The Corporate States of America

NewGrowth

Well-Known Member
you cite wikepedia

whatever, your still basing it on raw statistics which means jack shit

lets look at this paragraph



ok so, according to that source, the us justice department, well 16,507 were incarcerated for assault, murder, and all that jazz (mind you the stuff they were convicted for)

what they dont consider to be a violent crime is property offenses.......that includes arson im sure, as well as burglary (which can turn violent and those people need to be locked away) fraud, which is not violent but then again not a "victimless" crime. 25,000 were for weapons offenses......id consider that to be a violent crime really, and immigration.......wow thats alot really. but 93,751 were for drug related problems (mind you, this is FEDERAL PRISON they dont deal with pot smokers). im pretty sure that selling crack, and heavy drugs make up the majority of inmates in a federal prison

now your other sources try to back it up, like this one



but look closesly, it says state prisons (and im assuming all states are the same, another reason raw stats dont work) now that 27.9% drug offenders who are in for possession dont come from the 93,751 federal inmates. also state prisons are much more lax when compared to federal prison

that means that any of those drug offenders could be serving time for about a month on average, theres just alot who get caught and convicted quickly (thats how alot states make money, by busting drugs)

dude, your stats are not adding up at all and at a glance they do, do you justice......but when ya think about it....meh

Look man all documentation is provided by the Department of Justice. A good friend provided me this link. I posted that information directly from the US DOJ website. I really don't know what else you need before you realize that the facts are right in front of you.

It is almost like I am pointing at a fire saying that it is hot and you keep reaching out to touch it and saying its not hot.

Well a good friend was kind enough to provide me with this link if you would like to read the entire DOJ report I encourage you to do so. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/ppus06.pdf

LG also provided great info about the peer-review process in her post, so you know the stats provided are factual.

I have yet to see you post any facts to support your argument . . . .:peace:

PS- There are lots of people if federal prison for marijuana and mean incarceration periods for the type of crime committed are also provide in the document I provided. Your opinion is based on conjecture and assumptions, I'm putting the facts right in front of you.
 

suedonimn

Well-Known Member
I just ran across this little tidbit: http://www.serendipity.li/jsmill/us_corporation.htm

There of course are many other sites like this, but I think Lisa Guliani articulates this subject very well. It does definately answer the question of why the USG is so loyal to fellow corporations, and backing economic warfare. Some of the links on the page are also interesting, I got lost for a minute... anyway it is quite a bit to think about.
 

medicineman

New Member
There are those on the right that are so brainwashed by their affiliations with Libertarian Ideals that they "can't see the forest for the trees". Freedom, Privatization, no taxes, just leave us alone and we'll be fine, yet they drive on the public roads, enjoy public places, (national parks, city parks, etc) enjoy police "protection" (A joke), fire protection services, national protection etc.. I wish we could give them a State and let them live all by themselves, but don't complain when they have no services. When a fire wipes out their home, tough titty. When a huricane or tornado wipes them out tough titty, floods, and other disasters they would have to handle by themselves. That's just one liberals suggestion.
 

stalebiscuit

Well-Known Member
Look man all documentation is provided by the Department of Justice. A good friend provided me this link. I posted that information directly from the US DOJ website. I really don't know what else you need before you realize that the facts are right in front of you.

It is almost like I am pointing at a fire saying that it is hot and you keep reaching out to touch it and saying its not hot.

Well a good friend was kind enough to provide me with this link if you would like to read the entire DOJ report I encourage you to do so. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/ppus06.pdf

LG also provided great info about the peer-review process in her post, so you know the stats provided are factual.

I have yet to see you post any facts to support your argument . . . .:peace:

PS- There are lots of people if federal prison for marijuana and mean incarceration periods for the type of crime committed are also provide in the document I provided. Your opinion is based on conjecture and assumptions, I'm putting the facts right in front of you.
your still not following my point, its simple, the fact is most people who are in prison belong there. simple, and they should be treated as criminals not citizens

for example, what this guy is doing.......well, hes just fucking awesome (now the aclu hates him, but honestly whatever, this is how all prisons should be run)

You all remember Sheriff Joe Arpaio of Arizona , who painted the jail cells pink and made the inmates wear pink prison garb. Well......... SHERIFF JOE IS AT IT AGAIN!

Oh, there's MUCH more to know about Sheriff Joe!

Maricopa County was spending approx. $18 million dollars a year on stray animals, like cats and dogs. Sheriff Joe offered to take the department over, and the County Supervisors said okay.

The animal shelters are now all staffed and operated by prisoners. They feed and care for the strays. Every animal in his care is taken out and walked twice daily. He now has prisoners who are experts in animal nutrition and behavior. They give great classes for anyone who'd like to adopt an animal. He has literally taken stray dogs off the street, given them to the care of prisoners, and had them place in dog shows.

The best part? His budget for the entire department is now under $3 million. Teresa and I adopted a Weimaraner from a Maricopa County shelter two years ago. He was neutered, and current on all shots, in great health, and even had a microchip inserted the day we got him. Cost us $78.
The prisoners get the benefit of about $0.28 an hour for working, but most would work for free, just to be out of their cells for the day. Most of his budget is for utilities, building maintenance, etc. He pays the prisoners out of the fees collected for adopted animals.

I have long wondered when the rest of the country would take a look at the way he runs the jail system, and copy some of his ideas. He has a huge farm, donated to the county years ago, where inmates can work, and they grow most of their own fresh vegetables and food, doing all the work and harvesting by hand. He has a pretty good sized hog farm, which provides meat, and fertilizer. It fertilizes the Christmas tree nursery, where prisoners work, and you can buy a living Christmas tree for $6 - $8 for the Holidays, and plant it later. We have six trees in our yard from the Prison.

Yup, he was reelected last year with 83% of the vote.
Now he's in trouble with the ACLU again. He painted all his buses and vehicles with a mural, that has a special hotline phone number painted on it, where you can call and report suspected illegal aliens. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement wasn't doing enough in his eyes, so he had 40 deputies trained specifically for enforcing immigration laws, started up his hotline, and bought 4 new buses just for hauling folks back to the border. He's kind of a 'Git-R Dun' kind of Sheriff.

TO THOSE OF YOU NOT FAMILIAR WITH JOE ARPAIO

HE IS THE MARICOPA ARIZONA COUNTY SHERIFF

AND HE KEEPS GETTING ELECTED OVER AND OVER
THIS IS ONE OF THE REASONS WHY:

Sheriff Joe Arpaio (In Arizona ) who created the "Tent City Jail" :
He has jail meals down to 40 cents a serving and charges the inmates for them.

He stopped smoking and porno magazines in the jails. Took away their weights. Cut off all but 'G' movies.

He started chain gangs so the inmates could do free work on county and city projects.

Then He Started Chain Gangs For Women So He Wouldn't Get Sued For Discrimination.

He took away cable TV Until he found out there was A Federal Court Order that Required Cable TV For Jails - So He Hooked Up The Cable TV Again and Only Let In The Disney Channel And The Weather Channel.

When asked why the weather channel He Replied, So They Will Know How Hot It's Gonna Be While They Are Working on My Chain Gangs.

He Cut Off Coffee Since It Has Zero Nutritional Value.

When the inmates complained, he told them, 'This Isn't The Ritz/Carlton.....If You Don't Like It, Don't Come Back.'

He bought Newt Gingrich's lecture series on videotape that he pipes into the jails.

When asked by a reporter if he had any lecture series by a Democrat, he replied that a democratic lecture series might explain why a lot of the inmates were in his jails in the first place.

More On The Arizona Sheriff:

With Temperatures Being Even Hotter Than Usual In Phoenix (116 Degrees Just Set A New Record), the Associated Press Reports:
About 2,000 Inmates Living In A Barbed-Wire-Surrounded Tent Encampment At The Maricopa County Jail Have Been Given Permission To Strip Down To Their Government-Issued Pink Boxer Shorts.

On Wednesday, hundreds of men wearing boxers were either curled up on their bunk beds or chatted in the tents, which reached 138 Degrees Inside The Week Before.

Many Were Also Swathed In Wet, Pink Towels As Sweat Collected On Their Chests And Dripped Down To Their PINK SOCKS.

'It Feels Like We Are In A Furnace,' Said James Zanzot, An Inmate Who Has Lived In The Tents for 1 year. 'It's Inhumane.'

Joe Arpaio, the tough-guy sheriff who created the tent city and long ago started making his prisoners wear pink, and eat bologna sandwiches, is not one bit sympathetic. He said Wednesday that he told all of the inmates: 'It's 120 Degrees In Iraq And Our Soldiers Are Living In Tents Too, And They Have To Wear Full Battle Gear,
But They Didn't Commit Any Crimes,So Shut Your Mouths!'

Way To Go, Sheriff!

Maybe if all prisons were like this one there would be a lot less crime and/or repeat offenders. Criminals should be punished for their crimes - not live in luxury until it's time for their parole, only to go out and commit another crime so they can get back in to live on taxpayers money and enjoy things taxpayers can't afford to have for themselves.

Sheriff Joe was just reelected Sheriff in Maricopa County, Arizona
 

NewGrowth

Well-Known Member
I can't believe you are arguing for Joe Arpaio, you just entered the lions den man. I proved my point most people in prison DO NOT belong there. Many of them do need psychiatric support and drug counseling. Yet we lock them in cages and expect them to "recover" in three, four, five years. It's not happening the laws are counter-productive and an industrial complex has been built around them.

You are a hypocrite stalebiscuit you can not with good concience commit an illegal act (posessing marijuana) and say that all people in prison belong there. They don't and a private system makes it worse. When increase in profit is the motive incarcerations will rise.
Here is a good Edmund Burke quote for you: "The only thing necessary for the triumph [of evil] is for good men to do nothing."

Joe Arpaio is a very sick person that seems to get off on the torture and imprisonment of people. He is actually quite insane and the way he treats other human beings is terrible. You can read about him yourself but here is a general overview.

Joseph M. Arpaio (born June 14, 1932 in Springfield, Massachusetts, United States) is a law enforcement officer, and the sheriff of Maricopa County, Arizona, United States. Arpaio, who promotes himself as "America's Toughest Sheriff,"is controversial for his approach to operating the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office. He has a large number of vocal supporters as well as detractors. His practices have been criticized by organizations such as Amnesty International, the American Civil Liberties Union, the Arizona Ecumenical Council, the American Jewish Committee, and the Arizona chapter of the Anti-Defamation League
 

Leilani Garden

Well-Known Member
Stalebiscuit wrote:

your still not following my point, its simple, the fact is most people who are in prison belong there. simple, and they should be treated as criminals not citizens

You're still not responding to posts/inquiries/comments posted directly to you. New Growth is right; you state baseless opinions and offer absolutely no sources to back them up. And you know what? Until and if you can do so, nothing you say/post carries much weight at all. You know . . . opinions, everyone's got one.

So you're okay with people being "housed" in heat that reaches 138 degrees? Being incarcerated is not quite enough . . . liberties we all take for granted, like say, the right to use the john in private, not be subjected to the rantings of Newt Gingrich or Winnie The Pooh if one's not into it, consuming food that is substandard for all but probably the homeless (many of whom might soon be headed in Sheriff Joe's direction), and so on and so forth? That's not enough for you to feel satisfied? You're pleased to know that human beings are being subjected to temps up to 138 degrees?

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is a certain element in this society, that seems to be growing every day, that is consumed with crime and punishment. They **enjoy** knowing that others are suffering, that others have lives far worse than the ones they wake up to every day. Many of these folks are the same ones who show up for death sentences carried out, like it's a form of entertainment--and sadly enough, for them, it is entertainment.

And on that note, I'm looking right at you Stale Biscuit. You know who Daryl Hunt is? Do you have HBO? Have you ever heard this man's story? And if so, or heck, even if not, have you any idea how many innocent people have been incarcerated in this country? And been sentenced to death?

I double-dog dare you, child, to read this man's story. And then? I want to read about what he is doing with his life now. And then I want you to contemplate how on earth, in THIS country, with its myth of freedom and justice for ALL--regardless of skin color, this happened. And then I want you to consider this happening to someone you care about. Or to yourself. And then I want you to seriously ponder whether or not this is some bizarre isolated case of justice gone awry. It's not.

Just for you Stale Biscuit. Because your "arugments" are stale. Because your ignorance, in the true sense of the word, needs to be wiped out.

Read this. You will not be taken seriously on this thread until you have read it and can comment on it.


http://www.darrylhuntproject.org/
 

Jonus

Well-Known Member
Federal prisons were estimated to hold 176,268 sentenced inmates as of Sept. 30, 2006. Of these, 16,507 were incarcerated for violent offenses, including 2,923 for homicide, 9,645 for robbery, and 3,939 for other violent crimes. In addition, 10,015 inmates were serving time for property crimes, including 519 for burglary, 6,437 for fraud, and 3,059 for other property offenses. A total of 93,751 were incarcerated for drug offenses. Also, 54,336 were incarcerated for public-order offenses, incluging 19,496 for immigration offenses and 24,298 for weapons offenses.
Those are interesting stats, but what interests me more are the arrest related stats.

1,841,182 people in the US were arrested in 2007 on drug related charges.
Of those arrested, 872,720 were related to Marijuana. Of those, 775,137 people were arrested for marijuana possession alone.

Thats 47.4% of all drug related arrests are related to weed.

So stalebiscuit, do you think that the majority of people in jail for weed related arrests, belong there?
 

suedonimn

Well-Known Member
One of my best friends did 2 years top/bottom in the California prison system. He served his time and was on the last leg of his parole. He was renting a room at a mutual friends house. He went home early one evening, and walked in on the roomie doin' his not quite ex-wife. Well, my buddy he is not a small guy, and just shy of a blackbelt degree in Tae Kwon Do. People that happened to be naked, exposed and ashamed got scared, and called the police. Because he was on parole and they got called to the scene where someone was extremely upset and living with one who collaborated in calling with the complaint, and now scared that the person he called friend for 15 years was very angry and feeling betrayed. When the police found out my friend was on parole they took him in. He did an additional year, and was again paroled. That is far behind him now, yet he is forever labeled a FELON, never again allowed to possess a firearm, or vote, UNLESS... he comes up with some huge amount of cash to have his record expunged. What caused his original incarceration is none of your business, and he will tell you himself that I told him it was a stupid thing to do. None the less it was a victimless, non property damage liability felony crime. Not to make excuses for him, but allow reasons, his wife of nine years told him she was leaving him and their two children. His older brother had just been murdered... man I never saw, or care to see again where his countenance just went dark and he sunk so low into a deep depression. He went blank for a couple of years, and when he got his color back it was just as painful a journey as the one that got him to where he was at. All his bewilderment and mourning had to be suppressed if he were to survive the second stay from the "parole violation". Which by the way the complaint was lifted and no formal charges were filed, but he still served a year sentence. He is a good man, as good as any... for he got his head right, found a job he loves, and concentrated on his children. HOLY CRAP THEY ARE BOTH OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL!!! damn I should be old by now, Owell!. What I am saying is prisons are filled with people who have been convicted of committing a crime, but why should a man like my friend who would risk his own life to save a complete stranger, as he has been a life guard, a mentor, a gentle father. A man dedicated to trying to better himself first by truly understanding what it means to be a man. Why should anyone with even a hint of that,would have to be housed with someone who would leave prison with a new degree in CRIMINALOGY: Bad Guy 101, just leaves me baffled. This coming from me who thinks people are mostly malicious... and to know that a PUBLICLY TRADED PRISON CORPORATION, could have at any time brought him up on charges for prison tattoos or some BS that if he did not get or do would have ended his sentence early, leaving in a body bag. Just to assure high profit margins. WHEW!!! But what do I know... I know I like a good runon sentence.:mrgreen: Wow have not finished the bowl and my train of thought just became a steam locomotive on a steep grade, Love ya. Bye!
 

CrackerJax

New Member
I believe your friends troubles started with the first incarceration. I'll bet a thousand dollars if you sneak into his bedroom at night his hands are holding his junk :mrgreen: .

By the way felons can vote, just make sure to register as a Democrat.



out. :blsmoke:
 

medicineman

New Member
I believe your friends troubles started with the first incarceration. I'll bet a thousand dollars if you sneak into his bedroom at night his hands are holding his junk :mrgreen: .

By the way felons can vote, just make sure to register as a Democrat.



out. :blsmoke:
Now here's a compassionate side of a rightie. It's all the democrats that fucked the pooch. Say cracker,(Name appropriate), do you have a degree in Idiocy, or did it just come naturally.
 

CrackerJax

New Member
Pooch? From reading your posts, EVERYBODY is to the right of you. So how is it on the EXTREME end of the spectrum? Glad to see your objectivity is intact.


Gosh, I forgot to call you names....


out. :blsmoke:
 

medicineman

New Member
Pooch? From reading your posts, EVERYBODY is to the right of you. So how is it on the EXTREME end of the spectrum? Glad to see your objectivity is intact.


Gosh, I forgot to call you names....


out. :blsmoke:
Well that's a pleasant change, maybe you're starting to lean left. Have you washed your sheet lately?
 

NewGrowth

Well-Known Member
Those are interesting stats, but what interests me more are the arrest related stats.

1,841,182 people in the US were arrested in 2007 on drug related charges.
Of those arrested, 872,720 were related to Marijuana. Of those, 775,137 people were arrested for marijuana possession alone.

Thats 47.4% of all drug related arrests are related to weed.

So stalebiscuit, do you think that the majority of people in jail for weed related arrests, belong there?
Good post, is might take an arrest for stalebiscuit to wake up. To me it seems like a basic lack of compassion and intolerance that continues to fuel this war.

Even after the laws change the war continues to the bitter end. In Denver an organization called SAFER sucessfully passed a ballot measure that legalized the possesion of up to an OZ of marijuana. It also made marijuana the lowest enforcement priority. People are still arrested in Denver however. City leaders including the Mayor have refused to accept the change in law and continue to persecute people. Slowly with each court battle, city leaders are beginning to realize that people voted and want the law to change.

Colorado has a large number of private prisons as well. People in the state are fed up with it and are fighting back. We have MMJ well established here as well.

Raise public awareness and most people change their minds.
 

suedonimn

Well-Known Member
^^^ Well these last 2 posts(1 post ago) really show how the USG is adept at creating a schism among the people. DIVIDE AND CONQUER. You are only right when the facts agree, and only left after you are gone. The thing you both share is being human, please do not fall into the traps and snares set by people in public office to distract from the fact they are laughing at your arguements, all the way to the banks that have your money that they essentually now own. What, besides semantics, is the difference between a conspiracy and a strategy? As long as we are all argueing about who has the better ideology, "THEY" are getting fat from your hard work, and stealing your childrens inheritence. Since I have been concious of it people have been argueing the same issues, every election, and the only thing that ever happens is "THEY" figure out another law that takes more of your money, but the very same issues are still unattended. Just think about it...

Ways to divide a nation. Race differences, gender differences, sexual prefrences, political ideology, religious ideology and so many more, on so many levels... a schism.
 

medicineman

New Member
^^^ Well these last 2 posts(1 post ago) really show how the USG is adept at creating a schism among the people. DIVIDE AND CONQUER. You are only right when the facts agree, and only left after you are gone. The thing you both share is being human, please do not fall into the traps and snares set by people in public office to distract from the fact they are laughing at your arguements, all the way to the banks that have your money that they essentually now own. What, besides semantics, is the difference between a conspiracy and a strategy? As long as we are all argueing about who has the better ideology, "THEY" are getting fat from your hard work, and stealing your childrens inheritence. Since I have been concious of it people have been argueing the same issues, every election, and the only thing that ever happens is "THEY" figure out another law that takes more of your money, but the very same issues are still unattended. Just think about it...

Ways to divide a nation. Race differences, gender differences, sexual prefrences, political ideology, religious ideology and so many more, on so many levels... a schism.
I believe that's called human nature. Most people argue from the position they have acquired, or adapt a philosophical position, (Such as I) that expresses where they would like the inhabitants of the planet to be. Who is right??? Who really knows? I side with compassion (Just as Jesus would). It seems that the Christian right, talk Jesus, and act asshole.
 

NewGrowth

Well-Known Member
^^^ Well these last 2 posts(1 post ago) really show how the USG is adept at creating a schism among the people. DIVIDE AND CONQUER. You are only right when the facts agree, and only left after you are gone. The thing you both share is being human, please do not fall into the traps and snares set by people in public office to distract from the fact they are laughing at your arguements, all the way to the banks that have your money that they essentually now own. What, besides semantics, is the difference between a conspiracy and a strategy? As long as we are all argueing about who has the better ideology, "THEY" are getting fat from your hard work, and stealing your childrens inheritence. Since I have been concious of it people have been argueing the same issues, every election, and the only thing that ever happens is "THEY" figure out another law that takes more of your money, but the very same issues are still unattended. Just think about it...

Ways to divide a nation. Race differences, gender differences, sexual prefrences, political ideology, religious ideology and so many more, on so many levels... a schism.

The only thing is you speak to "they" as if "they" are a specific organization. Nobody is planning for collapse or division. It is really due to the amount of compassion and tollerance people have. We have created a society of consumers dependent on large industry to feed us, clothe us, and keep us fed. We unconciusly support this counterproductive system every day. It is woven into the vary fabric of our lives. We drive cars buy gas, buy groceries, buy clothes, we BUY everything. We produce nothing locally and everything is produced and consumed on a mass scale.
Private institutions will do anything to stay in power. Is the Bailout scam not a prime example? Who is next General Motors? Nobody is masterminding the whole thing these are the obvious consequences of our american dream fueled by fear, greed, intolerance, and ignorance.

Are you going to die for your government?
If there was a nike sweatshop in your back yard would you buy nike?
 
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