Get it right this time....If you get it wrong you'll get it right next time

[michmed]

I'm ready to move on up (to the eastside ;0)

I've learned a lot in a year and am ready to go from my 10'x12' space with two lights to a huge space 1200 sf+ that I almost jumped when I saw it(though the ceilings are a bit lower than "ideal")

I'll finally be able to move to a more/less perpetual harvest and intend roughly 20-30 plants in veg (counting moms) and about 40 plants in bloom. In two different nute/bloom cycles using two resevoirs. I'll be using Ebb & Gro as I know and have learned to like it.

A third resevoir would cover the mothers and veg stage plants. Could the mothers do "OK" with the lower nute levels for the new veg plants?

I'd like to use 1000W vented lights. Closed room with light vents pulling from outdoors and exhausting outdoors after running through the hoods.

I think my ideal would be one light covering a 5'x5' canopy with about 4 plants per light. I'd like to lay out 10 of those lights but am worried about the amount of heat they will generate (even with ducting/venting).

Thus my first big question -
How much cooling (in BTUs) might I need for 10 lights, assuming I'm pushing as much air through the lights (inline fans) as possible?

I'll also have at least 2 lights in the veg room.

Oh and I guess one more Q to start
Any suggestions for wall materials?

 

[michmed]

bump to beg for some help

 

[NoGutsGrower]

besides my tent I have a/c going through my 6 lights. My buddy has 5 1000 watt lights and is running 2 400 cfm fans on them! carbon filter fan all the lights and about 3 or 4 feet of ducting between each then another 400 cfm fan blowing it up and out of the roof. The only ac he uses it the central air to keep the house cool. his intake air is never over 75 (what he keeps his house at) and his grow room never gets over 85! we both just put panda plastic up over the normal walls. I don't do much hydro so try posting that part in the hydro section! I only keep a mother in hydro and feed her full strength.

 

[subcool fan]

you should start by adding another 1k in your current room. that will add another 2 or 3 pounds each harvest. with that info... does the number of lights ur wanting in ur new setup change?

your mom will survive just fine at 600 ppms. but she will not do as good. from the sounds of it.... ull need at least two maybe even three moms per strain if ur wanting to do that big of a perpetual.

i would use 600s instead of 1k watters and just use more of them. u can use four of them where u would use three 1000s and get the same lumens with less heat. put up to 6 or them in line on the same 6" duct in plain tubes. i guess u could use more in the same line if ur gonna buy 8". but u have to think about the heat coming off the first lamps and what the temp of the air will be when it hits ur last one. the less in line.... the less heat overall u have to cool in the room.

ur a/c needs to be spread out. i would put a 10-12k btu every 400 sq ft. so i could crank it down for night runs and the ending days in darkness.

lots of peeps are moving to the lowes house wrap. its cheap and readily available. it has a lot of crevices in it though that trap light. light that would normally be reflected back. use that or order some cheap "6mil" panda film from ebay. 10 x 10 x 100 for 72 bucks shipped. i personally like the panda.

ur looking at 8 or 12 grand cash to do this right.

 

[subcool fan]

The only ac he uses it the central air to keep the house cool. his intake air is never over 75 (what he keeps his house at) and his grow room never gets over 85!

id have a stroke if my girls were in 85 degree heat. cool=more tric production=more hash and happier caretakers.

 

[NoGutsGrower]

id have a stroke if my girls were in 85 degree heat. cool=more tric production=more hash and happier caretakers.

stroke for 85???? you must have medical problems already! what kind of temps do you think plants are seeing outside? today it is supposed to be 94 and was 99 yesterday! not to mention all the growers in texas and such that have great crops with temps over 110 for long periods of time! give the plants enough air flow and 85 is great!

 

[subcool fan]

i normally wouldnt make a reply when it gets this far off topic... which is my fault, but bad advice is bad advice.

cannabis does most of its work when its nearing the end of its cycle. they way it knows to do this is by temperature. sure it starts budding to 12/12 light, but it gets tricked into producing more trichs when the temp is down. it puts out more trichs to catch the pollen from the male because it knows winter is about to be here, and it knows its about to die...not able to produce any offspring. bud gets harvested from august to oct. think about why that is and ull see that the 85-110 degree temps this guys is talkin about totally irrelevant. he talks about temps outdoors and yet we are still in 18 hours days outside. what does that have to do with budding a plant?

pot does best in 76-78 degree rooms. if ur using good amounts co2 u might need to bump that up to 80 or 81. but thats it. im not trying to say it wont grow in 85 degree temps.... my moms sit in the 80's. but it will do better in cooler temps when budding.

texas was used as an example. i say look where pot grows the absolute best outdoors. ie spain... or north cali even. and look at the average temps from mid july to october (when pot buds) day and night.

the final couple or few days....should be anywhere from 60-70 degrees with little or no light.

once again srry to take over your thread. but yes... i would have a stroke if my girls were breaking out a sweat when im wanting them to produce the sweetest nectar know to man.

 

[apollo4]

80 s will work,photosythesis stops at 90,temps are only good for color.co2 is important though

 

[NoGutsGrower]

i normally wouldnt make a reply when it gets this far off topic... which is my fault, but bad advice is bad advice.

cannabis does most of its work when its nearing the end of its cycle. they way it knows to do this is by temperature. sure it starts budding to 12/12 light, but it gets tricked into producing more trichs when the temp is down. it puts out more trichs to catch the pollen from the male because it knows winter is about to be here, and it knows its about to die...not able to produce any offspring. bud gets harvested from august to oct. think about why that is and ull see that the 85-110 degree temps this guys is talkin about totally irrelevant. he talks about temps outdoors and yet we are still in 18 hours days outside. what does that have to do with budding a plant?

pot does best in 76-78 degree rooms. if ur using good amounts co2 u might need to bump that up to 80 or 81. but thats it. im not trying to say it wont grow in 85 degree temps.... my moms sit in the 80's. but it will do better in cooler temps when budding.

texas was used as an example. i say look where pot grows the absolute best outdoors. ie spain... or north cali even. and look at the average temps from mid july to october (when pot buds) day and night.

the final couple or few days....should be anywhere from 60-70 degrees with little or no light.

once again srry to take over your thread. but yes... i would have a stroke if my girls were breaking out a sweat when im wanting them to produce the sweetest nectar know to man.

Sorry you are crazy if you think 85 is bad! It is over 85 in humboldt county very often and there is some amazing outdoor from there! The outdoor people talk down on is grown in the shade, not in full sun! Go ask any real grower, Outdoor can be just as good as indoor and 85 is low for california! Maybe you already had a stroke and that's why you don't understand!

 

[NoGutsGrower]

Photosynthesis rate (A(n)) becomes unstable above a threshold temperature, and the recovery upon return to low temperature varies because of reasons not fully understood. We investigated responses of A(n), dark respiration and chlorophyll fluorescence to supraoptimal temperatures of varying duration and kinetics in Phaseolus vulgaris asking whether the instability of photosynthesis under severe heat stress is associated with cellular damage. Cellular damage was assessed by Evans blue penetration (enhanced membrane permeability) and by HO generation 3,3'-diaminobenzidine 4HCl (DAB)-staining. Critical temperature for dark fluorescence (F(0) rise (T(F)) was at 46-48 C, and a burst of respiration was observed near T(F). However, A(n) was strongly inhibited already before T(F) was reached. Membrane permeability increased with temperature according to a switch-type response, with enhanced permeability observed above 48 C. Experiments with varying heat pulse lengths and intensities underscored the threshold-type loss of photosynthetic function, and indicated that the degree of photosynthetic deterioration and cellular damage depended on accumulated heat-dose. Beyond the 'point of no return', propagation of cellular damage and reduction of photosynthesis continued upon transfer to lower temperatures and photosynthetic recovery was slow or absent. We conclude that instability of photosynthesis under severe heat stress is associated with time-dependent propagation of cellular lesions.


photosynthesis stops/causes celluar damage at 48c! that is 118.4 F! it starts to stress it while it is reaching those temps but not before 38c! 100.4F!

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-3040.2010.02229.x/pdf

 

[NoGutsGrower]

i normally wouldnt make a reply when it gets this far off topic... which is my fault, but bad advice is bad advice.

cannabis does most of its work when its nearing the end of its cycle. they way it knows to do this is by temperature. sure it starts budding to 12/12 light, but it gets tricked into producing more trichs when the temp is down. it puts out more trichs to catch the pollen from the male because it knows winter is about to be here, and it knows its about to die...not able to produce any offspring. bud gets harvested from august to oct. think about why that is and ull see that the 85-110 degree temps this guys is talkin about totally irrelevant. he talks about temps outdoors and yet we are still in 18 hours days outside. what does that have to do with budding a plant?

pot does best in 76-78 degree rooms. if ur using good amounts co2 u might need to bump that up to 80 or 81. but thats it. im not trying to say it wont grow in 85 degree temps.... my moms sit in the 80's. but it will do better in cooler temps when budding.

texas was used as an example. i say look where pot grows the absolute best outdoors. ie spain... or north cali even. and look at the average temps from mid july to october (when pot buds) day and night.

the final couple or few days....should be anywhere from 60-70 degrees with little or no light.

once again srry to take over your thread. but yes... i would have a stroke if my girls were breaking out a sweat when im wanting them to produce the sweetest nectar know to man.

Yes your temp advise is bad advise! Do a little more studying and not just what others post on this forum!

 

[NoGutsGrower]

i normally wouldnt make a reply when it gets this far off topic... which is my fault, but bad advice is bad advice.

normally i wouldn't keep going either but BAD ADVISE IS BAD ADVISE! Here is the summary of the report!

In these experiments, leafswere removed immediately
after heating and assessed for color reaction with
Evans blue to detect whether plasmalemma permeability
had been increased.When the heating was stopped at temperatures
below 46–47 °C (114 F), no cellular staining was found


When leaf temperature was raised to 47–48 °C, a
few, at most 1–2%, diffusely scattered blue-stained cells!

 

[michmed]

i normally wouldnt make a reply when it gets this far off topic... which is my fault, but bad advice is bad advice.

cannabis does most of its work when its nearing the end of its cycle. they way it knows to do this is by temperature. sure it starts budding to 12/12 light, but it gets tricked into producing more trichs when the temp is down. it puts out more trichs to catch the pollen from the male because it knows winter is about to be here, and it knows its about to die...not able to produce any offspring. bud gets harvested from august to oct. think about why that is and ull see that the 85-110 degree temps this guys is talkin about totally irrelevant. he talks about temps outdoors and yet we are still in 18 hours days outside. what does that have to do with budding a plant?

pot does best in 76-78 degree rooms. if ur using good amounts co2 u might need to bump that up to 80 or 81. but thats it. im not trying to say it wont grow in 85 degree temps.... my moms sit in the 80's. but it will do better in cooler temps when budding.

texas was used as an example. i say look where pot grows the absolute best outdoors. ie spain... or north cali even. and look at the average temps from mid july to october (when pot buds) day and night.

the final couple or few days....should be anywhere from 60-70 degrees with little or no light.

once again srry to take over your thread. but yes... i would have a stroke if my girls were breaking out a sweat when im wanting them to produce the sweetest nectar know to man.

Thanks, learned my lesson on heat, I want total control and am shooting for 76.

I think with reasonable venting & CFM movement I'll be find with a 2 Ton or possibly 3 Ton split A/C system.

I'm leaning to Hydrofarm Raptor 8" reflectors with 1000W HPS bulbs for bloom. Any bulb brands you guys prefer?

CAP or Sentinel Greenhouse light controllers?

 

[diffrentstrains]

Use Titan controls only.

 

[michmed]

Use Titan controls only.

Any particular reason you suggest Titan?

 

[diffrentstrains]

Cost effective and proven. Allows for max use of your power capabilities with the security and ease of analog controls. Not to say digital is bad but these guys have been making lighting and environmental cntrollers for 25 years or more.