Another gun thread

[canndo]

That is the sort of big question for which I do not have the answer. But the big questions, they do glisten.

But there are acceptable ways of dealing with that existential angst and unacceptable ways. I see nothing about the abject addiction to one's cell phone. Harmless diversion? Hardly, phones cause family discord, auto accidents, "loss of productivity" and apparently, coupled with social media that seems inevitable, suicides.

But that is just whataboutism unless it is merely a parallel.

My objection, yet again, is placing drug users and their particular substances into moralistic categories.

That the act of passing judgement, regardless of those categories is merely another form if bigotry.

Maintaining that you passed up on an opiate addiction and were somehow superior or lucky so you are OK is little different than "I have friends who are black...but the others...well..."

(I am not saying you yourself made any such atatement)

 

[canndo]

I’m being a bit reactive.

You are just posting stuff on a web site same as i.

 

[CatHedral]

But there are acceptable ways of dealing with that existential angst and unacceptable ways. I see nothing about the abject addiction to one's cell phone. Harmless diversion? Hardly, phones cause family discord, auto accidents, "loss of productivity" and apparently, coupled with social media that seems inevitable, suicides.

But that is just whataboutism unless it is merely a parallel.

My objection, yet again, is placing drug users and their particular substances into moralistic categories.

That the act of passing judgement, regardless of those categories is merely another form if bigotry.

Maintaining that you passed up on an opiate addiction and were somehow superior or lucky so you are OK is little different than "I have friends who are black...but the others...well..."

(I am not saying you yourself made any such atatement)

Yeah I do hope I do not come off that way. The take home for me is that there are as many stories as there are people.

As for phones or casinos or shopping TV, “substanceless” addiction is a thing.

 

[CatHedral]

You are just posting stuff on a web site same as i.

Even so I am hoping to contribute to a discussion of stuff that matters. I get that sort of vibe from you.

 

[canndo]

Even so I am hoping to contribute to a discussion of stuff that matters. I get that sort of vibe from you.

Thanks, I think. I'm sitting in the cold having a cigar and posting the culmination of thoughts and ideas sourced from 69 years of listening to others and thinking..."wait, that can't be right...can it?"

 

[CatHedral]

Thanks, I think. I'm sitting in the cold having a cigar and posting the culmination of thoughts and ideas sourced from 69 years of listening to others and thinking..."wait, that can't be right...can it?"

The compliment is real.
I’m sitting in the cold also (warm means propane means money I don’t want to spend) but no cigar, just some Irish Cream.

 

[canndo]

Yeah I do hope I do not come off that way. The take home for me is that there are as many stories as there are people.

As for phones or casinos or shopping TV, “substanceless” addiction is a thing.

I don't know, I am beginning to suspect that there are actually only ten or twelve stories we tell ourselves and others and just a lot of minor variations.

Most of them involve being a victim, some being heroic in the face of victimhood but not having heard ALL stories, I could be wrong.

 

[CatHedral]

I don't know, I am beginning to suspect that there are actually only ten or twelve stories we tell ourselves and others and just a lot of minor variations.

Most of them involve being a victim, some being heroic in the face of victimhood but not having heard ALL stories, I could be wrong.

I have heard something quite analogous from someone who worked in psych.

There are only twelve stories in the psych ward.
I’m thinking there could be a human constant here.

 

[canndo]

I have heard something quite analogous from someone who worked in psych.

There are only twelve stories in the psych ward.
I’m thinking there could be a human constant here.

Most times, in a conversation I hear folk never talking to me. They talk to themselves, they talk to their parents, their ex wives, God, some guy they never really knew but wish they had acted differently toward. It's not an indictment, it is just a strange observation, maybe a part if the human equation.

"You play the hand you were dealt" never issues from the fortunate.

"I am a dick because....(fill in the blank) did me wrong."

"I am rich because I refused to be a victim (which makes him a product of his own reaction and thus a victim"

"My dad was an alcoholic.."

"I'm deaf..."

"I'm sick, so I can't be compasionate"

"I'm disabled so.. I am compasionate"

All stories one can hear ringing through all they say.

 

[CatHedral]

Most times, in a conversation I hear folk never talking to me. They talk to themselves, they talk to their parents, their ex wives, God, some guy they never really knew but wish they had acted differently toward. It's not an indictment, it is just a strange observation, maybe a part if the human equation.

"You play the hand you were dealt" never issues from the fortunate.

"I am a dick because....(fill in the blank) did me wrong."

"I am rich because I refused to be a victim (which makes him a product of his own reaction and thus a victim"

"My dad was an alcoholic.."

"I'm deaf..."

"I'm sick, so I can't be compasionate"

"I'm disabled so.. I am compasionate"

All stories one can hear ringing through all they say.

Victimhood is a heady liquor. I’ve abused it.

 

[Fogdog]

And "no one really intends to make abortion illegal".

I think it is reasonable to ask for names when somebody makes a loaded statement like that.

Overturning Roe v Wade is a proxy for making abortion illegal.

228 GOP lawmakers call on Supreme Court to overturn Roe v. Wade

228 GOP lawmakers call on Supreme Court to overturn Roe v. Wade | CNN Politics

Nearly 230 Republican members of Congress told the Supreme Court on Thursday that it should overturn Roe v. Wade and release its "vise grip on abortion politics."

www.cnn.com

Regarding gun laws. What national leader is seriously talking about taking guns away?

 

[CatHedral]

I think it is reasonable to ask for names when somebody makes a loaded statement like that.

Regarding gun laws. What national leader is seriously talking about taking guns away?

To my knowledge, none. But a year ago one planned to undo Social Security. That shivered me. So I’m not willing to be complacent.

 

[Fogdog]

To my knowledge, none. But a year ago one planned to undo Social Security. That shivered me. So I’m not willing to be complacent.

Republicans have been working on undoing social security since its creation.

I can name names. Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell for beginners. I can't name anybody in Congress today who are calling for taking guns away from gun owners.

 

[CatHedral]

Republicans have been working on undoing social security since its creation.

I can name names. Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell for beginners. I can't name anybody in Congress today who are calling for taking guns away from gun owners.

It makes me a bit regretful that I did identify as Republican. I chose a rosy misrepresentation, it turns out.

 

[Budley Doright]

“Their taking our guns” Is the call to arms against enacting even the most sensible gun ownership laws.

 

[Roger A. Shrubber]

Still, your insinuation was that neatly all of "them", the poor, the guileless, the weak willed, the immoral, are due some special protection that limits everyone else in its wake.

I have a doctor friend, she decided never ever to prescribe opiates ever again. Forget about their back pain, their withering skeletal muscle agony, no, because of the current sentiment, that this class of drug but no other is evil, she condemns her patients to relentless pain.

"Nothing could be worse than ADDICTION" She says, ignoring the process of treatment, one step at a time.

Imagine the horror of such an artificial distinction. "You shall suffer the discomfort I and I alone shall decree as acceptable".

This isn't the first time we'll meaning but thoughtless people have opted to moralizing sickness. This is little different than claiming guys deserve hiv. Slots deserve herpies, singling out a particular illness as actually a weakness, a personal failing is wrong-headed and frankly sanctimonious.

It has always been so. Anti Coffee drinkers, temperance unions, anti pot smokers, they all have a story that in the end makes them and theirs superior.

as to sanctimony...it seems more like you're trying to justify your habits, normalize them, than that i'm trying to demonize anyone or anything. if you can deal with taking meth or heroin, then you be you...just remember, not everyone can deal with it, so for every 5 users you know, statistically, one of them is going to crash and burn.
i'm not against giving people in pain medication, including opiates. but they need to be prescribed for a limited amount of time, and the people taking them need to be monitored. if they have a chronic condition, and have to take it forever, they should never be prescribed more than a months worth at a time, and any thefts should be required to be reported immediately. i know people that farm doctors for pain pills, and have done so for a long time, that needs to be stopped, there should be some registry that keeps track of people prescribed opiates, and pop all kinds of red flags if their names turn up in multiple places. some prevention would stop a lot of people from getting addicted to begin with, and free up more resources for those that still do.

 

[CatHedral]

“Their taking our guns” Is the call to arms against enacting even the most sensible gun ownership laws.

I’m hoping there is a workable middle ground. While I don’t think there is currently a confiscation danger, the future is open. I’d like to retain personal firearm rights and still be a cooperative sort of citizen.

 

[Roger A. Shrubber]

But there are acceptable ways of dealing with that existential angst and unacceptable ways. I see nothing about the abject addiction to one's cell phone. Harmless diversion? Hardly, phones cause family discord, auto accidents, "loss of productivity" and apparently, coupled with social media that seems inevitable, suicides.

But that is just whataboutism unless it is merely a parallel.

My objection, yet again, is placing drug users and their particular substances into moralistic categories.

That the act of passing judgement, regardless of those categories is merely another form if bigotry.

Maintaining that you passed up on an opiate addiction and were somehow superior or lucky so you are OK is little different than "I have friends who are black...but the others...well..."

(I am not saying you yourself made any such atatement)

everyone passes judgment, all day. if you've managed to rise above it, then you are truly wasting your time here, there has to be some opportunity for deep philosophizing, and i'm just not seeing it.
does being addicted to something make you inherently bad? no. does it greatly increase the likelihood that you will do unacceptable things to support your addiction? yes.
so do i think of addicts as "filthy junkies" ?...usually not, but when one gets close and they smell like shit and 100 year old fritos, it might pop into my head....
i've attempted to think of people equally, to not use race or sex or sexuality in my estimation of their strength of character and trustworthiness. perhaps i've slipped at times, but i keep trying.
people who refuse to get vaccinated or wear a mask contribute to the spread of covid and the duration of the pandemic...so do people who support the black market availability of opiates and methamphetamine contribute to the addiction of those predisposed to it?

 

[maxamus1]

as to sanctimony...it seems more like you're trying to justify your habits, normalize them, than that i'm trying to demonize anyone or anything. if you can deal with taking meth or heroin, then you be you...just remember, not everyone can deal with it, so for every 5 users you know, statistically, one of them is going to crash and burn.
i'm not against giving people in pain medication, including opiates. but they need to be prescribed for a limited amount of time, and the people taking them need to be monitored. if they have a chronic condition, and have to take it forever, they should never be prescribed more than a months worth at a time, and any thefts should be required to be reported immediately. i know people that farm doctors for pain pills, and have done so for a long time, that needs to be stopped, there should be some registry that keeps track of people prescribed opiates, and pop all kinds of red flags if their names turn up in multiple places. some prevention would stop a lot of people from getting addicted to begin with, and free up more resources for those that still do.

And then what what would you propose doing if they have showin up multiple times or multiple red flags what would be their punishment?

 

[HGCC]

People seem to be romanticizing hard drugs and looking at it through rose colored glasses. The individual experience doesn't reflect the whole. I use myself as an example, I started doing drugs and drinking at 11 and never really stopped...my life turned out alright, went to college and grad school, got a decent job, happily married with kid, etc. One other dude has done similar. The number that wound up not making it is shocking.

If you can fix society and people, then sure it's fine to legalize drugs. We have a nation of broken people dealing with it by taking hard drugs. If you just address the one part, I just can't see how it works. Things don't exist in a void.