Reasons to Vote yes on Prop 19

[mr2shim]

Again, you absolutely missed the point.

Read the California Constitution.

Until you do, you are woefully uninformed.

During the last week, I assumed that the players in these discussions had done some research.

Now you've proven you're here strictly for entertainment.

I'm now blocking you, and won't respond to your drivil, any more.

Where in the constitution does it say that? I linked it for you in the thread I started. Just point it out I'll gladly read it.

It must say something along the lines "all previous propositions are completely invalid upon voting in another"

That's the only way anything you are saying would make sense and even be factual. Why do you continue with the propaganda and lies?

 

[The Ruiner]

Again, you are making jumps of logic, huge ones. And I could care less where i live. Last time I checked, California is one of the US states and marijuana laws have been i the news about as much as gay marriage. I have just as much right to spread facts as you do dis-information about 19.

How can something that isnt a law be a fact? How can you guys keep saying "facts" when referring to 19? THERE ARE NO FUCKING FACTS!!! It hasnt even passed...the facts are 215 and the constitution. Those are the facts, and veggie connected those dots really freaking cleary in post#201

 

[veggiegardener]

I'm not going to result to tossing insults around like you have, but for your info, I'm pursuing a masters degree and am sure that my education far outperforms yours. Let me explain something to you regarding law.... have you heard of the term precedent? I suggest you look it up and apply it to 215 and then take a look at prop 19. Those of you that are making the stretch that 19 supersedes 215 are the ones that have no informed opinion.

So if you want to start tossing around insults, go visit a school yard and feel free to do so with your peers. If you want to have a debate on actual issues like an adult, bring your facts.....

Nope, don't have a college degree. Just two years before I went to work.

I got to send my daughter to a major university, though. She's finishing her MBA in December at the same university. Her BS is in Mechanical Engineering.

Yes, I understand precedent.

Another thing that will have to be hashed out in court.

Prop 19 is just an accident waiting to happen.

You obviously aren't old enough to know what being a pot head was like before 215.

 

[TokinPodPilot]

Let's see where it says that. I have a hard time believing anything you say. But wait, if California's constitution has the power to override laws in propositions, what's stopping them from overriding prop 215?

Because only another voter initiative, like Prop. 19, can amend voter initiative legislation, Prop. 215. That was the whole point of the Kelly decision. Limits can be expanded in line with the intent of the law, but not reduced.

Prop. 19 also specifies under which sections of the Health and Safety Code medical cannabis is permitted. The sections of code include the SB 420 limits that we had to work 7 years to get ruled unconstitutional.

 

[mr2shim]

Nope, don't have a college degree. Just two years before I went to work.

I got to send my daughter to a major university, though. She's finishing her MBA in December at the same university. Her BS is in Mechanical Engineering.

Yes, I understand precedent.

Another thing that will have to be hashed out in court.

Prop 19 is just an accident waiting to happen.

You obviously aren't old enough to know what being a pot head was like before 215.

err, move out of California? lol. It's that easy to know what being a pot head is like before 215 in states where it's completely illegal.. It's time to pull that head out of your ass.

 

[Serapis]

Thats what 19 is doing!!!! FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!!!!

Please quote where in 19 it states it supersedes 215? It doesn't. But in three subsections, it exclusively exempts 215 from any possible ambiguities. As I stated, I'll put my belief in Ed Rosenthal and NORML and their lawyers before I put any faith in anything you have to say. In all of your anti 19 posts, you never cite a fact. You make leaps of logic, if that is the best way to describe it.

Many having issue with 19 are the ones that sell pounds every month to their coop or dispensary or to their patients. They also cite fears that their medical gardens will be restricted to non-medical garden sizes of 5x5. Relax, your 99 plant grows are safe under 19, at least until California begins to look into abuses and prosecuting the abusers. If that happens all bets are off the table.

If 19 fails, I hope that everyone selling pot to dispensaries and coops start getting 1099's each transaction, along with having your Cali license scanned and filed. If 19 fails, I hope all medical growers that sell are visited once a month and inspected for health, pest, plant count and other state law violations. If 19 fails, I hope that ALL issued cards are looked into and the medical condition verified as terminal or serious illnesses.

Go ahead and vote no....

 

[budling357]

DUDE!

You need to read more than what the authors wish to spoon feed you.

The fact is, the STATE CONSTITUTION includes the language empowering referendums(propositions) to override all other laws.

THINK!

Even if this was true, your decision to vote no is still based on personal gain. Lets say 19 limits you to 25square for the time being, so the fuck what, it opens the door for the rest of the country and eventually the taboo behind marijuana will wear off. Adjusting the laws as citizens see fit.

 

[veggiegardener]

as far as as being in California, you can see from my location, i'm in NY
i do not pretend to be in California, but i do see that Prop 19 is the greatest move forward in MJ law since prop 215
that you have written many posts on 19, i will give you the benefit of the doubt, but are they good and insightful posts?
Prop 19 is muddy if you want to see it that way, but what uber MJ law do you think is going to come next?
Prop 19 is it for quite some time
if you want to keep the status quo with 215, you likely have your reasons
i don't know those reasons, because i don't know you
but it does seem to be growers that have the problem with 19
in particular, the fear of MJ prices dropping
i'd like to see MJ laws progress across the county, and 19 is the best chance we have
there is nothing in Prop 19 that endangers Prop 215 growers, not realistically
nearly any law can be interpreted in slanted ways to prove nearly any point

Since you aren't living here, you must be unaware that other, better written propositions are working their way through the system.

You aren't likely to be harassed by local LEOs who don't understand 19 any better than you do.

In your shoes, I'd be inclined to do some more digging before claiming that 19 is good for California.

I've laid my entire situation out, only to be denigrated for wanting to maintain MY completely legal, non profit situation. My extra is given to other patients. (Remember, these are SICK people.)

If I lose my ability to grow at my current levels, I don't have the finances to buy the shortage.

Maybe you could send me $40,000 each year?

I'll change my mind if I receive the first check before I get my absentee ballot.

 

[budling357]

Nope, don't have a college degree. Just two years before I went to work.

I got to send my daughter to a major university, though. She's finishing her MBA in December at the same university. Her BS is in Mechanical Engineering.

Yes, I understand precedent.

Another thing that will have to be hashed out in court.

Prop 19 is just an accident waiting to happen.

You obviously aren't old enough to know what being a pot head was like before 215.

You must also forget that 215 opened the door for the rest of the country!

 

[mr2shim]

removed

Wow you sure as hell don't act like you're an adult. So sad this is what has become of your posts. I mean they've always been a bit nonfactual and negative but really?

 

[growone]

Since you aren't living here, you must be unaware that other, better written propositions are working their way through the system.

You aren't likely to be harassed by local LEOs who don't understand 19 any better than you do.

In your shoes, I'd be inclined to do some more digging before claiming that 19 is good for California.

I've laid my entire situation out, only to be denigrated for wanting to maintain MY completely legal, non profit situation. My extra is given to other patients. (Remember, these are SICK people.)

If I lose my ability to grow at my current levels, I don't have the finances to buy the shortage.

Maybe you could send me $40,000 each year?

I'll change my mind if I receive the first check before I get my absentee ballot.

i don't fault you a bit for having plenty of caution in dealing with this proposition
it's a big change, i do realize that
but as for other propositions, such as Jack Herrer's prop?
then why aren't they are on the ballot this year? or in previous years?
because it's damn tough to get a proposition on the ballot, R. Lee put up the money, no one else did
i don't doubt there are better propositions from growers points of view
but these discussions are small change, growers aren't going to decide this election
and those other props(ones i've seen anyways) wouldn't have a chance, they might get a grower majority, but not much else

 

[The Ruiner]

Please quote where in 19 it states it supersedes 215? It doesn't. But in three subsections, it exclusively exempts 215 from any possible ambiguities. As I stated, I'll put my belief in Ed Rosenthal and NORML and their lawyers before I put any faith in anything you have to say. In all of your anti 19 posts, you never cite a fact. You make leaps of logic, if that is the best way to describe it.

Many having issue with 19 are the ones that sell pounds every month to their coop or dispensary or to their patients. They also cite fears that their medical gardens will be restricted to non-medical garden sizes of 5x5. Relax, your 99 plant grows are safe under 19, at least until California begins to look into abuses and prosecuting the abusers. If that happens all bets are off the table.

If 19 fails, I hope that everyone selling pot to dispensaries and coops start getting 1099's each transaction, along with having your Cali license scanned and filed. If 19 fails, I hope all medical growers that sell are visited once a month and inspected for health, pest, plant count and other state law violations. If 19 fails, I hope that ALL issued cards are looked into and the medical condition verified as terminal or serious illnesses.

Go ahead and vote no....

You are putting your faith in the people that stand to make millions if 19 passes? That's really smart, good work on that masters. And if CA does look into "abusers" of the system do you know what they will find? A consitutionally upheld defense...try beating that. As far as 1099's go, technically all the transactions are untaxable DONATIONS, and growers are entitled to reasonable compensation for their services.

 

[budling357]

Im confident that my decision to vote yes is a contribution to the solution, not the problem. And as the saying goes, if your not part of the solution, you are the problem!

Do you feel the same about your decision? Do you think you will still feel that way when prohibition ends?

If so, I hope your wrong.

 

[mr2shim]

You are putting your faith in the people that stand to make millions if 19 passes? That's really smart, good work on that masters. And if CA does look into "abusers" of the system do you know what they will find? A consitutionally upheld defense...try beating that. As far as 1099's go, technically all the transactions are untaxable DONATIONS, and growers are entitled to reasonable compensation for their services.

Do you eat fast food? Do you shop at Walmart? Do you drive a car? Do you have electricity? Do you live in a house? Are you using a computer?

Stop acting like you care so much about the little people getting squashed when just about everything you do supports big business.

 

[420God]

You are putting your faith in the people that stand to make millions if 19 passes? That's really smart, good work on that masters. And if CA does look into "abusers" of the system do you know what they will find? A consitutionally upheld defense...try beating that. As far as 1099's go, technically all the transactions are untaxable DONATIONS, and growers are entitled to reasonable compensation for their services.

Pretty sure I asked this before but why don't you invest? Sounds like a lot of these companies will be public. They are not the only ones that can make money from this.

 

[TokinPodPilot]

Pretty sure I asked this before but why don't you invest? Sounds like a lot of these companies will be public. They are not the only ones that can make money from this.

You proponents are absolutely obsessed with money. Personally, I find profiting at the expense of fellow smokers going to jail to be very poor form.

 

[420God]

You proponents are absolutely obsessed with money. Personally, I find profiting at the expense of fellow smokers going to jail to be very poor form.

How is it profiting from other smokers being locked up? Passing 19 makes it so people won't get locked up.

 

[Dan Kone]

You proponents are absolutely obsessed with money. Personally, I find profiting at the expense of fellow smokers going to jail to be very poor form.

Says the guy supporting prohibition and all the mendo millionaires. You act like prop 19 is what is bringing profits into cannabis. But people have been getting rich off it for 40 years. The idea that supporting prohibition is supporting freedom is laughable.

 

[mr2shim]

How is it profiting from other smokers being locked up? Passing 19 makes it so people won't get locked up.

I'm still a bit confused on how people say if prop 19 passes the war on drugs will continue and get worse. Very confusing...

 

[420God]

I'm still a bit confused on how people say if prop 19 passes the war on drugs will continue and get worse. Very confusing...

They almost make it sound like it will get worse if it passes, like all out madness or something.