Dystopia's PPP 250w VScrOG

[Dystopia]

STRAIN: Feminized Pure Power Plant from Nirvana. Description: 100% Feminized Pure Power Plant is a strong mostly sativa variety developed in the late 90’s from South African strains. PPP produces loads of trichomes and has tremendous growth potential. PPP is the latest trend among the big commercial growers because of its high yields and high priced buds. Pure Power Plant has a pleasant almost pine after taste and a powerful social buzz.

SYSTEM: Recirculating DWC modified for Bubbleponics; 250 Watt HID; Vertical Screen of Green (VScrOG)

NUTRIENTS: General Hydroponics Flora Grow-Micro-Bloom, Advanced Nutrients Big Bud, Advanced Nutrients Hammerhead

START DATE: Germinated seeds on August 16, 2009

I’ve finally got around to journaling my latest grow. I’m currently in week 9 from seed, 3 since 12/12. I’m going to be adding posts detailing how I got here. First, though, here’s where I’m at as of today:

 

[Dystopia]

This is a recirculating DWC consisting of two 12 gallon ice chests connected by plumbing:

I didn’t really take pictures during construction, but it’s pretty straight-forward. There’s a 150 gph water pump in the bottom reservoir to pump water to the top reservoir through a ½” tube and an adjustable valve. The valve allows me to easily adjust the flow so that I don’t overwhelm the overflow lines in the top reservoir.

The blue overflow lines on the top reservoir (with the red valves) are mounted to the side of the reservoir at the water level I want to maintain. Whenever the pump in the lower reservoir is pumping water into the top the overflow drains back into the lower reservoir through these lines.

The top reservoir also has a drain line connected to the bottom.

Both reservoirs sit on a jury-rigged stand that I made out of scrap wood. The stand has wheels on the bottom so the whole unit can be moved as one. The bottom reservoir is also on a shelf that slides out for easy access to the top:

I chose to a recirulating system for a few reasons:

1. I don’t want to have to remove the lid of the top reservoir to do any maintenance; that lid pretty much supports the entire upper infrastructure. That’s the advantage of a thick insulated lid; it easily supports everything above it and I CAN lift the lid if I NEED to. There is a disadvantage that I’ll detail later. The bottom reservoir makes water maintenance a breeze.

2. Any changes I make to the water (i.e. nutrient level) is done in the bottom reservoir and applied slowly to mix in with the top reservoir. This pretty much eliminates any possibility of shock from sudden changes.

3. I started this grow in the summer, when the outside temperature was still in the 100’s and the grow room temps were in the upper 80’s. Keeping the reservoir temps down is very important to me, and having a remote reservoir allows me to add frozen bottles to easily maintain my water temp below 70* F without harming the roots.

Things start out as a basic DWC grow. No screen is in place, and the light is hung horizontally. This is where the thick lid is a disadvantage; I can’t get the water level up to the bottom of the pots without it leaking through the lid. So I bought a manifold and connected it to the water pump, making a “Bubbleponics” setup. This kept my seedlings watered until the roots hit the water:

Once the plants got 8” tall, I connected the lower screen. The screen is shaped in an octagon approximately 27” X 27” wide:

Once the plants filled in the lower screen, I connected the upper side screens:

Finally, I connected some side panels to reflect light. The panels are held in place with Velcro for easy removal:

Everything from the plumbing to the screens is assembled/disassembled with ease.

 

[Dystopia]

I vegetated with a 250 watt 55k metal halide bulb mounted in a horizontal hood. The light is raised here for pictures; I lower it right on top of the seedlings, with the light itself about 6-8 inches above the tops. As you can easily tell, everything from the hood to the wiring was DIY:

When I flipped to 12/12 I swapped to a 250 watt Hortilux High Pressure Sodium bulb that puts out somewhere around 35k lumens. The bulb is hung horizontally in a DIY cool tube (using a Bake A-Round and, of course, PCV couplings). I can adjust the light up and down as necessary:

 

[Dystopia]

The closet is vented to the attic with a 120 cfm bathroom ceiling fan:

The light is cooled with a 110 cfm computer fan through some PCV drain pipe and PCV couplings. This keeps the tube cool enough to easily hold on to:

I also have two oscillating fans blowing up into the canopy. Things get dense in a ScrOG, so air circulation is important:

It was still summer when I started the grow, with temps in the 100’s, and initial grow room temps were in the mid to high 80’s. This was not so much due to inadequate ventilation as it was due to the fact that I keep my A/C set to 84* F; no amount of ventilation will fix that. Things have really cooled down around here, and the room stays at a comfy 74* to 78* now.

 

[Dystopia]

I use a 5-gallon bucket with a muffin fan on top, filled with absorbent cat litter and ZEP concentrated odor control. Works great!

 

[Dystopia]

WATER
I guess I have good water, it runs at 60-90ppm straight out of the tap, and I rarely have to pH-adjust it after adding the nutrients. For whatever reason, my soup’s pH “sweetspot” is right around 6.2. This is where it likes to stabilize at after it’s been running in the system for a day or so. If the pH drifts up from there, that means it needs more nutrients; down means less. I don’t chase my pH by adding pH up/down; if it goes out of the 5.6 – 6.6 range that I like to keep that means there’s something wrong.

I believe that keeping your water in the 66* - 70* F range minimizes potential problems and maximizes nutrient uptake. I keep the temperature down by adding frozen ice packs to the lower reservoir when necessary; fortunately, this has not really been necessary much recently as the outside temps have dropped. The insulated ice coolers really help stabilize the temperature.

I use a Sunleaves 140gph four-outlet air pump with 4” air stones for the top reservoir with the roots in it and a smaller air pump for the bottom reservoir. I suspend the big pump using aquarium air hose to minimize the noise.

NUTRIENTS
I soak my rockwool cubes overnight in a Supernatural Rockwool Soak solution. This stuff gets the rockwool pH-ready, and is also a 14-6-13 fertilizer that runs at about 250ppm.

I also soak my seeds for a couple of hours in a glass of this stuff, then put the seeds in paper towels soaked in this stuff, then put the paper towels in a zip-lock bag. I place the bag on top of my warm DSL modem, and my seeds almost always pop within 12 hours.

Once popped, the seeds go into the rockwool and then directly into the system.

I’ve used the Lucas Formula in the past, but was never really happy with it. I’ve gone back to the standard G-M-B ratios as listed on the GH bottles. One of my goals is to do the entire grow with one reservoir change. I started out at 250 ppm, and gradually raised the ppms over three weeks until I’m was in the 800-900 ppm range. This is the highest I’m going to in this grow. I’ve found no real benefit, only problems, with maxing out your nutes. I maintain this level with nutrient add-back during top-offs.

Despite conventional wisdom, I start my seedlings at 250ppm nutrients right from the get-go. I’ve never experienced nute-burn doing this, but I haven’t grown every strain out there either. It’s safer to just use straight water for your seedlings.

By the end of the third week, I’m somewhere around 850 ppm with my veg nutrients. I stayed with the same reservoir water the entire veg cycle and two weeks into 12/12, about 7 weeks total, before I did my first reservoir change to flower nutrients. I find the plants react much better if you stay on veg nutrients for the first two weeks of stretching after flipping to 12/12.

I did a complete flush during the reservoir change. One reason most people do frequent reservoir changes is because they’re worried about salts building up. I’ve found that if you don’t run your nutrients hot then salt build-up is minimal. As proof, I did an overnight flush with a pH’d water and Clearex solution; the solution started at 90ppm and ended at 138 ppm, which is an almost negligible rise. Again, I ran the nutrients for seven weeks before the first change:

For flowering, I mixed up a batch of GH G-M-B nutrients at approximately ¾ the recommended flower strength, and also added Advanced Nutrients Big Bud at ¾ strength. I’ve been on this mix for almost a week now. Here’s my current water conditions:

 

[Dystopia]

Take a seedling:

Let it grow for a couple of weeks:

Top it to get 8 branches:

Let it grow some more, then install a screen:

Tie down the branches so the screen fills out. This screen would be too full if you were only doing a horizontal ScrOG:

Install the side screens, flip the light vertical, and go to 12/12:

And let the stretch fill up the screens:

To train, I started with the branches from the topping:

And trained each branch into the lower screen. There are total of 18 branches going into the screen, and notice all the side shoots. This is a lot of work…I spent 1-2 hours a day for about three weeks taming these bitches:

All these branches continue up the sides. This is just one side panel; there are six more and the open front:

The goal is to achieve a bowl shape around the lights, with the buds layered around the light:

I was originally hoping for 250 grams from this grow; I’m now thinking I may see 350+

 

[Dystopia]

The girls are only just now revealing their beauty, so bud shots are few for now:

 

[Dystopia]

OK, that's all I've got for now, we're up to date. Feel free to post questions/comments...

 

[tom__420]

All I have to say is wow
That is an excellent setup, really well thought out and planned I can see
This should be an awesome grow to follow, pulling up my chair here lol
Keep up the sweet work and nice written and pic updates

 

[StreetRider]

Very nice setup. Solid Grow!

I have a fem mother PPP from Nirvna as well. Look forward to seeing your turn out. I wish I had done the same type of grow, I did mine as a ebb and flow.

Give her time. They lie about the 9 weeks. Give her 11 or untill she is truely done. She is nice in all stages, but I still think I pulled mine to early at 10 weeks. She came out with a nice fruity smell.

 

[loolagigi]

holy shit. great job. must be very dedicated. super man. is it correct you go seven weeks withought a full res change? how often do you clean out your top res?

 

[Dystopia]

All I have to say is wow
That is an excellent setup, really well thought out and planned I can see
This should be an awesome grow to follow, pulling up my chair here lol
Keep up the sweet work and nice written and pic updates

Thanks! Hopefully, the planning will pay off. I'm pretty much done training them, they're on their own now.

Very nice setup. Solid Grow!

I have a fem mother PPP from Nirvna as well. Look forward to seeing your turn out. I wish I had done the same type of grow, I did mine as a ebb and flow.

Give her time. They lie about the 9 weeks. Give her 11 or untill she is truely done. She is nice in all stages, but I still think I pulled mine to early at 10 weeks. She came out with a nice fruity smell.

Nice buds, gives me hope. Yeah, I don't go by the advertised flower times, though these plants are growing as fast or faster then anything I've grown before. I'm at least a week ahead of where I thought I'd be right now.

holy shit. great job. must be very dedicated. super man. is it correct you go seven weeks withought a full res change? how often do you clean out your top res?

Thanks! Yes, I've only done the one reservoir change when I switched to flower nutes at the end of the seventh week. I haven't lifted the lid on the top reservoir since the first screen went on.

It's easy to monitor the water from the bottom reservoir since the water is circulated through the two reservoirs by a pump, 15 minutes on 45 minutes off.

When I did the reservoir change the water looked and smelled as fresh as the day it went in; and I had very little salt build-up.

I do plan on going the rest of the grow with the water that is in there now, but I may chicken out. Just depends on how the plants react.

 

[drabstab]

This is by far the coolest DWC/SCROG combo set up that I have ever seen. How many grows does this make for you now? scribed

 

[unclebobbyb]

That was the reason I looked through this site for the fist time today.How lucky am I to see something so complex be remastered and explained so well. DIY technique worth my applause.

 

[Lt Shiny Sides]

Fanfuckintastic! This is truly unbelievable and you wrote a perfect explanation. I'm definitely here to watch. Can't wait to see the harvest!

 

[polishfalcon420]

very nice work their man. I love the setup it must have taken a lot of work planning and designing it. it seems like it is working very well you deffeinately deserve some rep from everyone that checks it out. Im glad to see you doing the whole res change only a couple of times. I am going to be experimenting with fewer res changes myself with my new diy setup. would you recommend the fewer res changes if the nutes you were using are organic? I use the floranova and really like it but Im not sure about how this would effect the benefical bacterias in the system as in would it let them build up to a harmful measure. man I love these diy setups I find it very rewarding to accomplish a grow in something you built even if it is someone elses design.

 

[Dystopia]

This is by far the coolest DWC/SCROG combo set up that I have ever seen. How many grows does this make for you now? scribed

Thanks! I've been growing hydroponically off and on since my college days in the early 80's (dating myself). Though I have been involved in larger-scale ops in the past, I only grow for personal legal MMJ use now. This will be my 6th grow using a 250 watt light, each one has yielded progressively more as I try new things...

That was the reason I looked through this site for the fist time today.How lucky am I to see something so complex be remastered and explained so well. DIY technique worth my applause.

Fanfuckintastic! This is truly unbelievable and you wrote a perfect explanation. I'm definitely here to watch. Can't wait to see the harvest!

Thank you!

very nice work their man. I love the setup it must have taken a lot of work planning and designing it. it seems like it is working very well you deffeinately deserve some rep from everyone that checks it out. Im glad to see you doing the whole res change only a couple of times. I am going to be experimenting with fewer res changes myself with my new diy setup. would you recommend the fewer res changes if the nutes you were using are organic? I use the floranova and really like it but Im not sure about how this would effect the benefical bacterias in the system as in would it let them build up to a harmful measure. man I love these diy setups I find it very rewarding to accomplish a grow in something you built even if it is someone elses design.

Thanks, man! It really wasn't that hard to build, just measure twice and cut once LOL! I enjoy DIY, though, so it isn't a chore!

OK, you say "I am going to be experimenting with fewer res changes myself with my new diy setup...but Im not sure about how this would effect the benefical bacterias in the system as in would it let them build up to a harmful measure." I don't believe this is a problem you need to worry about, the beneficial bacteria building up is a good thing - this is called "aging" the water.

In fact this is probably the reason I can run the system so long with lower-level nutes between res changes - the beneficial and symbiotic bacteria/fungi that have built up in my res are keeping the water clean AND allowing the roots to take up ALL of the nutrients.

All frequent water changes and reservoir cleanings do is make this "aging" process start over again! If you've ever maintained a large-scale aquarium (I've done reef tanks) you'll understand that you want the beneficials to build up and that you never do a full water change or thoroughly clean the system (unless something is seriously wrong). You want the water to achieve a balanced condition and this takes time; if you do a full water change and kill off the beneficials you have to start building them up all over again to achieve a balance.

If you monitor your pH you'll probably notice that when you first start up the system and add water the pH will usually move around, usually up. If you leave the pH pretty much alone, then within a few days it should start to stabilize - this is an indication that the beneficials are starting to build up. Once the pH has stabilized your water is pretty much balanced and you should never have to worry about pH again.

But time and time again I see newbies chasing the pH, trying to maintain some "optimal" level only to shock the plant, leaving the plant vulnerable to attack from pathogens. And every time you do a full res change/cleaning you have to start this process all over again, leaving the plant open to attack.

Notice I haven't said anything about organic nutrients yet. In my opinion, there are basically two ways you can maintain your water to insure that pathogens don't take over: maintain water conditions that the beneficials thrive in, or sterilize the water so nothing (except roots) can grow in there.

Beneficials love cold water with lots of dissolved oxygen (DO). If you can maintain your water below 70* F then you should have NO PROBLEM attracting and maintaining the benficials REGARDLESS of whether you are using organic or chemical nutrients. The beneficials will keep the water clean and all frequent water changes will do is upset the balance. If you must change the water, then only change one quarter of it at a time.

Nasties love higher water temp with low DO. If you CANNOT maintain low temp/high DO water conditions then in my opinion you should maintain STERILE water (with something like a preventative H2O2 regimen) and ONLY use CHEMICAL nutrients. While organics do attract and feed beneficials (the beneficials are, in fact, necessary for organics to work) they will ALSO attract and feed the nasties IF the water conditions are conducive to the nasties growth. So in poor water conditions I would use chemical nutes only and I would also use H2O2 and do frequent water changes and cleanings to maintain sterile water.

So in short, yes you can grow with few or even no water changes - it is even BETTER if you do, IMO - IF your water conditions are conducive to beneficials. If not, then I would recommend using only chemical nutes and maintaining sterile water with frequent water changes.

 

[MostlyCrazy]

Amazing set up! Your years of experience show big time! At some point I'm going to do this and everytime I see it that gets higher and higher on my to do list. Congratualtions!

 

[Roseman]

Sponge Bob Square Pants lives under the sea,
He grows with tiny bubbles,
just like you and me.

VERY IMPRESSIVE, Very pretty, very healthy, very well thought out.
A MOD ought to make this a STICKY for SSROG.
You can not get this kind of info in a book!