CaL's DON'Ts for indoor soil growers

PANGcake

Active Member
I put this together as I think it can help many lost souls out there in the forums, I was one of them too...trial and error.

”Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness. For he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.” (everything but the lord part, I'm mearly a peasant :mrgreen: )

DON'T use soil with a wide pH range, ex. 5,5-6,5 pH, this means the soil is badly mixed. Soils between 6,0-6,5 pH is in my opinion best. I use a soil with pH 6,2 and this has shown great for nutrient uptake and overall growth.


DON'T plant you seed or cutting in a ”hot” soil for vegging plants. Use a lighter soil. When I grow from seed I put the seed in a top layer of light soil (2-3inch) and hot soil beneath for it to break into after few days. When grown from cutting/clone I put my cuttings in a light mix untill they have rooted well under a humidity dome, and when transplanted I put them in hot soil.


DON'T use supermarket soil. Cheaper soils tend to have wide pH range and less nutrients and most of them don't even have micro nutrients. Typically they contain N-P-K, calcium and magnesium (Mg) but no micro nutrients and with a ”cirka” value for pH.


DON'T use a brand of soil that doesn't declare the contents (typically ”cannabis brands” don't). It's a lot easier to diagnose a plant deficiency if you know the contents of your soil and nutrients. Some deficiencies show same symptoms wich really makes it a guessing game unless you know what your working with.


DON'T feed your plants any nutrients during the first 3-4 weeks. If you have invested in a soil proven to be packed with macro and micro nutrients you don't need to feed your plants anything but water first few weeks. This is where many first timers go wrong. They're so eager for the plants to grow and typically burn them early on. I on the other hand waited too long on my first grow ;) and first sign was Mg deficiency.


DON'T pH the water before adding nutrients and in most cases you don't even have to pH the nutrient solution either. Nutrients I use put the solution at 6,5 pH wich is a good value for the plant to maximize nutrient uptake.


DON'T waste money on a pH pen. When growing in soil you don't need a 100% accuracy for testing your nutrient solution. Most soils are made up by mainly peat wich buffers excellent hence it's not important to know the exact pH of the nutrient solution, it's more important to know the pH of the soil, some direction is allways good though and for that I recomend pH drops for fresh water. I bought them for around 7$ for 250 tests and I've used them bout 20 times, now I know the pH value for adding different amounts of nutrients and really don't test my pH anymore, not even when flushing since I got it written down how much of pH down I need.


DON'T use nutrients made for hydroponic cultivation exclusivly. Use nutrients for soil purposes wich containts both macro and micronutrients, make sure it doesn't lack anything vital for cannabis. I use a 14-14-21 all the way through from veg to harvest wich has a high content of Mg 0,6% and enough of the other micronutrients.


DON'T use nutrients that don't reveal their content (typicall ”cannabis nutrient brands”). Same as I mentioned earlier on regarding soil, it's a lot easier diagnosing a plant problem knowing the exact contents of both soil and nutrients.


DON'T feed any nutrients to your plant(s) last week up till harvest, for best taste and aroma cannabis should be allowed some N deficiciency in late bloom. Only feed water or flush with plain water.


DON'T harvest to early. Harvest time is an over all appearnce decission. If you only go by the ”colour” of the trichomes you might fool yourself as the ”amber tint” trichomes take on late in bloom goes in waves, they might very well be 50% amber in week 6 only to be all ”clear” day after. The bud should be swollen and hard, the pistills have started their way back into their ”pods” and are about 50% ”brown” (this varies from strain to strain) and trichomes should be fully formed. I leave it up to you to decide if to harvest when trichomes are all clear, cloudy or started to amber. I have only grown Indicas and they are in my opinion best to harvest when trichomes are all cloudy, this way you get lil of ”both worlds”. If harvest when clear you can achieve a more ”uppy” high but it won't last long and you'll get dissapointed. If harvested when ”cloudy” you get both an uppy high and a stoney body feeling. If harvested when trichomes are allowed to become 25-30% amber you get a good sleeping pill, best to smoke alone ;)


DON'T use any ”fast drying” methods. This will damage your final product sevearly. Hang the plants whole at a temp 20-25C and RH around 40% and good airflow, not directed to the chopped plants. This will allow for a ”slow” drying, typically takes me 7-9 days, allowing for most of the chlorophyll to be broken down and evaporated with the moist, before curing.. At this time stems should still be ”bendy” not ”snappy”. Trim and place buds in jars. Trimming right before the curing IF most chlorophyll is broken down, will allow your buds to sweat and stink up. If dried to fast then starting to cure the chlorophyll break down process will go on in your jar and add to that ”hay” smell we all know of.


DON'T ever think that curing will give you dank nugs. If it's not dank at harvest it won't be dank after curing. Curing only improves!


Vote on thread to let me know what you guys n' gurls think. If you have any questions post them in thread and I will try answer them.


Keep it real! :bigjoint:


//CaL
 

Southern.IL.Buds

Active Member
Yes these are good pointers, careful with the trace minerals and micro nutrients though, overuse will toxify your soil faster than anything.. +rep
 

PANGcake

Active Member
Yes these are good pointers, careful with the trace minerals and micro nutrients though, overuse will toxify your soil faster than anything.. +rep
Ty also for the kind words.

After a close examination of the contents of BioBizz nutrients vs nutrients I got from a plant school owner, and doing a side by side BioBizz nutrients + the soil I've allways used vs "plant school" soil and nutes, I've come to the conclusion that they both work equally good, the plants in plant school soil are looking slightly healthier, don't get me wrong there's nothing wrong w the BioBizz plants, I've never said their nutes are bad, but he's are equally good or even slightly better and instead of mixing up solution from 5 dif bottles + Super Vit...



...I mix 1 tsp nutes/4liter water + SuperVit from week 4-5 in veg up till harvest ;)



getting the same result and saving $$$. That jar cost me 5,50$ and it's gonna last me twice as long as those 5 BioBizz bottles at a total prize of 120$...roughly cutting my cost w 70$/grow wich is pretty much considering I only have 4-6 ladies in flower and this money could be spent on...let's say another 400W's electric bill and suddenly you have 8-10 plants to harvest ;)

//CaL


edit: Oh I fergot my "point" w this post...hehe. Point is do your homework and don't fall for the brands at the "cannabis grow shop" and you can also save time and money and maybe even get better results...they work fine.
 

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GreenGame

Member
I can't say I agree with every point you made, but you get an A for making an effort to help complete novices.
 

PANGcake

Active Member
Good info pangcake, do you also have a "DO" list to publish for us novices??
Thanks for the great info Cal
Can you give us some of the Do's.
The reason why I made a DON'T thread is that he DO's are harder to precise. "They" interact more subtile together w the enviroment, strain etc. but gimme few days to think bout it and I will try to narrow it down :roll:

I can't say I agree with every point you made, but you get an A for making an effort to help complete novices.
Ty! It would be interesting to know where you don't agree w me, I'm not trying to win any argument, I'm in these forums to learn and to pass on what I've learned.

I vote sticky
;)
 

GreenGame

Member
DON'T feed your plants any nutrients during the first 3-4 weeks. If you have invested in a soil proven to be packed with macro and micro nutrients you don't need to feed your plants anything but water first few weeks. This is where many first timers go wrong. They're so eager for the plants to grow and typically burn them early on. I on the other hand waited too long on my first grow :wink: and first sign was Mg deficiency.


This is kind of subjective. Depending on the size of the pot, the size of the plant IN the pot, the vigor of the plant, the amount of light / heat around the plant , you may need to feed anywhere from 1-6 weeks. Learning to read your leaves is an aquired art, and it is the best way to know when to (start to) feed.



DON'T pH the water before adding nutrients and in most cases you don't even have to pH the nutrient solution either. Nutrients I use put the solution at 6,5 pH wich is a good value for the plant to maximize nutrient uptake.


Again, this is very subjective. Nutes can affect the Ph to varying degrees, with some fluctuation even when using the same water source. Ph'ing your mixed solution is always a good idea...always.




DON'T waste money on a pH pen. When growing in soil you don't need a 100% accuracy for testing your nutrient solution. Most soils are made up by mainly peat wich buffers excellent hence it's not important to know the exact pH of the nutrient solution, it's more important to know the pH of the soil, some direction is allways good though and for that I recomend pH drops for fresh water. I bought them for around 7$ for 250 tests and I've used them bout 20 times, now I know the pH value for adding different amounts of nutrients and really don't test my pH anymore, not even when flushing since I got it written down how much of pH down I need.


A properly maintined Ph / EC pen is a great tool , making life easier. Granted most brand new growers probably won't want to shell out the cash for a good pen right away, but I don't see the value in telling people not to get one. If you have some extra cash and are mixing up large amounts of solution or mixing solution often grab a pen. The Drops work just fine as well, just more work.




DON'T feed any nutrients to your plant(s) last week up till harvest, for best taste and aroma cannabis should be allowed some N deficiciency in late bloom. Only feed water or flush with plain water.


Subjective advice again. Depending on many factors, you may want to stop feeding anywhere from 1 to 4 weeks. In most cases, for " best taste and aroma " you are looking at AT LEAST 2 weeks of nothing but pure water with a good flush or two during that time.

Just trying to help.
 

PANGcake

Active Member
I took 30mins and made a reply to your post then Rollitup messed my post up when I submitted it and now I have to do it all over again...

This is kind of subjective. Depending on the size of the pot, the size of the plant IN the pot, the vigor of the plant, the amount of light / heat around the plant , you may need to feed anywhere from 1-6 weeks. Learning to read your leaves is an aquired art, and it is the best way to know when to (start to) feed.
All is relative, learning to read you plants is a must, but starting to feed nutrients allready after 1 week growing in a hot soil and I promise your plants gonna "burn" ;)

Again, this is very subjective. Nutes can affect the Ph to varying degrees, with some fluctuation even when using the same water source. Ph'ing your mixed solution is always a good idea...always.
I googled my water supplier and over the past year the pH has been constant at 8,4, I've tested and showed to be so. They also have a full "content list". A pH pen is always handy but it's not "needed". Everyone I've spoken to from "regular" grow shops and the seasoned plant school owner have told me that testing the pH is a waste of time since the soil buffers to where it's at but if fed a solution at higher pH over time might raise the pH in the soil . Everyone I've spoken to from "cannabis" grow shops have stressed how important it is to test your pH and ofc they have the "right" equipment for ya :cuss: I've done a side by side where I gave 2 plants nothing but water their first 3 weeks, only difference was one was fed water at 6,5 pH and the other water straight outta the tap at 8,4 pH and they grew equally good. I still think it could stress your plant initially when watered a pH way outta range even though the soil buffers that's why I used the drops to get aproximate values. Another experiment I did to see how good the soil really is at buffering was I flushed a bagseed plant w water 8,4 pH. It had been growing in that soil for 9 weeks getting fed at 6,5 pH. The run off after flushing it 3 x the size of the pot was still at 6,0 pH as the soil. From my "experiments" and from the advice given to me from people not making any $$$ on their advice I came to the conclusion that the pH doesn't need to be spot on. This is my take on the pH hysteria ;)

A properly maintined Ph / EC pen is a great tool , making life easier. Granted most brand new growers probably won't want to shell out the cash for a good pen right away, but I don't see the value in telling people not to get one. If you have some extra cash and are mixing up large amounts of solution or mixing solution often grab a pen. The Drops work just fine as well, just more work.
Again an EC pen is a handy tool but if you can't read your plants it won't do you any good?! I never really saw the needs for one, I mean I can tell by adding up soil + nutrients + growth and enviroment what my plants can take/need and I get a full content listing at my water suppliers web page. How would an EC pen help me?

Subjective advice again. Depending on many factors, you may want to stop feeding anywhere from 1 to 4 weeks. In most cases, for " best taste and aroma " you are looking at AT LEAST 2 weeks of nothing but pure water with a good flush or two during that time.

Just trying to help.
I recomend following the guidelines for the nutrients you use. Try keepin the foliage as green as possible, leaves are light catchers. I don't think anyone would say to stop feeding nutrients early as 4 weeks prior to harvest. I mean last 2-3 weeks before flushing is when buds really pack on their weight, potency, taste and aroma and nutrient need is at its peak, doesn't make sense. Plants I've flushed 2 weeks before harvest have showed to be too soon, less yield, potency, taste and aroma than those flushed only for last 7 days.


Thanks for your input =P


//pce, CaL
 

Wooded

Member
Unlucky Cal, shit that.... Just a question on your flushing now its been brought up, what flushing procedure do you find works best for you with soil?? Only, I was planning on flushing a week before harvest... Im on my 1st grow BTW!! Got alot to learn in a rather short ammount of time.
 

PANGcake

Active Member
Shitty deal you had to re-type all that shit again, but a very nice rebuttal
Thanks! I just took a deep breath and started the re-writing ;)

Unlucky Cal, shit that.... Just a question on your flushing now its been brought up, what flushing procedure do you find works best for you with soil?? Only, I was planning on flushing a week before harvest... Im on my 1st grow BTW!! Got alot to learn in a rather short ammount of time.
I take my ladies to the tub, pH water to 6,5, then I start flushing ;) Takes 3-4 days before it dries up for next flush. I flush 2 times before chop chop. Using organic nutrients and not flush, didn't make any difference, in fact after drying and curing that plant was the sweetest...

//CaL
 

GreenGame

Member
the possible fluctuation of PH in your mixed solution usually comes from the nutes and not the water.

I'm not here to put my dick in your mashed potatoes, just discussing my favorite subject.

Rock on.
 

PANGcake

Active Member
the possible fluctuation of PH in your mixed solution usually comes from the nutes and not the water.

I'm not here to put my dick in your mashed potatoes, just discussing my favorite subject.

Rock on.
I know you're not :-P

Yes the pH of nute solutions can in some cases fluctuate, however I really don't think that's a problem for soil growers, partly because of what I've allready said bout the soil buffering, but also because fluctuation occurs after letting the solution "sit" or when a hydro grower has run it through the system. A soil grower should feed his plant(s) straight after mixing up the solution and I can't imagine the soultion fluctuate within the first 5 minutes, maybe?! If you leave let's say a nute solution of organic nutrients for even as little as 24h it's ruined. I recomend watering right after mixing your solution and I can guarantee you don't have to worry bout pH fluctuation...many growers would tell you to let the water sit for a day or two before feeding to get rid of the cholrine etc., this is a good tip, but it doesn't work for me, why? I use nutrients that don't contain any calcium, beacuse they are made for the conditions we have where I live, very calcium rich tap water + soil, and my tap water is the "cleanest" in the world, just saying, letting it sit rids some of the calcium also. Had I on top of that used calcium in my nutes, there's a risk it flocculates when a concentrated form is combined with potassium...and I use a 14-14-21 NPK. If you have to let your tap water "sit" for a day or two, let it do so but without nutrients.



//CaL
 

Total Head

Well-Known Member
I'm sorry for addressing this matter here, but I don't know where to turn...Well, I can't get to my "My rollitup", says "data base error"...can't get to anything that's "mine", can't send PM's either T_T

If your not a MOD, PLEASE send this to a MOD to help fix my account ;)

Have a nice weekend!

//CaL

omg i'm going thru the same thing. i was only able to get to this site by clicking a link of the search engine and if this even posts i'll shit myself. i can't navigate the site at all. i was trying to rep you for the post but it won't let me...
 

PANGcake

Active Member
Keep spitting out the true word my brotha
Ha ha...when it all comes down growing cannabis isn't rocket science, but it isn't "easy" either.

Some people spend thosands of $$$ and still fail cuz they don't know the "basics" or they're "over doing" things to the point where they no longer know where it all went wrong, they don't take time to learn bout the subject before they start. My first grow was in the closet with a 40w normal bulb and a bag seed. It grew for 10 days then slowly died...wonder why? ;) Then I decided to learn some more before I ordered seeds. Watched hundreds of hours of youtube videos, the "green guy", some english growing video in 3 parts wich is excellent etc. I read loads about cultivation probably another few hundred hours, checked where I could buy all stuff I needed to a good price, started asembling what I needed, ordered seeds and as I waited I built my first set up. It went ok. I grew under fluoros and cfl's as I had read "it works fine" and filled up the grow space w lights LOL. Buds were fluffy, pretty potent but all in all I got dissapointed and didn't grow anything for some time. An opportunity arose and I got my hands on some unexpected $$$, at the same time I was fed up w the fkn cheap @ss "entrepreneurs" in the streets w bad goods. I decided to start "self medicating" ;) Invested in some ballasts, ordered seeds and built a good set up this time around. Spent some time catching up on the subject and started growing w bag seeds to test set up and enviroment first. Went ok but I ovedid things...especially did I over read my plants "OMG there are burnt tips, THEY'RE DYING!!!!" hehe...took a step back, simplified things and today I grow some dank buds keeping it "simple".

//CaL
 
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