Pure Kush Canundrum

MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
Hey guys.

Happy Boxing Day.

I am having some issues with my girls.

4 plants of Pure Kush from Canuck Seeds at about 5 weeks of veg.

Grow Parameters as follows,
4 x 4 grow tent with Spyder Farmer SE5000
Medium is pure Coco
De-chlorinated tap water with nutrient mix PH,d to ~ 6.1
Jacks Tap Formula at 1.8 EC working up to 2.0 EC daily to runoff
Tribus once per week
PPFD at canopy about 700-800 per phone app, 65% output, 36” from canopy
Ambient Temp. 80 Deg F daytime 72 deg F nights
RH between 60-75 %

Girls were transplanted from 1 Gallon pots to 5 gallon pots 14 days ago.
At that time I also performed some LST and defoliation.
I think I might have gone overboard on the defoliation and LST was possibly a little intense, 1 cracked branch.

One plant seems to be thriving, 3 of them seem to be struggling to recover.
The one plant that is doing well is a week or so older, long story.
2 days ago I upped the EC to 2.0, I don’t think it helped.

Growth seems to be on pause or at least slowed down.
I was planning on invoking flower New Years day; I would like them all to look happy before I do so.

My girls are yelling at me and I am not sure what they are saying.

First pic is before transplant.
The others are from this morning.

1-BeforeTransplant.jpg
2-ThisMorning.jpg3-HappyGirl.jpg4-NotAsHappy1.jpg5-NotAsHappy2.jpg6-LeavesThisMorning.jpg
 
Rurumo

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
I would lower your EC to 1.2 and add some epsom salts. Dissolve the tap formula first, then add the epsom. That tap formula doesn't have much magnesium in it. Also, make sure you have a LOT of runoff for the time being, at least until the plants turn around. Good luck!
 
OldMedUser

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
The bad ones look like they are showing signs of impending nute burn and those bad leaves look it too.

I agree with @Rurumo that your EC seems too high and Epsom salts sure won't hurt. Coco is known for holding Ca and Mg so most peeps charge it with CalMag to make sure there's enough of both. Another fussy thing about coco that keeps me using ProMix HP.

Good luck!

:peace:
 
MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
So the consensus is nute burn and Magnesium deficiency.

I will up my Epsom salts from 3 - 4 grams per 10 litres and lower my EC to 1.2

I will report back next week and post updated pics for the rest of the noobs.

Thanks fellas.
 
Milky Weed

Milky Weed

Well-Known Member
MopeOG said:
So the consensus is nute burn and Magnesium deficiency.

I will up my Epsom salts from 3 - 4 grams per 10 litres and lower my EC to 1.2

I will report back next week and post updated pics for the rest of the noobs.

Thanks fellas.
Click to expand...
That’s ALOT of epsom, shoot for 1G or less per 2.8L
 
OldMedUser

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
MopeOG said:
So the consensus is nute burn and Magnesium deficiency.

I will up my Epsom salts from 3 - 4 grams per 10 litres and lower my EC to 1.2

I will report back next week and post updated pics for the rest of the noobs.

Thanks fellas.
Click to expand...
That sounds like a decent dose. When I've treated for low Mg I'd use 1tsp/4L and I just weighed a level tsp and it's 4.7g so call it 5g for ease of measurement and that may not even be enough for 10L but is a safe place to start.

When I'm feeding hydro nutes in straight ProMix HP I'm hitting 600ppm/1.2EC max and was only feeding a bit higher if lower leaves started to yellow. I'd even just give them the Epsom Salts for a couple waterings to let the plants use up any extra nutes in the pots before resuming nutes. Better to be a little low and add more that to be even slightly overfeeding all thru veg to have it bite you in the ass half way thru flowering with toxic salts buildup frying the leaves and eventually the buds. Low RH really helps make that happen as I've found out with my own plants. Now I feed more like 300ppm max.

If you have CalMag you might want to use that with a smaller dose of Epsom as coco loves it's Ca too.

Hope you see improvement soon!

:peace:
 
OldMedUser

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
Milky Weed said:
That’s ALOT of epsom, shoot for 1G or less per 2.8L
Click to expand...
2.8L is an odd volume to use for a base amount. Does that match a container you use? Here in Canada a lot of containers we get are still US measurement size but marked in equivalent metric measurement. Milk jugs are 4L but the gallon cans of camp fuel I got to make naphtha from are 3.78L or 1USgal. Litre sized bottles are 946ml or 1USqt so it's a mix up here. Both are close enough that they can be expressed as 4L for a gallon and 1L for a quart without making a real difference for measuring out nutes and stuff.

I grew up with Imperial/British math and measurements and was out of school the year after we switched to metric so didn't really grok it until I went back to school in my 30s to get a diploma in chemistry. Came out of that pretty fluent in metric too and use both for different things. Nutes and stuff it's all metric but if I want to build a new doghouse, work on the car etc it's inches feet and thousandths of inches all the way!

2.8L just seems out of place in either world.

:peace:
 
Milky Weed

Milky Weed

Well-Known Member
OldMedUser said:
2.8L is an odd volume to use for a base amount. Does that match a container you use? Here in Canada a lot of containers we get are still US measurement size but marked in equivalent metric measurement. Milk jugs are 4L but the gallon cans of camp fuel I got to make naphtha from are 3.78L or 1USgal. Litre sized bottles are 946ml or 1USqt so it's a mix up here. Both are close enough that they can be expressed as 4L for a gallon and 1L for a quart without making a real difference for measuring out nutes and stuff.

I grew up with Imperial/British math and measurements and was out of school the year after we switched to metric so didn't really grok it until I went back to school in my 30s to get a diploma in chemistry. Came out of that pretty fluent in metric too and use both for different things. Nutes and stuff it's all metric but if I want to build a new doghouse, work on the car etc it's inches feet and thousandths of inches all the way!

2.8L just seems out of place in either world.

:peace:
Click to expand...
i just converted gallons to L and rounded it up lol
 
MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
So 1 week later …..Veg_Day47-1.jpg

This is what greeted me this morning.

Days 1 and 3 from my original post I gave 2 feedings with straight PH,d water and a full dose of Epsom including a dose of Tribus + Lumina or FishSh!t .

I fed daily as usual to considerable runoff, dumping to waste what seemed almost as much as I was putting in.

My feed this week has been at 1.2 EC, PH of 6.1

I am beginning to appreciate how difficult it is to catch in pictures what these plants really look like.

#1 plant is still looking happy and a second plant I will call #2 (front Right this pic) seems to be coming around.

The other 2 plants are still kind of miserable.
Veg_Day47-3.jpg

I removed a considerable number of damaged leaves today, anything hard and discoloured. I do not know if that was a good move but those leaves just seemed to be getting worse and not a hell of a lot of new growth to speak of.



Veg_Day47-2.jpg

I was hoping to see more positive feedback from these plants by now.

I will give them another week and see what happens.

If they don’t show signs of recovery I will consider culling them and transplanting the 2 I have left into 7 or 10 gallon pots and vegging them a little longer.

My goal has been to fill the tent and I would like to achieve that one way or another.

Comments and suggestions are welcome.
 
OldMedUser

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
When I think I'm having nutrient issues with the plants I don't remove leaves with a lot of green yet. If the plants aren't getting what they need from the roots they'll steal mobile nutrients from those leaves. If a lot of those are gone they'll steal from the healthier ones that are left.

I haven't used coco since a crappy grow with it 20 years ago so maybe it's related to your medium. I wouldn't be quick to cull tho. Do a little searching for coco problems and see if you can't turn them around and learn new stuff so it doesn't happen again.

Mistakes or problems suck but if they can at least be a learning opportunity it's not a waste.

Lots of pot books at pdfdrive.com so might find coco specific books there.

:peace:
 
Nizza

Nizza

Well-Known Member
Did you increase light intensity or something?
Maybe it is due to watering infrequency (too dry to too wet?)
the plant that is thriving, what do you think parameter is different?

"jacks tap formula"
I have no experience with, can you further on details of what you're using?
 
T

thefullspectrum

Well-Known Member
Not that its a problem, but most people growing in coco start around 5.7- 5.8pH. Mine always drifts up. If yours drifts down maybe 6.1 pH suits.

Have you calibrated your measuring equipment lately. Is it decent quality? Eliminate the obvious first.

Personally, I wouldnt be going above 1.0 -1.1 EC at this stage.
 
MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
OldMedUser said:
When I think I'm having nutrient issues with the plants I don't remove leaves with a lot of green yet. If the plants aren't getting what they need from the roots they'll steal mobile nutrients from those leaves. If a lot of those are gone they'll steal from the healthier ones that are left.

I haven't used coco since a crappy grow with it 20 years ago so maybe it's related to your medium. I wouldn't be quick to cull tho. Do a little searching for coco problems and see if you can't turn them around and learn new stuff so it doesn't happen again.

Mistakes or problems suck but if they can at least be a learning opportunity it's not a waste.

Lots of pot books at pdfdrive.com so might find coco specific books there.

:peace:
Click to expand...
I guess my frustration is showing through. Sorry, it is temporary, I will push on.

I have done a great deal of research on growing in coco.
It is interesting how differently people approach it.
It seems clear that different plants require different things and we need to adjust.

It is fascinating how 3 seeds from the same pack can react so differently to the exact same growing conditions.

I will give these plants more time to recover, no rush to cull.

I think my next step is to lower my EC down to 1.0 for a week, or until #1 shows signs of deficiencies :)

I went from EC 1.8 down to EC 1.2 with 20 % more Magnesium Sulphate and Plant # 1 never skipped a beat.

Thanks for your input brother.

Edited : Substituted Calcium Nitrate for Magnesium Sulphate . I always mix the 2 for some reason.
 
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MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
Nizza said:
Did you increase light intensity or something?
Maybe it is due to watering infrequency (too dry to too wet?)
the plant that is thriving, what do you think parameter is different?

"jacks tap formula"
I have no experience with, can you further on details of what you're using?
Click to expand...
All plants have been treated exactly the same, lighting has not changed.

Shop Now | jrpeters12345

www.jacksnutrients.com www.jacksnutrients.com


Product Details
Prefer Tap Water? Allow your plants to drink up this formula designed to provide all the macro, secondary and micro nutrients in a one-part system. Specifically formulated for tap, city or well water types with slightly higher alkalinity & pH. This combination of nutrients will lower pH over time while including the extra soluble calcium, magnesium and the right balance of micronutrients.
 
MopeOG

MopeOG

Active Member
thefullspectrum said:
Not that its a problem, but most people growing in coco start around 5.7- 5.8pH. Mine always drifts up. If yours drifts down maybe 6.1 pH suits.

Have you calibrated your measuring equipment lately. Is it decent quality? Eliminate the obvious first.

Personally, I wouldnt be going above 1.0 -1.1 EC at this stage.
Click to expand...
I have a brand new Bluelabs Combo meter. Calibrated it last week after making OP. It was spot on.
I think your right in that the plants were not developed enough for that strong a feed.


It seems that everyone has a different opinion on PH. My water comes out of the tap at about PH 7.2.
I want to add as little PH down as I can and remain in proper range.
The nutrient mix brings my water down to about PH 6.5, and 34 drops of PH own brings it to about 6.1.

I am not sure what you mean about drift. Is there something I am missing ?

Edit: I have been doing some more reading and opinions and charts very but you do make a good point. I should try lowering my PH to 5.8 and see if the girls respond.

Thanks.
 
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