Chelated Calcium Powder (discrete shipping)
*Magnesium Nitrate (discrete shipping)
MKP (discrete shipping)

I also use a Fulvic Humic Kelp Blend at a 1/4 TSP per gallon.

View attachment 4207287 View attachment 4207288 View attachment 4207289

Megacrop

 

[Skybound420]

The MKP (monopotassium phosphate) I see being talked about here, is the jacks product 5-50-18 UltraViolet, the same thing?
if so, what weeks during flower would you give it?

MKP is just K and P, no N or micros. It basically the same thing as GH dry Koolbloom.

 

[Skybound420]

Megacrop

I'm chatting with some growers on 420 that are using megacrop and say they like it, but when running it through hydrobuddy, it shows to me lacking in the levels and will definitely need to be built out much like Jacks 321. Surprisingly though, megacrop has everything in one bag, calcium and silica too. I was under the impression that calcium must be properly chelated or it will bond with macros and sulfur?

 

[shahomy]

MKP is just K and P, no N or micros. It basically the same thing as GH dry Koolbloom.

Thanks for the reply.
Plz forgive my ignorance here, but this is actually a serious question...Is there a reason to use the MKP from kelp4less(or where ever) over the Jacks UltraViolet? is it for number crunching in hydrobuddy/being able to control each element?
jacks is $27 for 2.2lbs/1 kilo and the MKP is $17.85 for 1lb...is there a reason you wouldn`t want the micro`s?
thanks again

 

[Skybound420]

Thanks for the reply.
Plz forgive my ignorance here, but this is actually a serious question...Is there a reason to use the MKP from kelp4less(or where ever) over the Jacks UltraViolet? is it for number crunching in hydrobuddy/being able to control each element?
jacks is $27 for 2.2lbs/1 kilo and the MKP is $17.85 for 1lb...is there a reason you wouldn`t want the micro`s?
thanks again

The ultra violet mix has micros mixed in which makes it a Part A, like Jack's Hydro, ChemGro, or MegaCrop. MKP is a supplemental source of P and K that adds P and K to your Part A. I bought my MKP from Kelp4Less simply because I was ordering other things there, but as far as I can tell, MKP is the same regardless of who puts their name on it.

https://www.jacksnutrients.com/online-store/5-50-18-UltraViolet-p101272612

Edit - I wouldn't want the micros if I already had a source for micros (Jack's Hydro). If I choose to later ad micros, I will find a product that has only micros and make very very small adjustments as I don't want to overdo the micros, and since I'm still collecting data of ranges for the trace micros, I don't foresee myself doing that anytime soon.

For the sake of discussion, if you wanted to use the ultraviolet mix, you would likely need to drop the Jack's hydro from the list so as to not have two Part A's in one mix.

 

[Skybound420]

Just because the UV has elevated levels of K and P, doesn't make it a comparable product to MKP. Cal Nit has more in common with MKP in that it also only has 2 elements in the mix. All bloom nutes that I've seen say right on the bottle "derived from monopotassium phosphate".

 

[shahomy]

about the fulvic/humic/kelp FHK blends...whats the kelp for? iron or iodine? and do I need it?
I`m using well water(about 110ppms is all) and peatmoss/promix/equiv
and the jacks individual grow kit.
Been using full line of Humboldt snakeoils since day one...bout 5 years ago...definitly grew some awesome bud, but always had tons of yellowing/then brown leaves/onthefloor…was at week 5 bud using Humboldt snakeoils, and switched to jacks.They have had 3 feedings since then, and I believe the yellowing is stopping and reversing already...totally geeked about using these new nutes, staying green till end, and the $$$ savings...
2 of the many bottles I have are fulvic and humic acids-Flavorful and Humbolt, but I always thought of kelp as being used in organic grows....can this stuff help me in peat/soilless/not organic?
my knowledge is very limited on plant biology and/or even using right terminology and what I think I know is probably wrong...
So, I thought that organic matter(like kelp) had to be broken down by microbial herd, mycocorrhizae, for plants to consume. Organic grows. I thought that synthetic nutes(like I`m using?jacks individual grow)would kill the "herd" making whatsever in the organic material (like kelp)not available to the plants...
So yeah, can it still help me?
thanks again

 

[shahomy]

Just because the UV has elevated levels of K and P, doesn't make it a comparable product to MKP. Cal Nit has more in common with MKP in that it also only has 2 elements in the mix. All bloom nutes that I've seen say right on the bottle "derived from monopotassium phosphate".

the jacks UV does say derived from monopotassium phosphate

 

[shahomy]

The ultra violet mix has micros mixed in which makes it a Part A, like Jack's Hydro, ChemGro, or MegaCrop. MKP is a supplemental source of P and K that adds P and K to your Part A. I bought my MKP from Kelp4Less simply because I was ordering other things there, but as far as I can tell, MKP is the same regardless of who puts their name on it.

https://www.jacksnutrients.com/online-store/5-50-18-UltraViolet-p101272612

Edit - I wouldn't want the micros if I already had a source for micros (Jack's Hydro). If I choose to later ad micros, I will find a product that has only micros and make very very small adjustments as I don't want to overdo the micros, and since I'm still collecting data of ranges for the trace micros, I don't foresee myself doing that anytime soon.

For the sake of discussion, if you wanted to use the ultraviolet mix, you would likely need to drop the Jack's hydro from the list so as to not have two Part A's in one mix.

I shoulda mentioned I`m using the jacks kit "individual grow". and I`m a user of there feeding schedule they have shown. Of the 4 kits listed on jacks page this one is the only kit that suggested the UV as an addon'
I will give them a call and ask when/which week of bud to start using. and if to be used in conjunction or instead of one of the products in the feeding schedule.
thanks for reply

 

[Skybound420]

@im4satori I'd like to know your thoughts about what I have here. Aside from the slightly high P, do you have any concerns about the levels of micros I have in there?

 

[im4satori]

@im4satori I'd like to know your thoughts about what I have here. Aside from the slightly high P, do you have any concerns about the levels of micros I have in there?

View attachment 4222557

no that looks fine

as long as your P is half your K or less youll be fine on the P... those NPK ratios ive run them specific the same as yours just recently

for my set up I found 90ppm N a tad high and plan to lower it to 80 -85 ppm next run

for whatever reason I get best results at EC1.2... when I go up to 1.4 i start to see accumulation the medium

but that's my room and it could be different for you easily

 

[Skybound420]

No, your desired EC coincides with my experiences in rock wool over the years. What strain(s) are you growing that lead to slight N tox, and when did you notice it?
I've read to drop N at the end of bloom, but IDK by how much. Also, high P is new to me as well. K is high throughout, correct?
Which element is responsible for tric production?
I've noticed a reduction when switching from the GH line to mixing my own, and now having the ability to nail down damn near every element,
I'd really like to challenge the tric producing element(s), because honestly, when is too many trichomes ever a bad thing?

 

[im4satori]

No, your desired EC coincides with my experiences in rock wool over the years. What strain(s) are you growing that lead to slight N tox, and when did you notice it?
I've read to drop N at the end of bloom, but IDK by how much. Also, high P is new to me as well. K is high throughout, correct?
Which element is responsible for tric production?
I've noticed a reduction when switching from the GH line to mixing my own, and now having the ability to nail down damn near every element,
I'd really like to challenge the tric producing element(s), because honestly, when is too many trichomes ever a bad thing?

i think trichs are going to be very dependent on strain or genetics to a large degree

im not a person who tries to trick a plant into doing something... i look at it as give the plant every reason to be healthy and genetics do the rest..

cold temps can increase trichs, but im not sure or have never experienced or maybe i just haven't meddled with it (trying to change trichs with nutes)

ive heard some people say an increase in Mn can do some thing but im not sure

i have so many strains running its stupid, so some want more N some want less lol

 

[Skybound420]

After some time with the Jacks, I find that at least Zinc is very low. By including the Flora Micro nutes in with the JKack's schedule, I am able to bring my levels up to comparable ranges of the GH Flora line at 0.7 strength which is about what I used for years. My Triple Cheese in early bloom was showing signs of Zn deficiency with twisted new growth and spotted leaves with pinholes. I also suspect that this lead to diminished yields in past Kush harvests. Also, I should point out that because I use quite a few other products aside from just Jacks, CalNite and Epsom, my levels of Jack's is much closer to 1 gram per gallon which might help account for reduced levels of micros. The more traditional Jacks recipes have Jacks at 2.4g/Gal, 3g/Gal or 3.6g/Gal, whereas my charts have Jacks at about 1.2g/Gal. I'm interested to know anybody else's micro nutrient levels (in PPM) to compare and update my notes. Here are my finding so far. I got my base values from Hoagland's and Steiner's bloom schedules, then compared GH mid bloom .7 strength, and my early bloom after that full strength, and I notice the micro levels landed near identical which is assuring. FWIW, I didn't target any of those, I just targeted Iron at 2ppm and the remaining micros concluded according to the levels in the bottle.

Ca 65 - 90----------------------------------(GH=115.575)
Mg 40 - 50--------------------------(GH=66.685)
S 50 - 80 *** (lowered from 64/14---(GH=36.3)
---
Fe 1.5 - 2
B 0.5 - 2.0 ***----(GH=0.139, E-Bloom=0.264)
Mn 0.5 - 2.0 ***---(GH=0.693, E-Bloom=0.681)
Zn .05 - 0.2 ***---(GH=0.208, E-Bloom=0.204)-(NOTE: 0.08 is too low)
Cu .02 - 0.5 ***---(GH=0.138, E-Bloom=0.152)
Mo .01 - 0.1 ***---(GH=0.111, E-Bloom=0.144)

 

[im4satori]

Fe 1.5 - 2 (1.7)
B 0.5 - 2.0 (0.5)
Mn 0.5 - 2.0 (0.7)
Zn .05 - 0.2 (0.5)
Cu .02 - 0.5 (0.16)
Mo .01 - 0.1 (0.08

looks like we are gonna have to do some work on tinkering with these numbers and see if it makes any changes

I have heard high Mn can increase ripening

strangely, my last grow I accidentally measure the zinc wrong (high) and just let it ride
strange thing was it seemed like they turned amber a week sooner

ive run the zinc as high as 1.0

 

[Skybound420]

Great! That's exactly the kind of info I seek. FYI, those numbers I have are just starting points that I pulled from Hoagland's and Steiner's bloom formulas, but I do intend to hone each out till better ranges are discovered. I've already verified that 0.08 for Zinc is much too low, and I suspect that anything in the hundredths range will also be too low. My current mixup has Zinc at 0.2xx which is almost 3 times the strength and I'm being vigilant in watching for continued Zn def symptoms. My studies suggests that too much Zn will kill a plant, though IDK at what strength do we approach the fatal strength.

Also, for knowledge sake, silica should be in the 30ppm range, not 50-80. That I learned when crunching the GH silica at the full 2.5ml(g) strength. I'll adjust my notes for that right now.

 

[im4satori]

Iron Fe 1.98151
Boron B 0.35667
Manganese Mn 2.11361
Zinc Zn 1.18890
Molybdenum Mo 0.01057
Copper Cu 0.60766

above is what peters micro nute mix puts out at 0.1 grams per gallon
I have used this micro mix for years for direct addition and never had trouble
you can see the Mn and zinc are very high


another thing I will mention; theres a relationship between iron and zinc and depending on the type or source of iron used might require an increase in zinc
ive read that if using iron dtpa youll want a higher zinc

 

[Skybound420]

I may have misdiagnosed Zinc for Mag. Aside from more searching, I wanted more reference and I think I'll be raising Mg and S in my future feeds.

 

[im4satori]

also

the mix you have listed for GH is much higher than what anyone would want to use, id figure for 5ml per gallon of the micro part to make a fair comparison