SB 1449... and why it sucks

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
This misleading article suggests that CA ganja fans are better off with 1449. But we just lost our right to jury trial and court appointed attorneys. Now we only retain right to trial in front of a judge, BUT NO JURY OF PEERS OR PUBLIC DEFENDERS, and you know that judge isn't a grower. Prop 19 would have made SB1449 irrelevant.

California pot smokers can breathe a little easier next year. Under a state law that takes effect Jan. 1, possession of less than an ounce of marijuana will be an infraction punishable by a $100 fine. Today it is a misdemeanor punishable by a $100 fine.

The new law does not go as far as Proposition 19, which voters rejected Tuesday. That would have legalized possession of less than 1 ounce of marijuana for personal use by anyone 21 or older in California.

Under the law passed by the Legislature and signed by the governor, SB1449, possession of less than an ounce will no longer be a misdemeanor or go on a person's criminal record. Instead, it will be an infraction, similar to a speeding ticket. That has some people wondering whether the infraction will go on a person's driving record and affect insurance rates.

Here are answers to these and other questions about how the new law will affect employment applications and federal student financial aid. These questions assume the person does not have a legitimate medical marijuana card.

Q: If I get caught with less than an ounce, what's the worst that will happen?

A: Assuming you are not driving under the influence or on school property, you could be convicted of an infraction and subject to a $100 fine. If you don't want to contest it, you will sign the citation and send in the money. (Possession of less than an ounce on the grounds of a K-12 school during school hours is still a misdemeanor and subject to stiffer penalties.)

Q: Can I fight it?

A: Yes, you can ask for a trial before a judge, but you cannot ask for a jury trial or a court-appointed attorney, like you can today.


"Defendants in misdemeanor cases are entitled to jury trials," which can cost the public $1,000, says the bill's sponsor, Sen. Mark Leno, D-San Francisco. "We were spending tens of millions of dollars each year on jury trials, clogging courts for simple possession cases."

The new law could make it harder to get charges dismissed.

"The way it was before, in most counties, if you insisted on a jury trial they would likely dismiss the case rather than tie up the courtroom for something where you would get a $100 fine. In that sense, you won't have that option any more," says William Panzer, an Oakland attorney who is on the board of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws.

Q: I've heard the new law will make possession of less than an ounce like a traffic ticket. Does that mean it will go on my driving record? Will it affect my insurance rates?

A: Assuming you are not driving while stoned, the answer to both questions is no.

Possession alone is not a motor vehicle offense and will not go on your driving record today or when the new law takes effect. It is not one of the factors insurance companies in California can use to set rates.

"By itself, a pot-related citation that does not go on DMV records cannot be used to determine your rates," says Molly DeFrank of the state insurance department.

However, driving under the influence of marijuana is a serious offense. If convicted, it will go on your DMV and criminal record and increase your insurance rates. The new law will not change this.

Q: Will a pot infraction go on my criminal record?

A: Today, if you are convicted of possessing less than an ounce of marijuana in California, it will go on your criminal record and drop off after two years. A pot infraction will not go on your criminal record, although it will be in court records if someone wanted to dig it up.

Q: Will I have to disclose a pot infraction on employment applications?

A: Probably not. Today, many employers ask if job applicants have been convicted of a felony or misdemeanor. California Labor Code Section 432.8 prohibits them from asking applicants to disclose "any convictions for certain marijuana-related misdemeanors that are more than two years old. One of them is possession of less than 28.5 grams" or roughly 1 ounce, says Felicia Reid, a partner with employment-law firm Curiale Hirschfeld Kraemer.

Most employers in California deal with this by adding a phrase such as "you need not disclose marijuana-related misdemeanors more than two years old."

If employers don't change their forms, applicants will not have to disclose marijuana infractions. Employers could ask if applicants have been convicted of marijuana infractions, but are not likely to.

"Unless it's a very unusual kind of employment, 99 percent of employers are not going to inquire about civil infractions," says Garry Mathiason, a senior partner with employment law firm Littler Mendelson.

Q: Can I lose college financial aid if I'm convicted of a marijuana infraction?

A: If you are convicted of a marijuana misdemeanor you can lose federal student aid. If you are convicted of an infraction, it's not clear.

A federal law states that "a student who is convicted of any offense under any federal or state law involving the possession or sale of a controlled substance" while receiving federal student aid will no longer be eligible for federal aid for a certain period of time. This period can be shortened if the student goes through drug rehab. Student aid includes all federal loans and grants.

However, a U.S. Department of Education regulation states that "a conviction means only a conviction that is on a student's record." It does not define record.

If you are convicted of a marijuana infraction, it's still a conviction and that could potentially jeopardize your student aid. But if it's not on your criminal record, it's not clear whether it would have to be reported on the federal student aid application.

Jane Glickman, a spokeswoman for the education department, says, "We will review the changes in the California law to see how it affects the federal provision."

Students who need help with this question can call (800) 433-3243, although it may be a while before they get a definitive answer.

Net Worth runs Tuesdays, Thursdays and Sundays. E-mail Kathleen Pender at kpender@sfchronicle.com.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/11/06/BU9Q1G7NSI.DTL
 
californians made their bed, now they get to sleep in it.

i just saw some dude elated because eights were only $55 in so cal.

i could get some good dank for that in AZ, where it is still a felony to possess any amount whatsoever.

you are FUCKED, cali.

just let us here in the PNW know if you want a reasonable price on top shelf shit. we will hook it up.
 
This misleading article suggests that CA ganja fans are better off with 1449. But we just lost our right to jury trial and court appointed attorneys. Now we only retain right to trial in front of a judge, BUT NO JURY OF PEERS OR PUBLIC DEFENDERS, and you know that judge isn't a grower. Prop 19 would have made SB1449 irrelevant.

I think S.B. 1449 is great, who wants to go to court for a ounce or less of weed?

In the past if you got stopped for smoking, you would get a misdemeanor and would be required to go to court. The ticket was $100 and extra penalties around $400. Then you would need to go to Drug Education and pay for it. Then you have a drug misdemeanor on you record.

That's what happens when you get busted for pot prior to S.B. 1449.

Now, if you are stupid enough to get a ticket, it will be $100 and you can mail it in, it's over.

If you are selling, or growing illegally you can get a jury trial, pretty sure :bigjoint:
 
I think S.B. 1449 is great, who wants to go to court for a ounce or less of weed?

In the past if you got stopped for smoking, you would get a misdemeanor and would be required to go to court. The ticket was $100 and extra penalties around $400. Then you would need to go to Drug Education and pay for it. Then you have a drug misdemeanor on you record.

That's what happens when you get busted for pot prior to S.B. 1449.

Now, if you are stupid enough to get a ticket, it will be $100 and you can mail it in, it's over.

If you are selling, or growing illegally you can get a jury trial, pretty sure :bigjoint:

Seriously, pay your $100 and be done with it. Why would you waste your time and money to get a $100 fine dropped when it doesn't even go on your record?
 
That's the point, it's just an infraction, like a parking ticket.
that's the problem. we've gotten so used to paying the government for what is rightfully ours, it's become second nature. the slightest easing of their onerous regulations has us practically dancing in the streets. "oh gee, it's only a parking ticket". what kind of crap is that? didn't anyone notice the coincidental timing of this bit of regulation? it was a perfect set-up, a little easing of the prohibition to convince just a few more folks that legalization was just an unnecessary formality. what sheep we have become. what mindless, selfish little sheep.
 
that's the problem. we've gotten so used to paying the government for what is rightfully ours, it's become second nature. the slightest easing of their onerous regulations has us practically dancing in the streets. "oh gee, it's only a parking ticket". what kind of crap is that? didn't anyone notice the coincidental timing of this bit of regulation? it was a perfect set-up, a little easing of the prohibition to convince just a few more folks that legalization was just an unnecessary formality. what sheep we have become. what mindless, selfish little sheep.

Agreed. Why pay a ticket that you do not deserve? SB1449 helps the gov't far more than Cannabis users. I would rather have the right to a trial by my peers (odds are one is a grower or affiliated to a grower). When did we start giving up our rights to not have to deal with the system?
 
Agreed. Why pay a ticket that you do not deserve? SB1449 helps the gov't far more than Cannabis users. I would rather have the right to a trial by my peers (odds are one is a grower or affiliated to a grower). When did we start giving up our rights to not have to deal with the system?

In case you didn't know more than 60,000 people were arrested for misdemeanor pot possession last year , yes they were taken to jail and booked and had to go to court, just to pay their $100 plus penalties. Then they had to go to Drug Education or go to jail.

"Misdemeanors and the Law
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Under the California Penal Code misdemeanors are crimes that are considered less serious than felonies but can bring jail time of up to one year and fines totaling $2000. [/FONT] In California criminal offenses are classified as infractions, misdemeanors, or felonies.


  • Infractions such as traffic violations are punishable by a fine and no jail time.
  • Misdemeanors are, by definition, crimes that carry a less severe punishment than a felony.
  • Felonies are serious offenses that generally carry a jail sentence of one year or more."
This is what S.B. 1449 did for the poor fucks who got smoking pot.

Infractions such as traffic violations are punishable by a fine and no jail time.
 
In case you didn't know more than 60,000 people were arrested for misdemeanor pot possession last year , yes they were taken to jail and booked and had to go to court, just to pay their $100 plus penalties. Then they had to go to Drug Education or go to jail.

Now you know that statement is a whooping assumption and not true. Did you forget that the many of these cases were simply dropped due to lack of evidence and not being worth a trial?

I'm not arguing that an infraction is worse than a misdemeanor. But in reality, a $100 misdemeanor that was contestable has been replaced with a $100 infraction that is essentially not contestable.

We essentially lost out ability to contest possession crimes, the most common of Cannabis crimes. Yes it saves the state a ton of money, and makes life easier for those busted. BUT our legal rights have been depleted, and that is not what I stand for.
 
Now you know that statement is a whooping assumption and not true. Did you forget that the many of these cases were simply dropped due to lack of evidence and not being worth a trial?

NO CASES are dismissed Until you see the Judge with an Attorney, so it already cost you $hundreds.

Yes you GET Arrested

After January 1, 2011, you won't get arrested and taken to jail.




I'm not arguing that an infraction is worse than a misdemeanor. But in reality, a $100 misdemeanor that was contestable has been replaced with a $100 infraction that is essentially not contestable.

We essentially lost out ability to contest possession crimes, the most common of Cannabis crimes. Yes it saves the state a ton of money, and makes life easier for those busted. BUT our legal rights have been depleted, and that is not what I stand for.

I get from your logic, that you would rather go to jail, even if it is just for a few hours. So you can have a criminal records.

Infractions DO NOT go on your record. Misdemeanors stay with you, until the are expunged by a judge.

Ask any kid who got busted and went to the Drug Education, how hard it was to get a job with a drug conviction on his/her record. This is the issue.
 
I get from your logic, that you would rather go to jail, even if it is just for a few hours. So you can have a criminal records.

Infractions DO NOT go on your record. Misdemeanors stay with you, until the are expunged by a judge.

Ask any kid who got busted and went to the Drug Education, how hard it was to get a job with a drug conviction on his/her record. This is the issue.

But your missing the BIGGEST part. You do not consent to a search, then you get arrested, you go to jail for a couple hours, you get a PUBLIC DEFENDER and everything is erased. No fine, no infraction, yes a court date or two and some money to the public defender, but no crime!
 
But your missing the BIGGEST part. You do not consent to a search, then you get arrested, you go to jail for a couple hours, you get a PUBLIC DEFENDER and everything is erased. No fine, no infraction, yes a court date or two and some money to the public defender, but no crime!

That only happens if you submit to court ordered drug education, which includes pee tests.

But regardless it's a mute point. It is now the law, Possession of Marijuana under 28.5 grams is an infraction.

No arrest, no jail, no record, no public defender.
 
That only happens if you submit to court ordered drug education, which includes pee tests.

But regardless it's a mute point. It is now the law, Possession of Marijuana under 28.5 grams is an infraction.

No arrest, no jail, no record, no public defender.

I've gotten through with none of that drug education or piss test. No record, no piss test, no crime, yes I used a public defender. Yes I was 'arrested', no jail, and went to court, and my public defender got me off in like five minutes (after hours of waiting for my turn). All you have to do it get your 215 rec (anyone can do that for the same price as the fine), then your case is dropped, doesn't matter when you get the rec, as long as it is valid when you go to court. AND YOU STILL HAVE YOUR REC FOR THE YEAR!
 
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