Is this PH Lockout?

I use Sunshine mix #4
Botnicare power plant nutrients.
temps 75-80
distilled water

I have tried watering with a lower ph
I have tried watering with a higher ph
Still occurring.

Been fighting this problem since veg, still can not figure it out.
Please rollitup, help me out..
IMG_1125.jpgIMG_1126.jpgIMG_1127.jpgIMG_1128.jpgIMG_1129.jpg
 

Krondizzel

New Member
I have seen this in a few cases. I might be wrong or right, nevertheless, sharing my experiences with you.

Initially, it looks like a calcium def. The rounded tips and the tips "clawing" at the end is usually signs of overfert or your PH being off. If your PH is off, it will affect the ability for your roots to uptake nutrients.

Make sure your PPM are low and your PH is correct. From the pics, I can't quite tell if your soil or hydro. The blue mix 4 bag makes me think soil? but I'm not sure. I'm not a soil guy.

I will include a couple attachments that might help you decode your problems yourself. Hope this helps.
 

Moldy

Well-Known Member
Looks like a lack of Mag and/or Calcium to me since you're using distilled water.
 

Krondizzel

New Member
View attachment 2424329View attachment 2424330View attachment 2424331

Lastly:

Action Mode, Deficiency and Toxicity Symptoms of the 17 Essential Nutrients.
MACRO NUTRIENTS
Nutrient
Action Mode
Deficiency
Excess
Comments
Nitrogen (N)
Absorbed as NO3-, NH4+; responsible for rapid foliage growth and green color; easily leaches from soil, especially NO3-; mobile in plant, moving to new growth
Reduced growth, light green to yellow foliage (chlorosis); reds and purples may intensify with some plants; reduced lateral breaks; symptoms appear first on older growth
Succulent growth, leaves are dark green, thick and brittle; poor fruit set; excess ammonia can induce calcium deficiency
The best NH4+/NO3- ratio is 1/1; high NH4+ under low light can cause leaf curl; uptake inhibited by high P levels; indoors, best N/K ratio is 1/1 unless light is extremely high; in soils with high C/N ratio more N should be supplied.
Phosphorus (P)
Promotes root formation and growth; affects quality of seed, fruit and flower production; increased disease resistance; does not leach from soil readily; mobile in plant, moving to new growth
Reduced growth; leaves dark green; purple or red color in older leaves, especially on the underside of the leaf along the veins; leaf shape may be distorted; thin stems; limited root growth
Shows up as micronutrient deficiency of Zn, Fe, or Co
Rapidly "fixed" on soil particles; when applied under acid conditions, fixed with Fe, Mn and Al; under alkaline conditions fixed with Ca; high P interferes with micronutrient and N absorption; used in relatively small amounts when compared to N and K; availability is lowest in cold soils.
Potassium (K)
Helps plants overcome drought stress; improves winter hardiness; increased disease resistance; improves the rigidity of stalks; leaches from soil; mobile in plant
Reduced growth; shortened internodes; margins of older leaves become chlorotic and burn; necrotic (dead) spots on older leaves; reduction of lateral breaks and tendency to wilt readily; poorly developed root systems; weak stalks
Causes N deficiency in plant and may affect the uptake of other positive ions such as Mg and Ca
High N/low K favors vegetative growth; low N/high K promotes reproductive growth (flower, fruit); calcium excess impedes uptake of potassium
Magnesium (Mg)
Absorbed as Mg++; leaches from sandy soil; mobile in plant
Reduction in growth; yellowish, bronze, or reddish color of older leaves, while veins remains green; leaf margins may curl downward or upward with a puckering effect
Interferes with Ca uptake; small necrotic spots in older leaves; smaller veins in older leaves may turn brown; in advanced stage, young leaves may be spotted
Mg is commonly deficient in foliage plants because it is leached and not replaced; epsom salts at a rate of 1 teaspoon per gallon may be used two times a year; Mg can be absorbed by leaves if sprayed in a weak solution; dolomitic limestone can be applied in outdoor situations to rectify a deficiency
Calcium (Ca)
Absorbed as Ca++; moderately leachable; limited mobility in plant; essential for growth of shoot and root tips; reduces the toxicity of aluminum and manganese
Inhibition of bud growth; roots can turn black and rot; young leaves are scalloped and abnormally green; leaf tips may stick together; cupping of maturing leaves; blossom end rot of many fruits, pits on root vegetables; stem structure is weak; premature shedding of fruit and buds
Interferes with Mg absorption; high Ca usually causes high pH which then precipitates many of the micronutrient so they become unavailable to the plant
Ca is rarely deficient if the correct pH is maintained; too much or too little water, can affect Ca relationships within the plant causing deficiency in the location where Ca was needed at the time of stress
Sulfur (S)
Absorbed as SO4-; leachable; not mobile; contributes to odor and taste of some vegetables
Rarely deficient; general yellowing of the young leaves then the entire plant; veins lighter in color than adjoining interveinal area; roots and stems are small, hard and woody
Sulfur excess is usually in the form of air pollution
Sulfur excess is difficult to control but rarely a problem.


MICRONUTRIENT
Nutrient
Mode of Action
Deficiency
Excess /Comments
Iron (Fe)
Absorbed as Fe++, Fe+++; accumulates in the oldest leaves and is relative immobile in the phloem; necessary for the maintenance of chlorophyll
Interveinal chlorosis primarily on young tissue, which may become white; Fe deficiency may occur even if Fe is in the soil when: soil high in Ca, poorly drained soil, soil high in Mn, high pH, high P, soil high in heavy metals (Cu, Zn), oxygen deficient soils or when nematodes attack the roots; Fe should be added in the chelate form; the type of chelate needed depends upon the soil pH; foliar fertilization will temporarily correct the deficiency; may be deficient in centipedegrass where pH and P are high
Rare except on flooded soils
Boron (B)
Absorbed as B(OH)3-; important in enabling photosynthetic transfer; very immoble in plants
Failure to set seed; internal breakdown of fruit or vegetable; death of apical buds, giving rise to witches broom; failure of root tip to elongate normally; young leaves become thick, leathery, and chlorotic; rust colored cracks and corking on young stems, petioles and flower stalks (e.g. heart rot of beets, stem crack of celery); breakdown occurs at the base of the youngest shoots
Tips and edges of leaves exhibit necrotic spots coalescing into a marginal scorch (similiar to high soluable salts); oldest leaves are affected first; plants are easily damaged by excess application
Zinc (Zn)
Absorbed as Zn++; enzyme activity
Young leaves are very small, sometimes missing leaf blades; short internodes; distorted or puckered leaf margins; interveinal chlorosis
Sever stunting, reddening; poor germination; older leaves wilt; entire leaf is affected by chlorosis, edges and main vein often retain more color; can be caused by galvanized metal.
Copper (Cu)
Absorbed as Cu++, Cu+; enzyme activity
New growth small, misshapen, wilted; may be found in some peat soils; in some species young leaves may show interveinal chlorosis while tips of older leaves remain green.
Can occur at low pH; shows up as Fe deficiency
Manganese (Mn)
Absorbed as Mn++
Interveinal chlorosis with smallest leaves remaining green producing a checkered effect; grey or tan spots usually develop in chlorotic areas; dead spots may drop out of the leaf; poor bloom size and color; induced by excessively high pH.
Reduction in growth, brown spotting on leaves; shows up as Fe deficiency; found under strongly acid conditions
Molybdenum (Mo)
Absorbed as MoO4-
Interveinal chlorosis on older or midstem leaves; twisted leaves (whiptail); marginal scorching and rolling or cupping of leaves; nitrogen deficiency symptoms may develop
Intense yellow or purple color in leaves; rarely observed
Chlorine (Cl)
Absorbed as Cl -
Wilted leaves which become bronze then chlorotic then die; club roots
Salt injury, leaf burn, may increase succulence
Cobalt (Co)
Absorbed as Co++
This need by plants recently established; essential for Nitrogen fixation
Little is known about its deficiency or toxicity symptoms
Nickel (Ni)
Absorbed as Ni+
This need by plants recently established; essential for seed development
 
Check my ph?
Like what i do every single time i water?.....

Watering ph ranges from 5.5 to 7.5 (experimenting to see if it would resolve the problem) Regular ph 6.5
Like i said...

"I have tried watering with a lower ph
I have tried watering with a higher ph
"
 

JustAnotherUser

Active Member
Check my ph?
Like what i do every single time i water?.....

Watering ph ranges from 5.5 to 7.5 (experimenting to see if it would resolve the problem) Regular ph 6.5
Like i said...

"I have tried watering with a lower ph
I have tried watering with a higher ph
"
If your in soil bro keep it down at a 6.3 - 6.5... 5.5 is too low for dirt
 
Looks like a lack of Mag and/or Calcium to me since you're using distilled water.
I thought that is what it was a first, bought some cal-mag added during veg, things kept on getting worse..

I might try cal-mag again as im half way into flower see what happens
 

Krondizzel

New Member
Check my ph?
Like what i do every single time i water?.....

Watering ph ranges from 5.5 to 7.5 (experimenting to see if it would resolve the problem) Regular ph 6.5
Like i said
...

"I have tried watering with a lower ph
I have tried watering with a higher ph
"
Look at your nute chart. Adding 7.5? Look at the chart, your plant cant uptake very much at that PH level.

5.5 - refer to the chart again.

What will help, is getting an idea of what your run off is. If your adding 6.5 and it's coming out the bottom 5.5, you need to correct for that. 7.5 is a hell of a correction. If your PH is out of range for too long, yes, you'll be in nute lockout until you get it back in the normal range for long enough for your plants to go back to doing what they were doing.

My hydro bracket is 5.5-6.1, I wouldn't correct a 5.5 problem with a splash of 7.5 water to bring it to 5.8 I'll have an unstable PH. The highest I will go is 6.1 so that I don't run out of my bracket and run myself into nute lock. I must add PH balanced shit and correct as needed. Your PH will fluctuate. Plain and simple. Once you master how to control it, you'll see HUGE improvements.
 

beuffer420

Well-Known Member
Yea Looks like ph prob did the spotting start at the front of the leaves or more towards the middle to back? Only reason I ask is cal mag def for me at least seems to start it's spotting on front towards tip while ph fluctuation I noticed to start more in the middle to back of leaf and progress towards the front. There's a book called marijuana garden saver it's 16 dollars on amazon and has great photos of def and toxicities.
 

imchucky666

Well-Known Member
Check my ph?
Like what i do every single time i water?.....

Watering ph ranges from 5.5 to 7.5 (experimenting to see if it would resolve the problem) Regular ph 6.5
Like i said...

"I have tried watering with a lower ph
I have tried watering with a higher ph
"

Try 6.5 tap water and change nothing else for a week and see what happens, if it helps.
I remember seeing the yellow spots once before, but for life of me, I can't remember what we ended up figuring out.
 

Krondizzel

New Member
One of my locations has a hard water problem which limits my calcium intake. If it's a consistent problem, could be your water quality.
 

Krondizzel

New Member
and yes, cal/mag look pretty similar. I purchased general hydroponics "calmagic" and I haven't seen spots since.
 

JustAnotherUser

Active Member
Try 6.5 tap water and change nothing else for a week and see what happens, if it helps.
I remember seeing the yellow spots once before, but for life of me, I can't remember what we ended up figuring out.
You have 6.5 ph tap water? I would kill to live somewhere with that!
The spots i think look similar to a p/k defiancy, normally a golden brown type of spot that will occur in the flowering stages. the variying of ph can't be helping at all though
 
Will definitely keep my ph at 6.5 from now on.
Will also try the few ideas you guys have given me
Thank you for the time!
Will see how the next few days go!
 

Krondizzel

New Member
You have 6.5 ph tap water? I would kill to live somewhere with that!
The spots i think look similar to a p/k defiancy, normally a golden brown type of spot that will occur in the flowering stages. the variying of ph can't be helping at all though
I'm jealous too. 8.3 out of mine. I've got a damn PH down punch card around here somewhere I swear lol
 
Top