DWC And lucas formula MAJOR help please, about to give up.

[dixon76]

Little background. This is the 5th attempt at growing now over the past year or so. Just trying to grow ONE freaking plant. can't do it.

EACH time, with either bagseed or expensive Northern Lights feminized seeds, the following happens.

Everything is fine for the first week and half. Then the plants start to look heavy, sag, get spots, turn yellow then die. I'm furious. I'm using a 6 gallon tote with about 3.5 gallons of water in it. Water is 2 inches from the bottom of the cups. 2 walmart airstone bars in the tank. Temp is usually solid at 78-81 with lights on, 68-71 lights off. Res temp is solid at about 67-68. Ph is usually right around 5.6-5.8
6 x 26 watt cfls about 2-3 inches from plant top. Pivoting fan on all day. Humidity about 50%.

Tap water which is city. Checked and it is about 60ppm, no chloramine.

Vortex fan exhaust with a passive intake, zero pressure setup. ( I.e door is difficult to open )

So yeah. Plant is about 14 days old now. Each one of my attempts have gone this route. About to swear off this forever. I'm doing everything textbook, and still not getting past a couple weeks of growth before everything goes to shit.

Currently at 50% of the Lucas Formula ( 5/10 ).

I've tried less, more, epsom salts, you name it. Hoping for some pro help here.

 

[oceangreen]

1. Are you using hydroton. Did you wash it and Ph it?
2. Is that rockwool you are using?
3. Get LED or a small hps over cfl for better lighting
4. Lower outside temps to 75
5. Raise your water to a few inches below the pot
6. Use only one air stone until they are bigger
7. Last resort is to also RO your water.

Its possible that your medium is absorbing too much water and is acidic
are you using any nutes or rapid rooter?

 

[dixon76]

1. Are you using hydroton. Did you wash it and Ph it?
2. Is that rockwool you are using?
3. Get LED or a small hps over cfl for better lighting
4. Lower outside temps to 75
5. Raise your water to a few inches below the pot
6. Use only one air stone until they are bigger
7. Last resort is to also RO your water.

Its possible that your medium is absorbing too much water and is acidic
are you using any nutes or rapid rooter?

1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. I'm not investing anymore money in this till I can actually get my one plant to bear fruit.
4. A previous grow I did in winter, and the temp never got about 75 once, was about 72 the entire 2 weeks, and the same thing happened.
5. As previously stated, the water currently sits exactly two inches below the net pots in the res.
6. More oxygen the better right?
7. I've tried distilled on two other attempts, and besides WILD ph spikes, the same thing happened. My tap water PH stays rock solid. Changing only .1 or two points in 24 hrs, sometimes it doesn't change at all.

Am not using any rapid rooter. I've actually got TONS of roots by this stage. The rockwool was soaked for 24 hours before using to a ph of about 4.
The rockwool also doesn't sit on the bottom of the pot. Has an inch layer of hydroton on the bottom first. Top of rockwool isn't even damp. It's bone dry.
This clearly looks like an overwatering issue with nute lockout. But it can't be overwatering. The water level isn't that high up, my roots are getting plenty of oxygen.
But they don't look to be using the water and nutes I put in the tank. In the first week before I add 1/4 strength nutes, I usually have to add a little water in the middle of the week, but once I add my 1/4 nutes, I never have to put a drop of water back in the res. So they are clearly not even using the nutes or the water anymore at that stage.

They just give up and die. SO frustrating. Using the GH Floramicro and FloraBloom.

 

[oceangreen]

Are your seeds feminized and from a reliable source ?

Don't give up, there is probably a small factor causing this problem. How much oxygen is your water pump putting out. The bubbles are actually water. So, I feel its over-watering and over feeding. From too much moisture in the medium. Dont worry about above. Its the roots you need to worry about, they are what absorbs the water/nute solution. So if your stones are pumping out too much moisture, then you are over watering and over feeding. They are still young. they dont need much. A good indication is to see how much the water the RES is loosing. first few weeks should not be over a quarter liter lost...
Also you lights don't traspire much energy from the plant. SO you need to very gentle in the first 2 weeks. After that it high sailing and easier.

They are definitely over watered. DO you have a meter? to check your PPM and EC?
That's a start
1. Take out one airstone
2. raise water to 2 inches below pot
3. check ppm and EC

Get back to us

 

[smokebros]

Bro, growing is not that difficult.

get your PH right, make sure there is lighting, and make sure the PPM are good. for a plant in early veg you should be running a PPM around 300-400. If you were doing all this then your plants wouldn't look like they do. I would suggest laying off the nutrients, your plants look pissed off.

 

[dixon76]

Bro, growing is not that difficult.

get your PH right, make sure there is lighting, and make sure the PPM are good. for a plant in early veg you should be running a PPM around 300-400. If you were doing all this then your plants wouldn't look like they do. I would suggest laying off the nutrients, your plants look pissed off.

My PH is currently, and always is, between 5.5 and 6.0. My PPM currently at 50% nutes is 335.

 

[dixon76]

Are your seeds feminized and from a reliable source ?

Don't give up, there is probably a small factor causing this problem. How much oxygen is your water pump putting out. The bubbles are actually water. So, I feel its over-watering and over feeding. From too much moisture in the medium. Dont worry about above. Its the roots you need to worry about, they are what absorbs the water/nute solution. So if your stones are pumping out too much moisture, then you are over watering and over feeding. They are still young. they dont need much. A good indication is to see how much the water the RES is loosing. first few weeks should not be over a quarter liter lost...
Also you lights don't traspire much energy from the plant. SO you need to very gentle in the first 2 weeks. After that it high sailing and easier.

They are definitely over watered. DO you have a meter? to check your PPM and EC?
That's a start
1. Take out one airstone
2. raise water to 2 inches below pot
3. check ppm and EC

Get back to us

Yes, feminized seeds from a reputable breeder. =)

Very interesting about the air stones. I was always under the impression more is better. So I went with two.
I'll try that!

 

[oceangreen]

Yes, feminized seeds from a reputable breeder. =)

Very interesting about the air stones. I was always under the impression more is better. So I went with two.
I'll try that!

really with the Lucas Formula, you should be using RO water and have a blue lab meter to regulate PPM. Its really that simple.

its a 300 $ investment thank will yield you a pound every 2 plants. Lucas Formula is meant to be RO. Hydro always works better with RO water.

 

[dixon76]

really with the Lucas Formula, you should be using RO water and have a blue lab meter to regulate PPM. Its really that simple.

its a 300 $ investment thank will yield you a pound every 2 plants. Lucas Formula is meant to be RO. Hydro always works better with RO water.

See...I've read otherwise. I've already tried a couple times with Distilled, and had nothing but problems with PH spikes. I have a PPM meter. As I said, the PPM is currently as of last check a couple minutes ago, 375. Plant isn't using any noticeable water, so I haven't had to refill any water yet.

 

[bigoberry]

Plant's lookin a bit dry IMO..is your water level up high enough that it keeps the bottom of your hydroton/rockwool pots wet? Are they rooting out of the bottom of the pots at all? Or, if not, are you watering them from the top when they get dry.. All your other specs sound like they should work.

Also, you're never gonna get a lb out of 2 plants with 6 cfl's (or cfl's at all), but those are fine for getting em started and growing.

 

[Jonus]

Technically speaking you pretty much have everthing set correctly.

Couple of more questions for you:
- How are the roots looking?
- What color are they,
- Are they bushy or stringy,
- Are there brown streaks through the roots or are they all fluffy white,
- Can you get a picture of the roots, which would be helpful.
- Have you tried another type of nutrient
- Do you sterilize your pots and gear before using them i.e. a bath in hydrogen peroxide mix and let sit till it dries to kill off any pathogens
- Also are you foliar spraying anything on to them

 

[Wetdog]

IDK hydro at all, but 50% nutes+a 14 day old seedling just don't seem to be a good combo.

Kinda like trying to force feed an infant a 14oz T-Bone rather than a 28oz T-Bone.

Wet

 

[dixon76]

Technically speaking you pretty much have everthing set correctly.

Couple of more questions for you:
- How are the roots looking?
- What color are they,
- Are they bushy or stringy,
- Are there brown streaks through the roots or are they all fluffy white,
- Can you get a picture of the roots, which would be helpful.
- Have you tried another type of nutrient
- Do you sterilize your pots and gear before using them i.e. a bath in hydrogen peroxide mix and let sit till it dries to kill off any pathogens
- Also are you foliar spraying anything on to them

Thanks for the reply Jonus.
1. Roots look great.
2. Ones in deep water are light pinkish brown due in part to the GH Flora series. Ones not in the water are healthy bright white.
3. Roots are stringy
4. Roots are currently pretty solid. Not fluffy, just thin.
5. Will try to get that for you.
6. I've also tried organics before, and that was a catastrophe as well. LOL
7. Have not sterilized anything. Though I do wash the res out with hydrogen peroxide when changing the water.
8. No foliar spraying.

 

[dixon76]

IDK hydro at all, but 50% nutes+a 14 day old seedling just don't seem to be a good combo.

Kinda like trying to force feed an infant a 14oz T-Bone rather than a 28oz T-Bone.

Wet

That is what Roseman suggests for his bubbleponics DWC guide.

 

[Wetdog]

That is what Roseman suggests for his bubbleponics DWC guide.

Like I said, IDK hydro at all and Roseman does know his stuff, BUT, different strains like different nute levels and this just might be a light feeder. Seedlings especially.

I just would try a less than 50% level and see what happens. It's easy to add more if it's lacking.

Wet

 

[nickyt27]

i am having the same problem with my plants except mine dont even get that big. My plant now is at 10 days, got to about 1 in tall and is now starting to sag. I started 1/4 nutes on day 8 but my roots are not even close to the bottom of the net pot yet, they are just popping out of the bottom of the rock wool. Could the problem be not enough water? Like Dixon my rockwool is dry but my water level is about 1 in below net pot and the bottom of the net pot is getting wet. Could my res temp be too high? i didnt even consider res temp since my roots dont seem to be feeding from the res yet but could just be a newb mistake. Seems like our problems could be similar. This is my second plant, lost the first one in the same fashion. Any help would be appreciated.