The Natural Progression Of Things ...

[ViRedd]

Some food for thought:

About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2000 years earlier:

"A democracy is always temporary in nature: it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government."

"A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."

The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years.

During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence:

1. From bondage to spiritual faith.

2. From spiritual faith to great courage.

3. From great courage to liberty.

4. From liberty to abundance.

5. From abundance to complacency.

6. From complacency to apathy.

7. From apathy to dependence.

8. From dependence back into bondage.

 

[ViRedd]

Professor Joseph Olson of Hemline University School of Law, St. Pul, Minnesota, points out some interesting facts about the 2000 presidential elections:

Number of States won by:​

Gore:19 ..... Bush: 29​

Square miles of land won by:​

Gore: 580,000 ..... Bush: 2,427,000​

Population of counties won by:​

Gore: 127 million ..... Bush: 143 million​

Murder rates per 100,000 residents in counties won by:​

Gore: 13.2 .....Bush: 2.1​

Professsor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this great country." ​

"Gore's territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in government-owned tenements and living off various forms of government welfare." Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the "complacency and apathy" phase of Professor Tyler's definintion of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached the 'government dependency' phase."​

If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal's and they vote, then we can say goodby to the USA in fewer than five years. ​

Apathy is the greatest danger to our freedom.​

 

[medicineman]

If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal's and they vote, then we can say goodby to the USA in fewer than five years. ​

Where is it going? I imagine you don't check ID cards when you sell a house Eh. What you are saying is: say goodbye to right wing conservatism. The illegals will vote for democrats. As much as I dislike illegals and what they are doing to our work market, that might be the only plus to come from them. If they can break the hold on this country by Nazis like you VI, then I might retreat from my disdain of them. I hope you have to raise at least 250 Mexican kids with your taxes. Justice will be served

 

[ViRedd]

If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal's and they vote, then we can say goodby to the USA in fewer than five years. ​

Where is it going? I imagine you don't check ID cards when you sell a house Eh. What you are saying is: say goodbye to right wing conservatism. The illegals will vote for democrats. As much as I dislike illegals and what they are doing to our work market, that might be the only plus to come from them. If they can break the hold on this country by Nazis like you VI, then I might retreat from my disdain of them. I hope you have to raise at least 250 Mexican kids with your taxes. Justice will be served

Med, you are so fucking hateful its unbelivable. Did you even read the article in the first two posts? You just don't get it do ya pal? The whole time I've been posting on this site, I've espoused nothing but liberty, and YOU have espoused nothing but directions that would lead us down the path on the Road to Serfdom. Who's the real Nazi, Med? Honestly, you are so fucking dense, and so blinded by class envy, that you don't realize that a citizenry who votes for government that can provide everything, also votes for a government that can take everything away. Read history, fer Christ sakes!

Vi

 

[420worshipper]

Since its the Republicans that are trying to make all illegals into legal American citizens, you might be suprised if they were to vote for Republicans. Then Med would scream deport them and do away with the new law to make the illegals citizens.

You do have to realize that before the creation of INS, technically everybody that came to this country came illegally. Just as some Native American tribe members if any people immigrating to this land came here with their consent.

 

[ViRedd]

420 ...

I agree ... but its BOTH parties that are in favor of amnesty. The Republicans, supporting big business are in favor of the cheap labor. The Democrats want the votes.

My grandparents came here from Italy. They had to get through Ellis Island. They also needed to show proof of a certain skill level and had to have a sponsor in order to get into the country.

I'd be interested in your comments regarding the first two posts in this thread. Thanks ...

Vi

 

[medicineman]

420 ...

I agree ... but its BOTH parties that are in favor of amnesty. The Republicans, supporting big business are in favor of the cheap labor. The Democrats want the votes.

My grandparents came here from Italy. They had to get through Ellis Island. They also needed to show proof of a certain skill level and had to have a sponsor in order to get into the country.

I'd be interested in your comments regarding the first two posts in this thread. Thanks ...

Vi

Talk about not being able to take a joke. Man you are pathetic. go sell a house to another illegal.

 

[Dankdude]

Since its the Republicans that are trying to make all illegals into legal American citizens, you might be suprised if they were to vote for Republicans. Then Med would scream deport them and do away with the new law to make the illegals citizens.

You do have to realize that before the creation of INS, technically everybody that came to this country came illegally. Just as some Native American tribe members if any people immigrating to this land came here with their consent.

It just goes to show that those who would sell us out by making Illegals legal would sell their souls for a vote. Besides I have enough Native American blood in my veins that I could tell you guys to get the fuck out.

 

[medicineman]

It just goes to show that those who would sell us out by making Illegals legal would sell their souls for a vote. Besides I have enough Native American blood in my veins that I could tell you guys to get the fuck out.

Me, 1/8th cherokee or so I'm told by my late grandma. I believe it's not enough to abscound with gov-ment cheeze, but I'd surely do a war dance on some right wing assholes.

 

[cincismoker]

viredd, dankdude, medicinman, an 420worshper you guy are the only 1 who partisapate in these politicule debates an i love watchin you guy do wat u do best.. argue, keep up the good work

 

[ozstone]

viredd, dankdude, medicinman, an 420worshper you guy are the only 1 who partisapate in these politicule debates an i love watchin you guy do wat u do best.. argue, keep up the good work

Yeah ya Right Cinci,
Its better than watchin Jerry Springer, good to see some red blooded debate,
Its also an interesting perspective from someone who lives outside the US & A
to see different perspectives on these events, ding ding back in the ring.

 

[ViRedd]

Talk about not being able to take a joke. Man you are pathetic. go sell a house to another illegal.

The next time you tell a "joke," make it funny, will ya? <Sheesh!>

And by the way ... I don't sell homes to "illegals."

Vi

PS: Now I see the problem. A bunch of freakin' Injuns!!!

 

[Wold]

Intresting. Its seems our children will have some great problems to contend with.

Soon, the voters will realize that all they have to do is vote for nobody but the candidate who will provide them with the most money. A vast majority of the wealth in america is held by about %20 of the population.

This means the majority of the voters will be "lower" class, and be the first in-line to cherish a politician who will ease thier low-income suffering.

America is short on resources. Water. Fuel. Electricity. Crops. The country can't feed it'self.

The Bush administration is an agressive pan-handler. Nobody gives him what he wants, he goes and gets it.

 

[Dankdude]

Me, 1/8th cherokee or so I'm told by my late grandma. I believe it's not enough to abscound with gov-ment cheeze, but I'd surely do a war dance on some right wing assholes.

1/4 Lacota Souix (Blackfoot for those who don't know who the Lacota's were) and 1/8th Cherokee. The Rest is English and French.

 

[medicineman]

America is short on resources. Water. Fuel. Electricity. Crops. The country can't feed it'self.
Up to the current level of population, America can feed itself and probably a few smaller nations. The top soil that took billions of years to accumulate is rapidly wearing thin and weak with needed nutrients, the future will not be so kind to US farming. Water in the west is also a great problem. we've reached the tipping point, and the great drought is not going away. The energy thing can be solved once the oil companies figure out a way to make as much from water as oil, as there is a simple formula for turning water into hydrogen that could fuel every device made by man. This formula is locked away in the deepest darkest vaults of the oil companies. This is only speculation from first hand observances.

 

[Wold]

I can turn water into hydrogen in 30 min. Its simple. Electrolasyis. Pour salt in water. Stir. Run a current through it. Collect hydrogen. Makes a really cool pop in a bottle.

EDIT: The oil companys know damn well how to turn this world around. They have bought up and destroyed patents for near %100 effincey carbourators. Shot down infinate energy devices. Power devices that turn 1 watt of power into 3 watts, with no moving parts. This wolrd clearley hs enough technonlgy to reduce our emmitons to almost nothing, and live a sustanible life. The oil companys refuse to do anything about it because as I previousley stated, when the shit hits the fan, they are all going to be good and dead. They are hell-bent on secureing their family tree with Trust funds untill the end of time.

However, It would take un-thinkable sums of money, and alot of time to change everything green. But hell, its better than where we are now.

 

[lynchburgball]

all the american government can do well (other than fucking things up all the time) is redistribute public commodities, whether by regulating firms or individual behaviors.

regulatory policy itself is a failed endeavor for the most part. credibility issues arise when policies are implemented to change for the better. take the oil thing for instance. Those companies could change it all around and switch to alternative fuel. That would be their decision. Because they have a stranglehold on profit margins with crude oil, however, that market switch isn't feasible for them.

Of course, we'd prefer a change, but who can do that for us? not the U.S. govt. if they enact a policy to, say, just lower emissions of a refinery, there will either be a huge initial transitional cost for the producer and low maintenance cost or the opposite. now, because the U.S. government can be "discretionarily untrustworthy" or inept our bureaucracies would have an intense time ensuring these regulations were followed. basically it boils down to the lack of credibility our government has in following through with policy.

for the owners of oil companies, they already know the flawed bureaucratic game. it's either them or the pharmeceutical companies that've got us kind of stuck in this.

the stats that Viredd posted about the taxpaying territories voting republican are fun.

 

[Wold]

Im waiting for pharmasutical companys to start adding drugs to the pills to make us need more drugs.

 

[Dankdude]

They may be fun, but incorrect. I beleive those figures are from 2003 or before. Link Please Vi.

 

[lynchburgball]

They may be fun, but incorrect. I beleive those figures are from 2003 or before. Link Please Vi.

welllll that may be true, i have no idea. if you're using the incorrect date to invalidate the significance of what i mean to say, then i think you're just confused. i just think that, at any time, it is funny that the folks putting the most money into the public sphere have supported a massively wasteful administration and its party (the two must be associated) twice. good investment strategy?