Grow noob, looking for help on my tall skinny plants..

[1quickhatch]

Ok so this is my first grow so I'm still learning and reading every day, which I'd like to first give thanks to those who've posted up much of the good info here... I'm at a bit of a stand still, I'm growing some middies just since it's my first grow and I'm not 100% sure on how to do it all correctly yet I just wanted to give it a shot... I'm using Scott's Premium Potting Soil, and have had the light at 18/6 since seedlings until now (day 40) and these things are looking super skimp... I've not fertilized or anything because I first read that Scott's is good for up to 100 days before you have to fertilize, nor have I really cropped anything off until today I got rid of a few yellowish leaves...

Anyways, my living situations limit my grow room ability since I have family and maintenance always coming in and out I need to be able to hide it fast/easily.. And I'm not really raking in the dough so money is a bit of an issue (hence why I went with Scott's mix)... I've watered them with bout 250oz water every 2-3 days, and just yesterday moved them from the beginner cups to 1 gallon tubs... I'm using three 75 watt, crystal clear bulbs about 10-12" above plants and they are kept in a room that's usually between 70-80 degrees... So basically I just need some help on when to trim, is MG Bloom Blaster good (it's all that I have locally), and why at 6 weeks do they look so skimpy..?? Is it lack of water, nutes, or light..?? Thanks and I look forward to learning much more as I go along on my quest lol...

Day 1

Day 40

 

[djruiner]

i think the problem is your using normal everyday lights right? incandescent bubls do not put off the right specturm of light to grow mj.thats why they are so stretched and not growing but in height.try using some cfl's...can get a 2 pack at walmart for under 10 bucks.and keep the light at most 2-4 inches above the plant.make sure they are 6500k...grow bulbs.since they are not getting the right type of light they are stretching out in effort to get close to the light source.need to have at least 2 bulbs per plant.honestly..these are past the point of no return...in the slight chance they do flower...the tiny lil stems wont hold the weight.i would chop them and start over..hate to say it tho

 

[chuck taylor]

looks like its lacking light and u might wanna go grab yourself a few cfls

 

[napa23]

you dind't buy these seeds did you? I would say just scrap it and start over. And next time but a fan on you plants to strengthen the stems

 

[Green Love]

Ok, the lighting schedule is fine at 18/6, you need a fan on your plants at all times (though you don't need a fan), its recommended for air circulation and strengthing of the plants stalks. It might help if you invest in some cfl's and build you a cheap light setup. Something with 4-8 (cfl bulbs, the swirily tubed kind). Some light sockets, a board, some wiring caps, etc. The light your using dosen't have the wattage your plant needs to surive and thrive nor the spectrum.

 

[highsiden]

Try a 150 MH same heat more light

 

[1quickhatch]

Damn super quick responses..!! Thanks for all your input guys and I guess I left out the fan part... I've got a walmart box fan about 2 feet from the plants on level 2 setting (the kind with the knob u turn from 1-2-3) and that's been on them at all times and also the ceiling fan remains on when the lights are on... But no I didn't buy these I actually have a 35mm camera vile filled about halfway with seeds that I've gathered over the past 6 months to a year and I just used 5 of them and as you can tell 2 didn't make it past the first few days so I was left with 3 others... So do CFL's and MH's produce the same amount needed..?? And also, just because these are only mid-grades doesn't mean they will grow any differently than something a lot more potent, correct..?? Same water, temps, light schedule, etc..?? And by trimming them down did you guys mean just take them out and start over, or literally cut them down to about 3-4 inches and start the process over..??

Thanks for the fast responses guys, I heard this site was kick ass for help an it's already being proven right..!!

 

[napa23]

CFL's won't produce as much light as MH. But you can get them closer to the plant, making them bushier and still keep the temperatures lower. The quality of the weed you got the seeds from doesn't determine the quality of bud you can produce...not entirely anyway. Take care of your plants and grow/dry/cure them properly and you can still get killer bud. Yes start over, especially since these are bagseeds and you didn't spend money on them and you have no idea of the sex. Go through the newbie forum and read everything...literally. Then go through the rest of the site and read everything you can. You're not ready to grow yet buddy, not to rag on you or anything. It just takes a lot of researching and patience to make a good grow. Any other questions just post them. Good luck.

Edit: also you might want to get some different soil. You say your soil can feed for up to 100 days? They don't need nutrients until around 3 weeks. You could use your soil I suppose, but it's not optimum. Some strains are very sensitive to stress and go hermie very easily...not something you want. Do you know how to water properly? Also if you're going to grow, you'll need bigger pots. Preferable 5 gallon, 3 gallon minimum.

 

[djruiner]

Damn super quick responses..!! Thanks for all your input guys and I guess I left out the fan part... I've got a walmart box fan about 2 feet from the plants on level 2 setting (the kind with the knob u turn from 1-2-3) and that's been on them at all times and also the ceiling fan remains on when the lights are on... But no I didn't buy these I actually have a 35mm camera vile filled about halfway with seeds that I've gathered over the past 6 months to a year and I just used 5 of them and as you can tell 2 didn't make it past the first few days so I was left with 3 others... So do CFL's and MH's produce the same amount needed..?? And also, just because these are only mid-grades doesn't mean they will grow any differently than something a lot more potent, correct..?? Same water, temps, light schedule, etc..?? And by trimming them down did you guys mean just take them out and start over, or literally cut them down to about 3-4 inches and start the process over..??
Thanks for the fast responses guys, I heard this site was kick ass for help an it's already being proven right..!!

..i ment to cut it down...they are not gonna be worth it.and yeah they can grow different..depending on what type they are...sativa or indica...sativas tend to grow taller and skimpier..indicas are short and dense.sativas tend to have more of an "up" high..social weed.where indicas are more of a body couchlock type stone.you can sometimes get a mix of both or a % of both.being random bagseeds it can be hard to tell what your getting.and as for the cfl..mh thing...mh will produce more light (lumens) but cost much more and to me seem like more heat and high power cost..cfls are fairly lower watts..but put out a good light spectrum.best bet for a budget..try getting some seeds from..worldwidemarijuanaseeds.com they sell single seeds...some at 2-3 bucks a peice.fast shipping and really stealth.this way you KNOW what strain you are getting..and can get shorter growing plants for small areas.and these guys ship to the USA no problem.

 

[1quickhatch]

CFL's won't produce as much light as MH. But you can get them closer to the plant, making them bushier and still keep the temperatures lower. The quality of the weed you got the seeds from doesn't determine the quality of bud you can produce...not entirely anyway. Take care of your plants and grow/dry/cure them properly and you can still get killer bud. Yes start over, especially since these are bagseeds and you didn't spend money on them and you have no idea of the sex. Go through the newbie forum and read everything...literally. Then go through the rest of the site and read everything you can. You're not ready to grow yet buddy, not to rag on you or anything. It just takes a lot of researching and patience to make a good grow. Any other questions just post them. Good luck.

Edit: also you might want to get some different soil. You say your soil can feed for up to 100 days? They don't need nutrients until around 3 weeks. You could use your soil I suppose, but it's not optimum. Some strains are very sensitive to stress and go hermie very easily...not something you want. Do you know how to water properly? Also if you're going to grow, you'll need bigger pots. Preferable 5 gallon, 3 gallon minimum.

Well I read on another grow forum, that if optimum soil is not available Scott's Premium will work fine that's why I chose that route, and also I've read that 200 oz of water every 2-3 days would be fine for my strain of herb since it wasn't top knotch stuff that's why I asked if it mattered the origin of the seed... Thank's for all your information though dude you're helpin me out a lot and savin me some serious time lol... So as of this far I've only spent about $10 and really only thing that I've wasted was time itself haha.. And since my livin situation restricts me from doing anything out of control perhaps I'll just grow one plant at a time... I went on Walmart's site and found some CFL's that were 6500K but they were only 20 watts, does that sound right..?? Also, should I put the seed right from germination into the 5 gallon pot or do as I did before and put it into the red plastic cup for a few weeks than transfer it..?? Thanks again for your assistance and no harm done by telling me the honest truth, I know I have tons to learn I just figured since I'm not going to be growing out of control everything in my situation would just be less than a normal grower would use, but I still have plenty of reading to do...

 

[racerboy71]

i agree with everyone else.. i would just start over from scratch honestly.. they are so tall and skimpy because like everyone else has said, they are searching for more light..
go get a few cfl's from anywhere.. you want the biggest actual watt bulbs that you can find.. you have to read the package carefully as they say something like 100 watt in big letters, but when you look a lil closer, it says 100 watt equivelent.. meaning that they put off the same amount of lumens as a 1oo watt incadescent bulb.. incadescent bulbs are the normal old skool type of bulb that you use to light up a dark room, and they are the worst option for growing mj with.. they use most of their energy making heat and not so much in the way of lumens.. and what lumens they do put off, are all in the wrong spectrum for what you need..
cfls come in different spectrums, which make them ideal for growing mj.. you will want the 6500 k( kelvin) ones for vegging, and the 2700k for flowering.. or you can mix and match them for a broader spectrum of light.. cfl's also don't put out much in the way of heat, which allows you to place them very close to your plants without burning them.. put them around two or so inches away from your plants.. you will need to move them alot as the plants grow as they will burn the plants if they come into contact with the bulbs long enough, but nothing like an hid bulb will do..
that soil shoiuld be fine for now.. i llike to use those 20 ounce red party cups for the early vegetive growth.. just poke a few holes in the bottom for drainage, and your set..
i would also recomend that you go to the nearest bookstore and look for some books on growing mj.. a good one that has been around for years is jorge cervantes grow bible.. it has a ton of info that will point you in the right direction and will answer most of your newb questions..
anymore ?'s, feel free to ask m8..

 

[1quickhatch]

i agree with everyone else.. i would just start over from scratch honestly.. they are so tall and skimpy because like everyone else has said, they are searching for more light..
go get a few cfl's from anywhere.. you want the biggest actual watt bulbs that you can find.. you have to read the package carefully as they say something like 100 watt in big letters, but when you look a lil closer, it says 100 watt equivelent.. meaning that they put off the same amount of lumens as a 1oo watt incadescent bulb.. incadescent bulbs are the normal old skool type of bulb that you use to light up a dark room, and they are the worst option for growing mj with.. they use most of their energy making heat and not so much in the way of lumens.. and what lumens they do put off, are all in the wrong spectrum for what you need..
cfls come in different spectrums, which make them ideal for growing mj.. you will want the 6500 k( kelvin) ones for vegging, and the 2700k for flowering.. or you can mix and match them for a broader spectrum of light.. cfl's also don't put out much in the way of heat, which allows you to place them very close to your plants without burning them.. put them around two or so inches away from your plants.. you will need to move them alot as the plants grow as they will burn the plants if they come into contact with the bulbs long enough, but nothing like an hid bulb will do..
that soil shoiuld be fine for now.. i llike to use those 20 ounce red party cups for the early vegetive growth.. just poke a few holes in the bottom for drainage, and your set..
i would also recomend that you go to the nearest bookstore and look for some books on growing mj.. a good one that has been around for years is jorge cervantes grow bible.. it has a ton of info that will point you in the right direction and will answer most of your newb questions..
anymore ?'s, feel free to ask m8..

Awesome response, thanks a bunch for that..!! Yeah I've already learned more today than I have in the past 6 weeks haha, so hopefully next time around things work a little better in my favor... The main issue that sucks for me is that I live in an apartment so I can't build anything w/o it being noticed or questioned so I'm trying to do this in as stealth a mode possible... But I found my lights and fixtures so I'm good on that, now I'm reading about watering an pH levels and that stuff... Seems that once you get the initial pH levels down and can tell what it takes to be right, it's pretty easy after that... I see some of these people with these huge setups and automatic watering, damn that makes me jealous lol... Even people growing good amounts using the Aerogarden haha I saw that on TV 2 years ago and automatically thought WHOAAA CHECK THAT OUT and sure enough a few years later, our people are puttin it to good use lol... Thanks again for the info mate, appreciate it much..!!

 

[napa23]

Well I read on another grow forum, that if optimum soil is not available Scott's Premium will work fine that's why I chose that route, and also I've read that 200 oz of water every 2-3 days would be fine for my strain of herb since it wasn't top knotch stuff that's why I asked if it mattered the origin of the seed... Thank's for all your information though dude you're helpin me out a lot and savin me some serious time lol... So as of this far I've only spent about $10 and really only thing that I've wasted was time itself haha.. And since my livin situation restricts me from doing anything out of control perhaps I'll just grow one plant at a time... I went on Walmart's site and found some CFL's that were 6500K but they were only 20 watts, does that sound right..?? Also, should I put the seed right from germination into the 5 gallon pot or do as I did before and put it into the red plastic cup for a few weeks than transfer it..?? Thanks again for your assistance and no harm done by telling me the honest truth, I know I have tons to learn I just figured since I'm not going to be growing out of control everything in my situation would just be less than a normal grower would use, but I still have plenty of reading to do...

Racerboy had some good info. I also only grow one plant at a time. If you're going to buy seeds, which you don't have to, I would suggesst a feminized auto flower. They don't depend on a light schedule to flower and they stay shorter and bushier. That's what I have now since I am also a pretty new grower. I personally use peat pellets to germ in. I set my seed in a shot glass with water and put it over my cable box for heat. When the seed cracks and there is a tiny tap root starting to emerge, I put it into a moist peat pellet. Temperature is key for germination. You want it at around 80 or so for good root growth fast. After the seed pops up (mine took 2 days), I put it directly into my pot. I actually JUST did this. I got a 5 gallon smart pot. The peat pellet has a biodegradable mesh around it that holds the roots in place for a few days so as not to damage them while transplanting. I use this because transplanting can be very stressful to the plant. And they're dirt cheap, I got some pellets for 15 cents a piece at the local hardware store. You don't really want to have a set watering schedule, you want to water according to the plant's needs. They look the soil to get nearly dry before each watering so that they can get oxygen. The smart pot also helps with this as it is made of soft cloth. The roots grow into it, but not out of it. This allows them to not circle around the container and get root bound and at the same time get alot more oxygen. These pots produce stronger, healthier, bigger plants...although they are more expensive. I'm just giving you more options, you don't need this for your first grow yet. Get the basics down and then you can start to perfect your technique. Wow I just noticed how much I wrote, sorry bro haha.

Edit: Hell while I'm at it I'll tell you how to control height if you have restrictions. There are a few options.
1) LST= Low Stress Training. This is just tying down branches or even the main stem to fit your height restriction. You want to use something soft, i've seen people use pipe cleaners. You also want to make sure you don't uproot the plant or snap the branch.
2) Topping or Fimming. This is where you cut out the main stem at a node. You want to let the plant grow a bit first before you do this. When you do this, the plant will direct its energy into growing the side branches at the node where you cut the stem. This will result in 2 main cola's.

Look both of those techniques up if you have height restrictions. Ok..I'm done now

 

[racerboy71]

i've been growing for awhile now, and i still get all excited looking at some of the super grows that you see on here.. but don't worry about them m8.. i've seen some really really good grows done super cheaply.. you just need to get the basics down my friend.. once you get the basics down, you can always expand and grow bigger and better.. this is why i always recomend people to start out with a few dirt grows instead of hydro.. granted, i've seen plenty of peps jump right in with hydro, and do fine, but to me it just makes sense to start out as basic as you can get, and learn that as best as you can, and if and when you think that your ready, you can always move on to something bigger/ badder..
you honestly don't need all that much to grow, or that much room for one or two plants... im growing in a closet in my room which is about three feet by about two feet by around six feet tall, and i squezze in three plants under a 250 hps, and i get pretty good results imho..
i have even picked up a lil two bulb hood from petsmart that i use for my seedlings.. it was under $20 im sure, and it holds two cfl bulbs in it, and it works like a charm.. just do some research, and like i said before, if you have anymore ?'s, feel free to ask or you even send me a pm if you like..

 

[1quickhatch]

Racerboy had some good info. I also only grow one plant at a time. If you're going to buy seeds, which you don't have to, I would suggesst a feminized auto flower. They don't depend on a light schedule to flower and they stay shorter and bushier. That's what I have now since I am also a pretty new grower. I personally use peat pellets to germ in. I set my seed in a shot glass with water and put it over my cable box for heat. When the seed cracks and there is a tiny tap root starting to emerge, I put it into a moist peat pellet. Temperature is key for germination. You want it at around 80 or so for good root growth fast. After the seed pops up (mine took 2 days), I put it directly into my pot. I actually JUST did this. I got a 5 gallon smart pot. The peat pellet has a biodegradable mesh around it that holds the roots in place for a few days so as not to damage them while transplanting. I use this because transplanting can be very stressful to the plant. And they're dirt cheap, I got some pellets for 15 cents a piece at the local hardware store. You don't really want to have a set watering schedule, you want to water according to the plant's needs. They look the soil to get nearly dry before each watering so that they can get oxygen. The smart pot also helps with this as it is made of soft cloth. The roots grow into it, but not out of it. This allows them to not circle around the container and get root bound and at the same time get alot more oxygen. These pots produce stronger, healthier, bigger plants...although they are more expensive. I'm just giving you more options, you don't need this for your first grow yet. Get the basics down and then you can start to perfect your technique. Wow I just noticed how much I wrote, sorry bro haha.

Edit: Hell while I'm at it I'll tell you how to control height if you have restrictions. There are a few options.
1) LST= Low Stress Training. This is just tying down branches or even the main stem to fit your height restriction. You want to use something soft, i've seen people use pipe cleaners. You also want to make sure you don't uproot the plant or snap the branch.
2) Topping or Fimming. This is where you cut out the main stem at a node. You want to let the plant grow a bit first before you do this. When you do this, the plant will direct its energy into growing the side branches at the node where you cut the stem. This will result in 2 main cola's.

Look both of those techniques up if you have height restrictions. Ok..I'm done now

Haha by all means share with me as much as possible lol, there's no such thing as too much information =)

And it's odd that you mention those peat pellet things because I forgot the name of them and was wondering what they were called because I've been watching tons of YouTube videos on peoples indoor setups and I see them using those... And thanks for the info on watering, I wasn't so sure about timing but what you said makes plenty of sense I just wasn't sure... But yeah man anything that you think will be beneficial for me to know please share, I am reading a lot as well so hopefully I get this down to a science... I find great admiration in the people that just do this like it's second nature lol... Add some of this, put this there, do that, add a lil this, turn that on, turn that off, pour this in, etc etc hahaha...

i've been growing for awhile now, and i still get all excited looking at some of the super grows that you see on here.. but don't worry about them m8.. i've seen some really really good grows done super cheaply.. you just need to get the basics down my friend.. once you get the basics down, you can always expand and grow bigger and better.. this is why i always recomend people to start out with a few dirt grows instead of hydro.. granted, i've seen plenty of peps jump right in with hydro, and do fine, but to me it just makes sense to start out as basic as you can get, and learn that as best as you can, and if and when you think that your ready, you can always move on to something bigger/ badder..
you honestly don't need all that much to grow, or that much room for one or two plants... im growing in a closet in my room which is about three feet by about two feet by around six feet tall, and i squezze in three plants under a 250 hps, and i get pretty good results imho..
i have even picked up a lil two bulb hood from petsmart that i use for my seedlings.. it was under $20 im sure, and it holds two cfl bulbs in it, and it works like a charm.. just do some research, and like i said before, if you have anymore ?'s, feel free to ask or you even send me a pm if you like..

Thanks for that great info as well, and I did question a closet grow but I wasn't sure if there would be enough airflow going through the closet... I have the setup in my spare bedroom in the corner of the room on the floor, do you think elevation matters as well..?? Like should I put the plants on a stand or something of that nature or is in a box on the floor good enough..?? And I just got home from WalMart, picked up my CFL's and 2 hooded metal light fixtures but I will return them tomorrow and goto PetSmart because I think the one you described will work a lot better for me, since it will house the 2 light's under one metal hood...

Another thing that's raising suspicion for me is, pH levels of water added to my seedlings after germinating... Is it really that important to test the pH of tap water, and supply the correct pH + and pH -..?? Someone wrote in one of the threads that tap water generally works fine because it's filtered and all that, but you guy's are seemingly very knowledgeable and since you know what kinda seeds I'm working with here I'm just tryna get a better idea on what I might and might not need to do... And just like you said, I get excited sometimes as well when I see some peoples killerrrrrrr grows haha, like purple plants and 12" buds lol, it's like a dream almost..!! Maybe once I step my game up in growing I will produce something of that quality myself, but just as you said I'm only interested in learning the basics right now... I will continue to thank you guys as well, because I truly appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions, although they are probably repetitive of what others have asked as well, hence why I'm trying to read as much as possible =)

 

[napa23]

Some people have never checked the ph of their tap and they do just fine. However it might be worth it. Some strains are more sensitive than others. I read one guy's journal where his tap ph was above 8...no good. I'm using bottled water for my seedling right now, just to be sure. I got a brita filter though, so I'll use that as the plant requires more water. If you have to use the tap I think you should let it sit out over night so the chlorine gets out. or you can bubble it out, but i'm not really familiar with it, sorry. Actually I just thought of something. Dolomite lime is what I think a lot of people use to balance out Ph. They mix it in their soil.

 

[1quickhatch]

Yeah I read somewhere about the dolomite, but I also own a Brita inline water filter that connects to my faucet as well as a container that I can pour the water in to filter it through a Brita as well... Maybe if I did the 2 filters and let it sit out over night I'd be alright... Would it hurt to have a few gallons readily available at all times..?? Just fill a few gallons into a bucket and let it sit, or is water that's sat for a while no good..??

 

[napa23]

If you have a brita filter then it should be good to go I think. It filters out chlorine and other salts I believe.

 

[racerboy71]

i too try and let my water sit out for around 24 hours before using it in an open milk jug to allow the chlorine to evaporate..
i have to admit that i;m kinda lazy checking my ph.. my tapwater comes out at around 8.6 or so, which is crazy high, but once it sits for a day, it comes down to the sevens or so, and ive found that once i've mixed my fox farms nutes with my tapwater, it brings my ph down to just about 6.5 or so, which is perfecto..
my first two or three grows, i didn't even have a ph meter, and those plants strived honestly.. and now that i have a meter, i usually just cheeck the ph if im using something new.. like i just switched from fox farms nutes to advanced nutes, and i was checking the ph alot after tryin the different nutes..
i honestly don't think that ph is the most important factor in growing in soil, nothing like it is in hydro as the soil is a good buffer against high or low ph..
now for your last ?, i like to keep my plants up off the floor if at all possible.. for my second to last grow, i just bought a lil rack that i can raise or lower as the plants grow instead of having to raise or lower my lights, which can be a real pain in the a$$..

 

[1quickhatch]

If you have a brita filter then it should be good to go I think. It filters out chlorine and other salts I believe.

Yeah all my water is filtered through Brita, so sounds like I'll be good there, sweeeeet just one less thing I have to pay for (for now lol)... Thanks =)

i too try and let my water sit out for around 24 hours before using it in an open milk jug to allow the chlorine to evaporate..
i have to admit that i;m kinda lazy checking my ph.. my tapwater comes out at around 8.6 or so, which is crazy high, but once it sits for a day, it comes down to the sevens or so, and ive found that once i've mixed my fox farms nutes with my tapwater, it brings my ph down to just about 6.5 or so, which is perfecto..
my first two or three grows, i didn't even have a ph meter, and those plants strived honestly.. and now that i have a meter, i usually just cheeck the ph if im using something new.. like i just switched from fox farms nutes to advanced nutes, and i was checking the ph alot after tryin the different nutes..
i honestly don't think that ph is the most important factor in growing in soil, nothing like it is in hydro as the soil is a good buffer against high or low ph..
now for your last ?, i like to keep my plants up off the floor if at all possible.. for my second to last grow, i just bought a lil rack that i can raise or lower as the plants grow instead of having to raise or lower my lights, which can be a real pain in the a$$..

Yeah I had a feeling that the soil played a role in how the pH could be detrimental to growing... But mine are also on a little night stand but I wasn't sure if I should have them lower on the floor or up higher where they are, sounds like they are fine where they stand, sweet.. And you bring up something that I also wanted to ask, in tons of pictures I see people with that Tiger Bloom, Fox Farm, etc are all those necessary in a small indoor operation or is that only for big and outgoing grows..?? I'm sure if it was necessary, I could find links to purchase it floating around, i'd assume anyways...

And also, I did the same as you with my water, I filled a used milk carton and let it sit overnight and used it for the next few days... I hear rain water is also supposed to be pretty good, lol even heard urine was good too lol wtf..!?! I dunno how much of a straight face I could keep by knowing that I'm smoking my old piss haha, not to be nasty or nothing but I'm sure you all have heard of that before huh..?!?