Defoliation - removing fan leaves for higher yield

[509$Finest]

i have two that are about to flower and i think i will try this with one of them, i understand that a plant would need to store nuts. in case it gets rough at some point in the wild and needs to survive but u r indoors and ike he said u are treating the plants every need so i dont see the reason for it to store extra and use energy towards storing rather than flowering

 

[Brick Top]

i have two that are about to flower and i think i will try this with one of them, i understand that a plant would need to store nuts. in case it gets rough at some point in the wild and needs to survive but u r indoors and ike he said u are treating the plants every need so i dont see the reason for it to store extra and use energy towards storing rather than flowering

Leaves are not only storage facilities, they do not only store for hard times. They are solar collectors and they are factories where essential carbohydrates are produced and they are storage locations. Remove them and you remove the collection of energy, the creation of essential carbohydrates and storage locations of essential carbohydrates.

 

[Serapis]

I hear the solarists and the scalists..... and I believe the scale will win. No one is saying to cut off all the leaves, just the ones shading other leaves. If I cut one leaf up high and two below now get light, is that bad?

 

[freethoughexchange]

Dude it was a joke and a slam on LED.

My fault...U know smokers are slow sometimes!!!

 

[Serapis]

Yes it's called LED

You are a riot....

 

[Brick Top]

I hear the solarists and the scalists..... and I believe the scale will win. No one is saying to cut off all the leaves, just the ones shading other leaves. If I cut one leaf up high and two below now get light, is that bad?

Leaves appear more solid, as in light blocking, to the human eye than they actually are.

Fan leaves account for the greatest area for the reception of photons on a plant, thus they account for the majority of photosynthesis which occurs within a plant. Cells in the plant's leaves, called chloroplasts, contain a green pigment called chlorophyll which interacts with sunlight to split the water in the plant into its basic components. Leaves only absorb about 15% of the solar energy that hits them, the other 85% passes through-- but they reflect all the green light, which means it looks darker below the leaf to a human than it does to the plant because our eyes are most sensitive to the green spectrum.

 

[Serapis]

That makes an awful lot of sense BT. Thanks for the explanation. When I top, I do prune leaves about 2 weeks later to make sure that the two lower branches are getting enough light to grow up into colas. If i don't, I only get two colas because the leaves are blocking the other two potentials. I also once in awhile trim leaf tips if they block a young cola, but other than that, I'm mostly on board with the leave leaves alone group.

 

[Brick Top]

That makes an awful lot of sense BT. Thanks for the explanation. When I top, I do prune leaves about 2 weeks later to make sure that the two lower branches are getting enough light to grow up into colas. If i don't, I only get two colas because the leaves are blocking the other two potentials. I also once in awhile trim leaf tips if they block a young cola, but other than that, I'm mostly on board with the leave leaves alone group.

Light rays striking where a plant has been topped is not what causes more main leaders to grow to then become colas. The number of new main leaders is dictated by hormone release resulting from the topping, not the amount of light rays striking the area. When you top you may get two main leaders and you may get three main leaders and you may get four main leaders and hormone release will dictate which you end up with.

About the only time I will remove any healthy leaves is when I begin to flush. Fewer leaves filled with stored nutrients will speed up flushing. Fewer stored nutes to flush means faster and more thorough flushing. I will not strip the plants, but I will at times remove some of the larger healthy leaves.

 

[Brick Top]

I hear the solarists and the scalists..... and I believe the scale will win. No one is saying to cut off all the leaves, just the ones shading other leaves. If I cut one leaf up high and two below now get light, is that bad?

Since leaves only absorb about 15% of the solar energy that hits them and the other 85% passes through why would anyone believe they need to remove leaves to get more light to the lower portions of their plants? With that much light passing through leaves to then strike lower leaves if someone is not getting enough light to the lower leaves there is a problem and that problem is called inadequate lighting. The solution to inadequate lighting is not removing leaves that are essential. The answer is to improve their lighting and reflective capabilities.

 

[rastadred22]

That makes an awful lot of sense BT. Thanks for the explanation. When I top, I do prune leaves about 2 weeks later to make sure that the two lower branches are getting enough light to grow up into colas. If i don't, I only get two colas because the leaves are blocking the other two potentials. I also once in awhile trim leaf tips if they block a young cola, but other than that, I'm mostly on board with the leave leaves alone group.

this is not true...a plant will do what ever it takes to grow..wherever a leaf is not getting light it will do what it needs to get that light i.e bending up outward upside down what ever...also when u top to get 4colas it has nothing to do with light all to do with the hormones that get released like bt says...i have topped and i never changed anything and left the plant alone and all 4colas are hugh in size and are almost the same height! next time u top dont prune anything and i garentee...garentee u will be proved wrong...once again u cannot say something works better than something else if u havent done experiments and found out for urself

 

[Dwezelitsame]

when you get fifty fifty disagreement on something that means half dont know what they are talking about

i have tried it in a side by side came out close to same leaning towards the striped plant

but at RIU 3 say its white 3 say its black then 3 say its gray but what kills me is there is alwys the one that swears by what he is saying "its orange but im blind from birth but you can take my word on it" and starts trashing --this is exagerated but i have seen some almost trashing results from a back and forth debate on plucking fans and not plucking fans saying stuff like "you should never" they prolly going by something they heard or read and need to do a side by side

thats all i got to say about that
1 Luv

 

[DudeLebbowski]

when you get fifty fifty disagreement on something that means half dont know what they are talking about

i have tried it in a side by side came out close to same leaning towards the striped plant

but at RIU 3 say its white 3 say its black then 3 say its gray but what kills me is there is alwys the one that swears by what he is saying "its orange but im blind from birth but you can take my word on it" and starts trashing --this is exagerated but i have seen some almost trashing results from a back and forth debate on plucking fans and not plucking fans saying stuff like "you should never" they prolly going by something they heard or read and need to do a side by side

thats all i got to say about that
1 Luv

I think it's a good thing man. You can obviously tell which people are trustworthy by their website rep. grammar and vocabulary.
You get different perspectives, which I think is the best thing about the internet in general. You only pick out the information YOU think is correct. After all, there are +- 300 factors that influence growth, and they are chained to each other. It is quite difficult.

I think in order to fully utilize this pruning strategy it would be to put cfl's right close to them lower branches, instead of just the above canopy lights. Otherwise you may not even notice anything haha

-May you be blessed with good, long highs

 

[rastadred22]

alot of people who use hids also throw in cfls for the under and side lighting instead of hacking away leaves

 

[darkdestruction420]

Leaves appear more solid, as in light blocking, to the human eye than they actually are.

Fan leaves account for the greatest area for the reception of photons on a plant, thus they account for the majority of photosynthesis which occurs within a plant. Cells in the plant's leaves, called chloroplasts, contain a green pigment called chlorophyll which interacts with sunlight to split the water in the plant into its basic components. Leaves only absorb about 15% of the solar energy that hits them, the other 85% passes through-- but they reflect all the green light, which means it looks darker below the leaf to a human than it does to the plant because our eyes are most sensitive to the green spectrum.

thank you brick top, i knew you were the one who told me about this a long time ago. I could never re-find the thread to prove to people that you and uncle ben really did say this and that im not making stuff up. Now I shouldnt have that problem. +rep

 

[jawbrodt]

^Hell yeah, that bit of info was worth a + rep. I learned something new today, sweet!

 

[findme]

Im thinking about cutting off my cola's to promote bigger popcorn

and on that note... and this note:

Leaves appear more solid, as in light blocking, to the human eye than they actually are.

Fan leaves account for the greatest area for the reception of photons on a plant, thus they account for the majority of photosynthesis which occurs within a plant. Cells in the plant's leaves, called chloroplasts, contain a green pigment called chlorophyll which interacts with sunlight to split the water in the plant into its basic components. Leaves only absorb about 15% of the solar energy that hits them, the other 85% passes through-- but they reflect all the green light, which means it looks darker below the leaf to a human than it does to the plant because our eyes are most sensitive to the green spectrum.

/thread

 

[Horseneck]

I've read this whole thread....ugh.

What it comes down to, in my opinion, is your grow room, strain, and personal preference. We all have our own "tricks" and "secret methods" for producing an optimal crop.

I, for instance, have recently tried the defoliate approach, Just because I've lurked so many forums arguing whether or not to do it. I can say that with my Northern Lights #5 it has seemed to improve growth in veg and in flower. I grow in a DWC system with GH 3 part nutes. I can honestly say that as of today, which is day 31 of flower, the plants that I defoliated are much more vigorous. Many more bud sites, and big white pistils reaching for my 600w HPS. The un-trimmed plants are good as well, but seem to be stretching and forming flowers a little slower. I'll try and get some pics up soon, and continue to report the grow.

 

[Beefbisquit]

Human eye sensitivity peaks at around 555nm, which is green.

Visible Spectrum
Luminosity Function

 

[johnsmithinmi]

Wow!! roll it up?? This should be called Put um up.. This started with someone sharing there grow and lots of guys bashed him and called him stupid and said he had no common sense.. Then alot of people keep talking about mother nature and out doors.. This method was done indoors and and there is nothing natural about that.. Not the light not the nutrients hell prob not even the water.. Some things work for some people and some things don't.. I bet the first person who wanted to try to grow indoors was called stupid.. And the first person to try to keep the males away from the females was called stupid.. I mean with common sense wouldn't it tell you plants cant grow without the sun and how can you continue to grow with out seeds..Plants in nature would all die off if never pollinated and what about the first time someone talked about cloning a plant I bet they called him stupid.. I'm not saying it works or it don't I'm just saying if people only stuck to what is known at that point in time then we would all still be in the stone age. Open your mind and maybe you might learn something new or maybe not .. Like maybe the guys who swear the leaves are workers and cutting them of is like firing workers.. I have seen the pics in veg in a week after defo. The plants have twice as many wouldn't that help you?? The only thing I know is that calling people names and putting people down is not helping anyone and some times the people we think are the most stupid might just be ahead of the curve.. So with that said role one up and relax its not your trees hes messing up or making better its his.. Maybe just let him know were you stand with out all the trash talk.. Thanks and cant wait to hear what you have to say about me..

 

[plaguedog]

• "WHY IT WORKS
  
  We don't really know. A lot of people claim that the leaves are "solar panels" which create energy the plant needs for bud, but the truth is that this is just a guess and in experiments (over at icmag), removing fan leaves did not slow down growth, nor did it reduce yield (it increased it in almost all cases.)
  
  It might be that removing a big fan leaf lets light go down to a lot of other smaller leaves, thereby increasing the light the plant is getting because smaller leaves have a higher surface area than bigger fan leaves.
  
  The leaves store nutrients, but indoors, we provide the plant with ample nutrients and so storage is not required as it would be in nature.
  
  The plant may focus on bud production in flower, rather than focusing energy on making more fan leaves (which doesn't make sense if the plant feels it's about to die.)"
  
  No it's actually been proven by botanist's for years EXACTLY what the leaves on plants are for. There is no guess work here, the only guess work is by people that have zero clue what they are talking about.
  
  
  ​