Arite thanks man, pretty much just keep doing it more and more, until the plants say stop haha
Blue Mountian Organics
- Thread starter 0849
- Start date
shannonball
Well-Known Member
i'll throw this in...you don't folair feed during the last three weeks of flowering because the buds will soak that stuff up and the tri-combs will absorb and not possibly not be able to process it completely and since that is what you will be smoking you are in essence smoking some of the nutrients along with the bud. Its okay to hit them with the foliar harmony early on in the process, but not within three weeks of harvest. But since its your plant by all means do whatever you want. It's only my
opinion of course. we love the BMO line of products however you have to adjust them to the plants and what they can handle. Have tried all the major over-priced products and never have we had plants that have tasted so nice as when we used BMo line.
Here is what the owner of BMO told me in an email on using their products...this is exactly what he said and we followed it to the letter and it works oh so well.
Here are some general use guidelines which may be helpful:
The best way to use our products is in rotation. Water, feed, water,
feed, (foliar feed as necessary), on separate days, in a continuous
cycle. All of our liquid products can be mixed together in the same
gallon of water, with no loss in performance.
With the separations in NPK values, you can tune your
fertilizer mix, to the values that best suit your particular plant(s).
We recommend that you mix each liquid product as per the label on the
bottle.
The Super Plant Tonic should be used from seedling stage until
3/4 of the way through the total growth period for short season plants
(plants with a total life of 6 months or less). For trees or shrubs it
can be used throughout the year, provided soil temperatures are above
40 degrees. You mix it as per the label, giving each plant one quart
per gallon of soil volume (1 gallon maximum for in ground plants).
Then it's best to wait two days, to allow the microorganisms to
establish a stable population, before feeding (this applies only to
the first time you use the SPT). After that, it can be used weekly and
directly mixed in with the other products if you desire.
The Grow It Green is used during initial vegetative growth. Use
weekly, giving each plant one quart of mixed up GIG, per gallon of
soil for container plants. Example: 2 gallon pots would receive 2
quarts of mixed up GIG per week. If your plants are in the ground, 1/2
gallon (for light feeding plants) to 1 gallon per week for heavier
feeding plants).
Then just prior to fruit / nut / vegetable / or flower
production, reduce the mixing strength of GIG to 1/2 the bottle
recommended mixing strength and add the Flower Power at 1/2 the bottle
recommended mixing strength. Then slowly reduce the mixing strength of
the GIG, while increasing the mixing strength of the FP. The
decreases and increases should be done in teaspoon sized measurements
( 5 ml).
The Foliar Harmony can be used during vegetative growth and
during fruit / nut / vegetable or flower production. During
vegetative growth, we recommend foliar application every two weeks.
During flowering, foliar application during the first few weeks only,
works best.
FH can also be mixed in with FP (instead of or in conjunction
with the GIG), during the fruit / nut / vegetable or flower production
phase of growth, to increase nitrogen levels to ensure plants finish
at their peak (staying green slightly longer, to increase yield).
If you do use the FH as a Foliar Feed during the later half of
flowering, please rinse foliage with room temperature water, twice
over a two day period prior to harvest. This is best done early in the
morning or late in the evening, with temperatures are cooler. Or prior
to lights on, if growing indoors. Both the tops and bottoms of the
leaves need to be rinsed until a good runoff occurs.
These are general guidelines for using our products, some plants,
like corn and tomatoes, which are heavy feeders, can be fed twice the
label recommended amounts, after the second week of vegetative growth.
The best (safest) way to determine the proper feeding levels
for your particular plants is to start at 1/2 the label recommended
feeding strength, for the first feeding. Then slowly increase the
mixing strengths of our products, with each feeding (in teaspoon
increments). This helps avoid nutrient burning of foliage, which can
slow down plant production.
Some people also try feeding most of their plants at 1/2 the
label recommended mixing strength, then feed two plants at the bottle
recommended mixing strength, the first feeding. If the plants being
fed the stronger mixing strength show no signs of nutrient burn, then
you know it's safe to increase the mixing strength for the others, at
the next feeding.
However, if the two plants being fed the stronger mixing
strength, do show signs of nutrient burn, you have only affected two
plants rather than your whole crop. You would then simply skip the
next feeding of the nutrient burned plants and give them only water on
the next feeding day. After that, they would then receive the same
mixing strength as the larger group on the next scheduled feeding day.
If you use a PH meter to check your mixed up fertilizer
solution, all of our products work best in the range of 5.5 to 7.2
5 to 6 for hydroponics, 6 to 7.2 for soil.
A TDS / EC meter used to determine ppm or EC, will be of little
use with our products. The NPK in each is bound differently than the
highly conductive commercial chemical based fertilizers.
Use of that meter will not reflect the true NPK value of your
mixed up fertilizer solution, since organic fertilizers are less
conductive, because of the way the NPK is bound in longer carbon and
hydrogen chains. Organic fertilizers also lack, PH stabilizers, dyes
and the high mineral salt content of the chemical based fertilizers,
which is why organic fertilizers are much healthier for both your
plants and you.
Our only recommendations about the water you add our products to
are: that is should be chlorine free (for best results) and have a ppm
reading of less than 180 ppm. Above that level, mineral elements in
hard water tend to cause other minerals in the fertilizers to drop out
of solution, rending them less effective.
I hope this information is helpful. If you have any other
questions, please feel free to email us. We will do our best to answer
them promptly.
Thank You. Signed. - Bill Nelson, Owner of Blue Mtn Organics
opinion of course. we love the BMO line of products however you have to adjust them to the plants and what they can handle. Have tried all the major over-priced products and never have we had plants that have tasted so nice as when we used BMo line.
Here is what the owner of BMO told me in an email on using their products...this is exactly what he said and we followed it to the letter and it works oh so well.
Here are some general use guidelines which may be helpful:
The best way to use our products is in rotation. Water, feed, water,
feed, (foliar feed as necessary), on separate days, in a continuous
cycle. All of our liquid products can be mixed together in the same
gallon of water, with no loss in performance.
With the separations in NPK values, you can tune your
fertilizer mix, to the values that best suit your particular plant(s).
We recommend that you mix each liquid product as per the label on the
bottle.
The Super Plant Tonic should be used from seedling stage until
3/4 of the way through the total growth period for short season plants
(plants with a total life of 6 months or less). For trees or shrubs it
can be used throughout the year, provided soil temperatures are above
40 degrees. You mix it as per the label, giving each plant one quart
per gallon of soil volume (1 gallon maximum for in ground plants).
Then it's best to wait two days, to allow the microorganisms to
establish a stable population, before feeding (this applies only to
the first time you use the SPT). After that, it can be used weekly and
directly mixed in with the other products if you desire.
The Grow It Green is used during initial vegetative growth. Use
weekly, giving each plant one quart of mixed up GIG, per gallon of
soil for container plants. Example: 2 gallon pots would receive 2
quarts of mixed up GIG per week. If your plants are in the ground, 1/2
gallon (for light feeding plants) to 1 gallon per week for heavier
feeding plants).
Then just prior to fruit / nut / vegetable / or flower
production, reduce the mixing strength of GIG to 1/2 the bottle
recommended mixing strength and add the Flower Power at 1/2 the bottle
recommended mixing strength. Then slowly reduce the mixing strength of
the GIG, while increasing the mixing strength of the FP. The
decreases and increases should be done in teaspoon sized measurements
( 5 ml).
The Foliar Harmony can be used during vegetative growth and
during fruit / nut / vegetable or flower production. During
vegetative growth, we recommend foliar application every two weeks.
During flowering, foliar application during the first few weeks only,
works best.
FH can also be mixed in with FP (instead of or in conjunction
with the GIG), during the fruit / nut / vegetable or flower production
phase of growth, to increase nitrogen levels to ensure plants finish
at their peak (staying green slightly longer, to increase yield).
If you do use the FH as a Foliar Feed during the later half of
flowering, please rinse foliage with room temperature water, twice
over a two day period prior to harvest. This is best done early in the
morning or late in the evening, with temperatures are cooler. Or prior
to lights on, if growing indoors. Both the tops and bottoms of the
leaves need to be rinsed until a good runoff occurs.
These are general guidelines for using our products, some plants,
like corn and tomatoes, which are heavy feeders, can be fed twice the
label recommended amounts, after the second week of vegetative growth.
The best (safest) way to determine the proper feeding levels
for your particular plants is to start at 1/2 the label recommended
feeding strength, for the first feeding. Then slowly increase the
mixing strengths of our products, with each feeding (in teaspoon
increments). This helps avoid nutrient burning of foliage, which can
slow down plant production.
Some people also try feeding most of their plants at 1/2 the
label recommended mixing strength, then feed two plants at the bottle
recommended mixing strength, the first feeding. If the plants being
fed the stronger mixing strength show no signs of nutrient burn, then
you know it's safe to increase the mixing strength for the others, at
the next feeding.
However, if the two plants being fed the stronger mixing
strength, do show signs of nutrient burn, you have only affected two
plants rather than your whole crop. You would then simply skip the
next feeding of the nutrient burned plants and give them only water on
the next feeding day. After that, they would then receive the same
mixing strength as the larger group on the next scheduled feeding day.
If you use a PH meter to check your mixed up fertilizer
solution, all of our products work best in the range of 5.5 to 7.2
5 to 6 for hydroponics, 6 to 7.2 for soil.
A TDS / EC meter used to determine ppm or EC, will be of little
use with our products. The NPK in each is bound differently than the
highly conductive commercial chemical based fertilizers.
Use of that meter will not reflect the true NPK value of your
mixed up fertilizer solution, since organic fertilizers are less
conductive, because of the way the NPK is bound in longer carbon and
hydrogen chains. Organic fertilizers also lack, PH stabilizers, dyes
and the high mineral salt content of the chemical based fertilizers,
which is why organic fertilizers are much healthier for both your
plants and you.
Our only recommendations about the water you add our products to
are: that is should be chlorine free (for best results) and have a ppm
reading of less than 180 ppm. Above that level, mineral elements in
hard water tend to cause other minerals in the fertilizers to drop out
of solution, rending them less effective.
I hope this information is helpful. If you have any other
questions, please feel free to email us. We will do our best to answer
them promptly.
Thank You. Signed. - Bill Nelson, Owner of Blue Mtn Organics
HailTheLeaf
Well-Known Member
I've been alternating BMO and BioCanna nutes, sometimes just mixed together...so far, so good. Alternating the nutes and watering is a definite must, and yeah chlorine and other toxins (like fluoride) are bad.
shannonball
Well-Known Member
yea the biocanna is good stuff. haven't used it, but a friend loves and like you uses it the the bmo line. take care, shann
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
After about 3 days, countless cups of coffee and pepsi, 6 or 20 joints, an episode of trailer park boys or 4 on break, 23 pages, and a major upgrade in brain activity , I am finally done reading this thread.
Consensus: (how ever u spell it) = I need a microscope.
when i get one , i will be doing some tests.
Also if you are going to buy a blend of beneficial bacteria then choose BMO SPT.
i seen somewhere that if SPT has a microbe count of 1500 or less you will get a refund?
Anyway you want to look at it the SPT cant be beat for the money OR the quality!
I can not believe how some folks just REFUSE to understand that the quality of the ingredients is ALL THAT MATTERS , who gives a fuck if it says OMRI , who gives a fuck if it says it will make your yield bigger, ect.... read and understand the stuff you are puttting into your plants and compare things before saying oh thats just diluted creek water (he dont read)
"You get what you pay for" does NOT mean if its more money then it is better quality.
I will be doing a lil bit of testing with beneficial bacteria/fungi and will report back!
at the moment i am trying very hard to figure out why my organic grows are doing so bad.........
i use promix and liquid organics to feed and something has been causeing a lockout for 3 grows now? Is it impossible to get a good colony of bugs in peat moss/perlite ?
Thanks Ohso , and all the others who contributed to this thread!
Consensus: (how ever u spell it) = I need a microscope.
when i get one , i will be doing some tests. Also if you are going to buy a blend of beneficial bacteria then choose BMO SPT.
i seen somewhere that if SPT has a microbe count of 1500 or less you will get a refund?
Anyway you want to look at it the SPT cant be beat for the money OR the quality!
I can not believe how some folks just REFUSE to understand that the quality of the ingredients is ALL THAT MATTERS , who gives a fuck if it says OMRI , who gives a fuck if it says it will make your yield bigger, ect.... read and understand the stuff you are puttting into your plants and compare things before saying oh thats just diluted creek water (he dont read)
"You get what you pay for" does NOT mean if its more money then it is better quality.
I will be doing a lil bit of testing with beneficial bacteria/fungi and will report back!
at the moment i am trying very hard to figure out why my organic grows are doing so bad.........
i use promix and liquid organics to feed and something has been causeing a lockout for 3 grows now? Is it impossible to get a good colony of bugs in peat moss/perlite ?
Thanks Ohso , and all the others who contributed to this thread!
MyGTO2007
Well-Known Member
UMMM.First off Promix is not organic.....Need to change to FFOF soilAfter about 3 days, countless cups of coffee and pepsi, 6 or 20 joints, an episode of trailer park boys or 4 on break, 23 pages, and a major upgrade in brain activity , I am finally done reading this thread.
Consensus: (how ever u spell it) = I need a microscope.
Also if you are going to buy a blend of beneficial bacteria then choose BMO SPT.
i seen somewhere that if SPT has a microbe count of 1500 or less you will get a refund?
Anyway you want to look at it the SPT cant be beat for the money OR the quality!
I can not believe how some folks just REFUSE to understand that the quality of the ingredients is ALL THAT MATTERS , who gives a fuck if it says OMRI , who gives a fuck if it says it will make your yield bigger, ect.... read and understand the stuff you are puttting into your plants and compare things before saying oh thats just diluted creek water (he dont read)
"You get what you pay for" does NOT mean if its more money then it is better quality.
I will be doing a lil bit of testing with beneficial bacteria/fungi and will report back!
at the moment i am trying very hard to figure out why my organic grows are doing so bad.........
i use promix and liquid organics to feed and something has been causeing a lockout for 3 grows now? Is it impossible to get a good colony of bugs in peat moss/perlite ?
Thanks Ohso , and all the others who contributed to this thread!
Problem solved
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
Ok , why is promix not organic? it does have some micro and macro nutes maybe they are not organic?
(dont want to afford OF, if i did i would choose happy frog instead, unless that is my only option)
I am so lost.
Jerry Garcia
Well-Known Member
I think some pro-mix is organic, such as this product
http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/Ultimate-Organic-Mix/productinfo/SO-PM-UOM/
Because they specify this product is organic, it leads me to believe their other products are not. After looking at a table of ingredients for each product, the only thing not organic about them is probably the starter nutrients included in the bag. Otherwise it's just peat moss, perlite and vermiculite.
Check this link
http://www.premierhort.com/eProMix/Horticulture/Products/pdf/eProCompChart.pdf
Just because it isn't organic doesn't mean you should not use it (especially if you already paid for it). If you plant receives most of its nutrients in the form of organics (i.e. BMO) then you'll still produce sweet smelling, tasty, potent buds.
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
Thanks very much jerry!
I have read those links and a million more in the last few months......I already knew what was in the soil (well close) and like u said just because its not organic dont mean i cant use it. the only thing in there that "might" not be organic is the micro and macro nutes. (i really dont think that will harm the microbes at all)
my question was more towards "can the microbes live and establish in peat?
The organic promix (which i never knew about until yesterday) is the same thing but with compost and castings.
I KNOW that castings and/or compost added to the promix would be great for a good mix, however i did not know this going into the grow. i just wanted to know if anyone has ever heard of a "good grow" with promix and organic nutes? I am getting complete lockouts with this mix, i have tried almost everything and i am stumped. (i have had several good grows prior to using liquid organic nutes)
my old recipe was MG potting mix a couple scoops of perlite and most of the time a pinch of blood meal and bone meal. even without adding the blood/bone my plants would do just fine off of tap water.........
then i got earthjuice to go with my MG mix ........the were locked out completely in 6 or 7 weeks so i repoted into promix and they jumped right back up and did wonderful until first week of bloom then again started actin up again.......anyways its been 3 grows with nothing but probs, i thought maybe bad tap so i got a ro machine. i thought the super acidic nutes from earthjuice were causeing it , so i got humboldts natural line, lookin better but still a huge prob...........
sorry for the cry baby long ass post , but i have to get down to the bottem of this!
ok one more thing i was reading my neem bottle and could this be the prob?
Green Light neem concentrate........OMRI , organic , bla, bla.
Active ingrediant: Clarified hydrophobic extract of neem oil..........70%
Inert ingrediants:...........30%
if that is the problem , it does not happen right after spraying ?????????
wb
Jerry Garcia
Well-Known Member
I don't see any reason why microbes couldn't thrive in peat. I'm using BioBizz Light Mix right now...Sphagnum Peat, Peat Moss, Perlite and very light nutrients are all that's in it. I also like to throw some FF Light Warrior into the mix.
I've only switched the plants with the light mix to flower in the last week or two, but the BMO has done great so far through veg. I was using ocean forest before with success, but they changed up the recipe a little when they opened a new plant in South Carolina to meet the east coast demand for the soil, and now I don't like it. Looks, smells, feels, IS different. So I had to switch.
I'm pretty happy with the BB Light Mix now though. Could use a bit more perlite...and I plan on experimenting by adding amendments like guano and castings. So yes, I think the microbes in BMO will take just fine in a peat-based medium.
I've only switched the plants with the light mix to flower in the last week or two, but the BMO has done great so far through veg. I was using ocean forest before with success, but they changed up the recipe a little when they opened a new plant in South Carolina to meet the east coast demand for the soil, and now I don't like it. Looks, smells, feels, IS different. So I had to switch.
I'm pretty happy with the BB Light Mix now though. Could use a bit more perlite...and I plan on experimenting by adding amendments like guano and castings. So yes, I think the microbes in BMO will take just fine in a peat-based medium.
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
thank u very much!
So did u add some light warrior this run? that shit is full of good shit for microbes too.
so your mix is very close to promix? i dont know yours says "composted peat" what the fuck is that? anyways i am starting to think its not the mix. i just dont know ,i got BMO on the way so we shall see. what do u think about the neem i got?
Jerry Garcia
Well-Known Member
The neem shouldn't be causing problems. I've used the same stuff.
I don't know what composted peat is. I do mix the Light Warrior in though, mostly for the humus and mycorrhizae. I just repotted 2 trainwrecks and 2 JTR's into a mix of mostly BioBizz Light Mix, some Light Warrior, a couple tablespoons of BMO 9-3-2 Mexican bat guano and some BMO worm castings. We'll see how they like it.
durbanmistyman
Well-Known Member
i have had problems with neem oil i have burnt my plants severly with it. never apply it to your plants when they are under light. apply right at the end of your light cycle. i wouldnt even use it unless i was in a 12/12 cycle. damage from it will be similiar to what you would see if the light were to close to foliage: dehydrated, burnt leaves. use neem with caution and i would use it at half reccomended dosage if you are using HID lights. why are you using neem? what pests do you have?Thanks very much jerry!
I have read those links and a million more in the last few months......I already knew what was in the soil (well close) and like u said just because its not organic dont mean i cant use it. the only thing in there that "might" not be organic is the micro and macro nutes. (i really dont think that will harm the microbes at all)
my question was more towards "can the microbes live and establish in peat?
The organic promix (which i never knew about until yesterday) is the same thing but with compost and castings.
I KNOW that castings and/or compost added to the promix would be great for a good mix, however i did not know this going into the grow. i just wanted to know if anyone has ever heard of a "good grow" with promix and organic nutes? I am getting complete lockouts with this mix, i have tried almost everything and i am stumped. (i have had several good grows prior to using liquid organic nutes)
my old recipe was MG potting mix a couple scoops of perlite and most of the time a pinch of blood meal and bone meal. even without adding the blood/bone my plants would do just fine off of tap water.........
then i got earthjuice to go with my MG mix ........the were locked out completely in 6 or 7 weeks so i repoted into promix and they jumped right back up and did wonderful until first week of bloom then again started actin up again.......anyways its been 3 grows with nothing but probs, i thought maybe bad tap so i got a ro machine. i thought the super acidic nutes from earthjuice were causeing it , so i got humboldts natural line, lookin better but still a huge prob...........
sorry for the cry baby long ass post , but i have to get down to the bottem of this!
ok one more thing i was reading my neem bottle and could this be the prob?
Green Light neem concentrate........OMRI , organic , bla, bla.
Active ingrediant: Clarified hydrophobic extract of neem oil..........70%
Inert ingrediants:...........30%
if that is the problem , it does not happen right after spraying ?????????
wb
wyteboi
I do my own mix, but it sounds a lot like the Pro Mix, being basically peat moss, perlite, and pine bark nuggets. Never had a problem for years using Jack's Classic.
Started to go a more organic route, and like you, ran right into lockout problems.
Dolomite lime helped quite a bit along with some epsom salts and cal/mag. I'm still working with it, but apparently the Jack's and in your case the MG had enough to work well with a peat based mix. The micro nutes that is.
Never really had any pH problems using the Jack's either. Never really checked it because there were no lockout problems and I only used tap water.
Been using my mix for close to 40 years and not about to change, but getting the organic nutes dialed in so far, has really been a challenge.
Wet
I do my own mix, but it sounds a lot like the Pro Mix, being basically peat moss, perlite, and pine bark nuggets. Never had a problem for years using Jack's Classic.
Started to go a more organic route, and like you, ran right into lockout problems.
Dolomite lime helped quite a bit along with some epsom salts and cal/mag. I'm still working with it, but apparently the Jack's and in your case the MG had enough to work well with a peat based mix. The micro nutes that is.
Never really had any pH problems using the Jack's either. Never really checked it because there were no lockout problems and I only used tap water.
Been using my mix for close to 40 years and not about to change, but getting the organic nutes dialed in so far, has really been a challenge.
Wet
wyteboi
Well-Known Member
thanks wet!!wyteboi
I do my own mix, but it sounds a lot like the Pro Mix, being basically peat moss, perlite, and pine bark nuggets. Never had a problem for years using Jack's Classic.
Started to go a more organic route, and like you, ran right into lockout problems.
Dolomite lime helped quite a bit along with some epsom salts and cal/mag. I'm still working with it, but apparently the Jack's and in your case the MG had enough to work well with a peat based mix. The micro nutes that is.
Never really had any pH problems using the Jack's either. Never really checked it because there were no lockout problems and I only used tap water.
Been using my mix for close to 40 years and not about to change, but getting the organic nutes dialed in so far, has really been a challenge.
Wet
i have been doing ALOT of research on this organic shit, and you are right , the peters is doing the job for u and before the MG was doing the job for me. (i was using MG with npk too, not just mirco-nutes)
ok i went out and got some MG food 24-8-16 (100% soluble chemicals) just to see if i was right in thinking it was a lockout due to the organic food not being broke down. (i only used MG for the "test" , i have way too much food already to be buying a whole other line of synthetics!)
......So......
i watered 2 or 3 of the really bad ones (the ones that most throw in the trash) with the MG and nothing changed until about 5 or 6 days later , when the pot was startin to dry up, and no bullshit, almost overnight 2 of them went from yellow/purple to dark green. So that tells me my mix is LOW on microbes. So for 1 more test i put the MG on a healthy one and it is about the same as its sisters with organic food. that tells me that the organic food is just as good as the MG if the soil is healthy with plenty of microbes.............bottom line is , IF you or me really want to do organics the right way, then we HAVE to add worm castings or compost to the mix.
if you dont feel like upcanin the ones we already have then i would say use SPT to add the microbes we are missing or stick to a soluble food!
i hope this post helps somebody!
wb
Yeah, what I meant was that the Peters (Jack's), had enough of the micros along with the N-P-K to overcome the ... 'challenges'?? of a peat based mix.
Stuff we need to figure out with the organics.
I will be starting with the worm castings next week when, my air pump and chlorine killer arrive.
Tea time!
My worm bin is close to 5 months old, and the worm population has doubled. So, I not only have a shitload of castings to harvest, but enough worms to start a second bin. By spring, both bins should be full tilt boogie.
Also doing the EM and Myco to go along with all this, but as noted, it's a real bear to get dialed in just right.
I think the smoke AND my veggies will be worth the effort.
Sometimes, I do miss the ease of that 'blue water'.
Wet
Stuff we need to figure out with the organics.
I will be starting with the worm castings next week when, my air pump and chlorine killer arrive.
Tea time!My worm bin is close to 5 months old, and the worm population has doubled. So, I not only have a shitload of castings to harvest, but enough worms to start a second bin.
By spring, both bins should be full tilt boogie.Also doing the EM and Myco to go along with all this, but as noted, it's a real bear to get dialed in just right.
I think the smoke AND my veggies will be worth the effort.
Sometimes, I do miss the ease of that 'blue water'.
Wet