Global Warming Update

[Big P]

4: violent or destructive acts (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands

Even if you want to narrow the definition down to this, what we did to the native americans still qualifies as terrorism. There was violence and destruction commited by groups (the United States) in order to intimidate a population or government (the native americans) into granting their demands (we want your land! Even though we promised you in many treaties that it was yours).

so duke why are you living on thier stolen lands that they were killed for,


if you are part of a robbery that gets somone killed you are considered a murderer as well no?

 

[dukeofbaja]

The short answer: Yes.

 

[Illegal Smile]

4: violent or destructive acts (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands

Even if you want to narrow the definition down to this, what we did to the native americans still qualifies as terrorism. There was violence and destruction commited by groups (the United States) in order to intimidate a population or government (the native americans) into granting their demands (we want your land! Even though we promised you in many treaties that it was yours).

I'm guessing you don't know the first thing about native american history. For example, that almost all native territories changed hands at least once in the late 17th and early 18th centuries as the result of conquest of one tribe over another. Nobody in america ever had any land that they didn't get by taking it from someone else.

 

[PadawanBater]

I'm guessing you don't know the first thing about native american history. For example, that almost all native territories changed hands at least once in the late 17th and early 18th centuries as the result of conquest of one tribe over another. Nobody in america ever had any land that they didn't get by taking it from someone else.

Dude, what about the original inhabitants of North America? The land was unoccupied until 13,000 years ago, no humans at all. Those people took nothing from no one.

 

[fdd2blk]

humans terrorized the land.

 

[CrackerJax]

Todays terrorism is number 4.....

Pay attention please. The Patriot act is all about #4.

Want to rewrite history.... write a book.

This is the here and now....

 

[PadawanBater]

4: violent or destructive acts (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands

Even if you want to narrow the definition down to this, what we did to the native americans still qualifies as terrorism. There was violence and destruction commited by groups (the United States) in order to intimidate a population or government (the native americans) into granting their demands (we want your land! Even though we promised you in many treaties that it was yours).

Duke already addressed that. If you're considering that to be the definition of terrorism you're using, then you have to accept that our ancestors used terrorism against the Native Americans. Honestly man, that is just history, they killed more Indians than the Nazi's did during the Holocaust, fact.

But do you at least see what you're doing and what we're trying to point out? You're favoring America in every instance, even when WE USE TERRORISM, just because you're an American yourself. You're biased dude, that's as clear as day. This is extremely dangerous as it lets our government get away with pretty much anything. You have a duty to stand up and criticize what our government does is wrong. What they're doing now is wrong, and you're NOT a bad person, unpatriotic or unAmerican for admitting it. On the contrary.

 

[Illegal Smile]

Dude, what about the original inhabitants of North America? The land was unoccupied until 13,000 years ago, no humans at all. Those people took nothing from no one.

google meadowcroft rockshelter

 

[PadawanBater]

google meadowcroft rockshelter

The missed the point completely...

Someone said land is either won in battle or bought, and used that as justification for current territory disputes. I said what about unoccupied territories, (referring to any unoccupied territories) and used North America as an example.

What about unoccupied Australia? New Zealand? East Asia? ... All of these lands were once completely uninhabited by humans, the first settlers did not buy or battle anyone for the right to occupy the land.

 

[Big P]

The missed the point completely...

Someone said land is either won in battle or bought, and used that as justification for current territory disputes. I said what about unoccupied territories, (referring to any unoccupied territories) and used North America as an example.

What about unoccupied Australia? New Zealand? East Asia? ... All of these lands were once completely uninhabited by humans, the first settlers did not buy or battle anyone for the right to occupy the land.

what about the animules?

 

[CrackerJax]

Actually territory disputes started when man settled down with agriculture. Indians, and aboriginals were the last of the hunter gatherers...and they were absorbed by agricultural based society. It isn't so much a country by country hit list as it is a shift in mans behavior. Like everything else on the planet.... the solutions are never neat nor clean. But they come about none the less.

 

[PadawanBater]

[youtube]cp-iB6jwjUc[/youtube]

This clip brings up a good point;

It doesn't matter if it's true or false. All they have to do is put a headline out there that says something along the line of what OReilly's bit said "oh... another mistake by the scientific community, they retracted their statement about the sea levels rising..." - ever since the 50's people have described how propaganda works. This is the definition of propaganda. It no longer matters if the information is right or wrong, all that matters is that it makes it out into the communities. Enough people buy it and that's all you need.

Like I said, the mainstream media has become the unofficial 4th branch of the US government...

 

[Illegal Smile]

The missed the point completely...

Someone said land is either won in battle or bought, and used that as justification for current territory disputes. I said what about unoccupied territories, (referring to any unoccupied territories) and used North America as an example.

What about unoccupied Australia? New Zealand? East Asia? ... All of these lands were once completely uninhabited by humans, the first settlers did not buy or battle anyone for the right to occupy the land.

And none of the indians who were here in colonial times were those first settlers, they were just an earlier wave of colonists.

 

[jeff f]

Duke already addressed that. If you're considering that to be the definition of terrorism you're using, then you have to accept that our ancestors used terrorism against the Native Americans. Honestly man, that is just history, they killed more Indians than the Nazi's did during the Holocaust, fact.

But do you at least see what you're doing and what we're trying to point out? You're favoring America in every instance, even when WE USE TERRORISM, just because you're an American yourself. You're biased dude, that's as clear as day. This is extremely dangerous as it lets our government get away with pretty much anything. You have a duty to stand up and criticize what our government does is wrong. What they're doing now is wrong, and you're NOT a bad person, unpatriotic or unAmerican for admitting it. On the contrary.

when discussing current weather/climate controversy can we atleast talk about whats happening within the last hundred years. wtf does what happened to the indians have anything to do with GW?

further, we are standing up to govt pad. jeese, pay attention. its the govt that is taking bullshit information about GW and telling us they are gonna fix it with a huge tax increase. thats wrong! not only wrong but immoral.

with absolutely no proof that anything they have planned will fix anything, they want to take your wealth and give it to somebody else...for what? a fix of what? what will the fix do? will it lower the seas? seriously, why do they want to take peoples money? if i give them one thousand bucks, how much will it change the climate?

we are standing up to corrupt govt. you should be too if you enjoy freedom.

 

[CrackerJax]

I highly suggest if you have not done so already.... read "Guns, Germs, and Steel".
It is a remarkable explanation of mans expansion around the world and exactly what happened and why it happened that way.

An amazing professor as well i might add.

Sidetrack:

My university professor in Ancient History was much the same. My professor was the student to the professor of our University textbook, so she knew every nook and cranny of her teacher/mentor. It was a ripping good class, but you couldn't get baked for it, because you wouldn't be able to keep up. She would walk into our classroom which was a small auditorium (yes, all her classes were crammed full), so we all sat elevated to her upwards, she would say hello, and turn on a projector with a big roll of blank clear film and start scribbling in magic marker. She would machine gun so much information, I would ask any question I could think of just so she would stop writing... (she knew ).

Anyways... that book, GG&S, will really open your eyes to what happened and why it happened the way it did, and what's happening now.

 

[MuyLocoNC]

[youtube]cp-iB6jwjUc[/youtube]

This clip brings up a good point;

It doesn't matter if it's true or false. All they have to do is put a headline out there that says something along the line of what OReilly's bit said "oh... another mistake by the scientific community, they retracted their statement about the sea levels rising..." - ever since the 50's people have described how propaganda works. This is the definition of propaganda. It no longer matters if the information is right or wrong, all that matters is that it makes it out into the communities. Enough people buy it and that's all you need.

Like I said, the mainstream media has become the unofficial 4th branch of the US government...

However, in this case the information itself is propaganda. No different than the mini iceage scare and debunked lies of the enviro-loon activists regarding the spotted owl and the timber industry.

 

[PadawanBater]

further, we are standing up to govt pad. jeese, pay attention. its the govt that is taking bullshit information about GW and telling us they are gonna fix it with a huge tax increase. thats wrong! not only wrong but immoral.

No. Just like I said before, and just like that video clip I posted outlines, the information you are getting, the stuff you think is scientific, is riddled with UNSCIENTIFIC material and relies on ignorance. You just refuse to accept that it's real because every source you go to says exactly what you want it to say. Go to scientific journals, peer reviewed papers, published articles, the SOURCE.

Find me something SCIENTIFIC, not quote mined, not straw manned, not hyperbole, not shit that's fishing for an emotional response. SCIENTIFIC. PEER REVIEWED. Go find me something like that. Can you? Does it exist? Do you have data sets like I provided that outline exactly how ACC is a lie? POST THEM! DO NOT go to media outlets, we all know they lie, you, me and Cracker have talked extensively about how the mainstream media manipulates information to fit their agenda. So again man, if you want to bring me something CREDIBLE from a CREDIBLE source, I'd be more than willing to look at it and if it says it's all a lie, I would consider it.

with absolutely no proof that anything they have planned will fix anything, they want to take your wealth and give it to somebody else...for what? a fix of what? what will the fix do? will it lower the seas? seriously, why do they want to take peoples money? if i give them one thousand bucks, how much will it change the climate?

Idk what it is man, but have you never seen or heard what could happen to the planet if it warms by as little as 5 degrees C? Do you know the average increase that's been recorded the past century? 0.74C +- 0.18C, climate model projections estimate an additional 1.1C-6.4C increase in the 21st century.

And it's not just about pumping shit into the atmosphere... I know you guys like to rally around that talking point, but there are a ton of other variables to consider. Deforestation, population density...

I highly suggest if you have not done so already.... read "Guns, Germs, and Steel".
It is a remarkable explanation of mans expansion around the world and exactly what happened and why it happened that way.

An amazing professor as well i might add.

Sidetrack:

My university professor in Ancient History was much the same. My professor was the student to the professor of our University textbook, so she knew every nook and cranny of her teacher/mentor. It was a ripping good class, but you couldn't get baked for it, because you wouldn't be able to keep up. She would walk into our classroom which was a small auditorium (yes, all her classes were crammed full), so we all sat elevated to her upwards, she would say hello, and turn on a projector with a big roll of blank clear film and start scribbling in magic marker. She would machine gun so much information, I would ask any question I could think of just so she would stop writing... (she knew ).

Anyways... that book, GG&S, will really open your eyes to what happened and why it happened the way it did, and what's happening now.

 

[jeff f]

No. Just like I said before, and just like that video clip I posted outlines, the information you are getting, the stuff you think is scientific, is riddled with UNSCIENTIFIC material and relies on ignorance. You just refuse to accept that it's real because every source you go to says exactly what you want it to say. Go to scientific journals, peer reviewed papers, published articles, the SOURCE.

Find me something SCIENTIFIC, not quote mined, not straw manned, not hyperbole, not shit that's fishing for an emotional response. SCIENTIFIC. PEER REVIEWED. Go find me something like that. Can you? Does it exist? Do you have data sets like I provided that outline exactly how ACC is a lie? POST THEM! DO NOT go to media outlets, we all know they lie, you, me and Cracker have talked extensively about how the mainstream media manipulates information to fit their agenda. So again man, if you want to bring me something CREDIBLE from a CREDIBLE source, I'd be more than willing to look at it and if it says it's all a lie, I would consider it.

Idk what it is man, but have you never seen or heard what could happen to the planet if it warms by as little as 5 degrees C? Do you know the average increase that's been recorded the past century? 0.74C +- 0.18C, climate model projections estimate an additional 1.1C-6.4C increase in the 21st century.

And it's not just about pumping shit into the atmosphere... I know you guys like to rally around that talking point, but there are a ton of other variables to consider. Deforestation, population density...

what type scientific data do you want....temps were normal this year? something like that? because we have literaly pointed to at least a thousand sources ofver the months. besides the tons of scientists who have come out against it, all the fake base temperatures (that alone should tell you whats going on). there arent scientists out there trying to prove the earth is changing natural. they dont exist. the science currently being studied is if the climate is changing and if we are causing it. nobody writes/does a study that says, hey everything is normal.

so the bottom line here is what you have from scientists in a nutshell. the climate may or may not be changing, and if it is changing is it normal or is it caused by man....period. there are a fair amount of scintists on both sides.

see this is what you dont understand, i have been through countless studies exactly like this, global cooling, rainforest, spotted owl, ice ages,ddt, and on and on. this one is exactly like the others. either completely disproved or vastly over stated.

global warming is more advanced than the others. the reason is that govt has figured out a way to take more money from people so they have given it the utmost attention. i am not williing to go quietly this time. i have a good job and business and i am having a hard time getting by. i am not afraid to work, any work. its hard to come by. and i hae nothing lavish at all. the economy is a total wreck, people are struggling and these bastards want more.

if they take any more of my money i will seriously consider shutin off tv or phone service. its that tight from where i am right now. everyone is on welfare and i am to proud to take handouts so i work longer and harder. i am at my max for my age. i cannot work any harder. and these rotten cock suckers want to tax my energy for some phantom sickness that is strictly a religion to its followers. its a punish big oil scam by fucking the llittle people at the bottom. i ant going away quetly on this one pad. this one is serious for me and the country. and it deserves everyones attention. its a huge money grab for govt of monumental proportion. and it will continue to grow bigger and more intrusive just like the gas tax.

the average gas tax in the us is 50 cents a gal. at every stage in the oil business the company makes about 10 cents. so drillers make 10 haulers make ten, refinery makes 10 haulers make 10 provider makes 10. this isnt exact but its very very close within 10%. so the govt is making 5 times profits, and i might add that these are windfall prophets. i am sure you have heard that term used. the only leg in the game that makes winfall profits is the govt. every one else eans it. yet those same bastards call the oil companies winfall profits but they arent, they were earned. so fuck global warming even if it is happening. in another 10 years we will figure out that nuclear is the way to go on car engines and everything.....problem solved with zero to no pain. the market will fix this pad, the market will fix this.....watch.

 

[jeff f]

.

Idk what it is man, but have you never seen or heard what could happen to the planet if it warms by as little as 5 degrees C? Do you know the average increase that's been recorded the past century? 0.74C +- 0.18C, climate model projections estimate an additional 1.1C-6.4C increase in the 21st century.



okay and here is my problem with that. its 7 degrees cooler where one of my daughters lives from my house. so if the temp increased and average 7 degrees her house would by like my house. so what? who cares. yes, some rivers will rise, some will fall, snow fall will become different. so what? the growing season here woud prbably be 2 weeks longer her like it is a couple hundred miles down the coast. so what. it may be what god has planned to this the heard, who knows. you cant stop it pad, you cant stop it no matter what. not even if you held a gun to every person on earths head you still wont be able to FIX it. man will never be able to fix it its completely out of our control. get used to it.

 

[dukeofbaja]

okay and here is my problem with that. its 7 degrees cooler where one of my daughters lives from my house. so if the temp increased and average 7 degrees her house would by like my house. so what? who cares.

I think I'll change the temp in my grow room from 78 to 71 or 85. Because, so what? Who cares?

Oh, wait. I do. That's my yield we're talking about.