keebo3000
Well-Known Member
um... whats a troll?
Fan Leafs. Blockers of Light Or Energy Producers???
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Kite High
Well-Known Member
legallyflying
Well-Known Member
Your just as much a troll kite
Kite High
Well-Known Member
Sir.Ganga
New Member
Ill address you first UB. You honestly think my background comes from these sites? More likely your bachground with the type of comments you make. Most of your comments are so full of holes and completely wrong that these sites are the only place you can get anyone to believe your BS. If reasearch and development is erroneous forum popular thought as you say than I guess I am guilty of that but without R/D our whole society suffers and we would still be using horses for our main transportation. Sadly UB its all about attitude, if your attitude is that you know it all (which yours is hands down) then you loose out on real knowledge because your head is so big on yourself that you pass up valuable knowledge. I was there once too UB but I grew up on my 13 birthday...maybe you should take the hint...grow up or shut up.Bullshit, no you don't. You can not make "better decisions" from the crap you glean around here. Folks don't even know what's in their bottles much less understand what makes a plant tick. Of course, they got dem charts to follow!
Hearsay rules the ignorant and those drawn to (erroneous) forum popular thought.
Wrong. Common botanical sense is not about attitude. It's about science........ shit-fer-brains.
Uncle Ben
Now Kite High are you trying to make me believe that in your pic is 3 week old Sativas? First off in 3 weeks most sativa strains barely start budding. If anything maybe just maybe there might be some sativa enetics in there but by the look I doubt that. So you have to LIE about time lines and strains to proove your point!
10-16 zips a plant...I call bullshit AGAIN! Come on even a newb see's through this statment You pull up a pic of a test tray that I have done and call me a douche! Why... because it shows what technique does or maybe just because your just a little jelous that my statements are proven by my pics and even in my small grows produce quality bud no matter the technique. Thats the difference between us, I do not think I know everything and am willing to impliment and improve techniques to better my system.
By the way that was an execellent technique for closet and small room growers.
Im sorry you guys's heads are up your asses but since your there check for fertilizer, I hear UB has a technique for that and it doesn't cost you nothin!
You both have been caught throwing bullshit and the lies are so transparent that even a newb reading this should be able to figure it out.
Im done with you two wannabee's I have shown everyone that reads this what you actually are
Complete Liars with a small skill base and big heads. People come here for help, you two should do the same..
How did you take that pic of yourself...now thats talent!
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
I asked you and the other botanical retards to provide us with one bonafide, non partisan study reflecting your theory that yanking off the very unit that produces flowers increases bud bulk...... and you didn't, nor you can you.
FAIL
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Looks like a healthy productive leaf to me. A few necrotic spots doesn't hurt the photosynthetic efficiency. If it got worse, then I would have pulled it. Gonna toot my horn and post a photo of what a plant should look like start to finish. Not saying I always manage, but I usually come pretty damn close with 90% of the fan leaves still green and productive come harvest.
Even this 18" tall Mexican sativa seedling in a super small pot had decent leaves before it hit the compost pile (it was an experiment).
chuck estevez
Well-Known Member
you sir, are delusional. I see UB follow EVERY claim with links to professional studies that back up what he says, you spout a bunch of B.S. with nothing but your pics to back it up. for all we know, those plants finish as a bunch of fluffy buds. Buds always look the best right after the chop.
what a donk you are.
elkukupanda
Active Member
thanks for the reply brother. I'm let them be until they go somewhat yellowish... The thing is like my plants are like a forest so I think the plant is trying to get rid of the ones at the very bottom.. I'm seriously thinking about layering all those leafs down there and raising the soil level even more...what you think?
I have been growing for a couple years now and after reading and experimenting a lot w/ defoliation I have developed a somewhat reasonable opinion on the matter.
I have a botany degree and worked in botanical fields for several years now. I know how plants grow, and more importantly, I know how to manipulate plants for our own selfish human needs which more often than not, are different than a plants own needs. In regards to defoliation as a means to increase bud production, folks need to throw a lot about botany and plant growth characteristics out of the water. The reason being, think about what the entire point of a plants life is: to reproduce. That is, in the case of a female cannabis plant, to become pollinated and produce LOTS and LOTS of SEEDS. That's right, seeds. When a plant becomes pollinated it is safe to assume most of it's energy is diverted to grow and mature the seed. As cannabis growers, we are in fact training the plant to do something it does not want to do, grow massive, unpollinated buds. That is why I feel when people apply normal botanical logic and say cutting off any type of vegetation is bad, they are correct in terms of seed production but not bud production. I wager most of the energy going to buds comes from the sugar leaves and the tiny leaves on the base and apical area of the buds itself, not the large fan leaves. A cannabis plant wasn't designed to produce the quantity of buds we want to see. The plant is happy growing a couple thousand small flowers and having a few hundred pollinated. The plant will eventually sinese and die. What we do, is deprive the plant from pollination so the flowers keep on growing and developing, unfertilized.
I can't upload pictures, but I have done several side by side comparisons w/ defoliation and no defoliation. Buds that are getting more light are bigger than the ones that get less, period. That is a open and shut case for me. The real question is if more light is getting to the buds because fan leaves are removed, does that negative affect outweigh the positive effect of bud production? From my experiments, no. If you cut fan leaves off, the buds below them will get bigger and mature faster. I've proven that to myself over and over again. Now, will a defoliated plant, once pollinated, produce as many healthy seeds as an un-defoliated plant? Probably not as that is the entire purpose of a plants life and removing leaves should negatively affect that.
I've seen it both ways really.. growers on here who practice zero defoliation but feed the plant perfectly in a perfect medium with tons of light get great results. I've also seen defoliation create an unbelievable number of dense flowers which would not have been there normally. Using botanical knowledge is great, but we need to think about things a bit differently because we are manipulating the plant that goes against it's natural life cycle. Just my $0.02.
I have a botany degree and worked in botanical fields for several years now. I know how plants grow, and more importantly, I know how to manipulate plants for our own selfish human needs which more often than not, are different than a plants own needs. In regards to defoliation as a means to increase bud production, folks need to throw a lot about botany and plant growth characteristics out of the water. The reason being, think about what the entire point of a plants life is: to reproduce. That is, in the case of a female cannabis plant, to become pollinated and produce LOTS and LOTS of SEEDS. That's right, seeds. When a plant becomes pollinated it is safe to assume most of it's energy is diverted to grow and mature the seed. As cannabis growers, we are in fact training the plant to do something it does not want to do, grow massive, unpollinated buds. That is why I feel when people apply normal botanical logic and say cutting off any type of vegetation is bad, they are correct in terms of seed production but not bud production. I wager most of the energy going to buds comes from the sugar leaves and the tiny leaves on the base and apical area of the buds itself, not the large fan leaves. A cannabis plant wasn't designed to produce the quantity of buds we want to see. The plant is happy growing a couple thousand small flowers and having a few hundred pollinated. The plant will eventually sinese and die. What we do, is deprive the plant from pollination so the flowers keep on growing and developing, unfertilized.
I can't upload pictures, but I have done several side by side comparisons w/ defoliation and no defoliation. Buds that are getting more light are bigger than the ones that get less, period. That is a open and shut case for me. The real question is if more light is getting to the buds because fan leaves are removed, does that negative affect outweigh the positive effect of bud production? From my experiments, no. If you cut fan leaves off, the buds below them will get bigger and mature faster. I've proven that to myself over and over again. Now, will a defoliated plant, once pollinated, produce as many healthy seeds as an un-defoliated plant? Probably not as that is the entire purpose of a plants life and removing leaves should negatively affect that.
I've seen it both ways really.. growers on here who practice zero defoliation but feed the plant perfectly in a perfect medium with tons of light get great results. I've also seen defoliation create an unbelievable number of dense flowers which would not have been there normally. Using botanical knowledge is great, but we need to think about things a bit differently because we are manipulating the plant that goes against it's natural life cycle. Just my $0.02.
elkukupanda
Active Member
Last night I was reading about the different sections of a plant, and how each part ( fan leafs ) supply energy and stuff... That's why I was wondering of giving back to the roots what belongs to them
elkukupanda
Active Member
Hello there sir, thanks for sharing..
really???
ok, but what about getting rid of the toxins? What about the plant putting tons of energy to generate bigger leafs again? And what about the roots?? I mean you got no pics or anything is just hard to believe... I think every grower here plucks a leaf here and there whenever is needed but I haven't seen any defoliation crop yet (except for those trying to sell a book) that outweighs a solid grow... If you could be kind enough to show week by week development and methods it would be great... And we are manipulating the plant to grow healthy and strong... If you need more lights for better results that's your answer.... Get more lights...
Now my question is... What is the point in lying... You introduce yourself as "you have been growing for a couple of years and "after reading" then you have a botanical degree... I wasn't going to say anything and be polite but I'm just tired of idiots who don't value others people time and effort ( and willingness ) to contribute with newbies like me....
Like I already mentioned, I can't post pics.. think about the reason. There are many others who have posted side by side comparison pics if you look hard enough. I don't understand why you bring up lying or being confrontational in your response. Its an anonymous internet forum, believe me or not I don't give a flying fuck. This is a place to share opinions and information. Take it or leave it dude.
I never said anything about taking ALL the leaves off. You take 3-5 large leaves at the top of the plant that are shading light from reaching the interior.
elkukupanda
Active Member
My question would be... If fan leafs didn't contribute with buds... As some people claim that the bud sites are "enough"... Then why I haven't seen a single defoliated plant with a massive cola like plants with foliage... You know by empirical data and throwing botany away... Just looks like people is harvesting less.. Smaller cola... And couple grams more on lower shoots.... I mean what's the plant going to do now that's she's been rape and stuff...
Kite High
Well-Known Member
and to you again you punk. Fuck off. Go suck something and quit wasting my time. Test plants my ass. The best you have shown is maybe a 4 ounce short bush. When you actually grow something I will read your words again. Til then. Like I said FUCK OFF. go cut leaves
elkukupanda
Active Member
3 - 5 leafs? Honestly man??? Now you are backing off like that.... Defoliation doesn't mean that.. Neither that I would concur with doing that... And yes.. Internet... Exactly that's why this topic is still around... But guess what... A lot of newbies like me are reading this... And we want to learn how to grow dope... I'm not trying to being confrontational but you said you read the whole thread right? Why you think I'm waisting my time to type this... Get it?
elkukupanda
Active Member
Sorry if I hurt your feelings... See you around.Yea I get that your being a cockbag over and over again. Sorry I even posted. Goodluck continuing on being a confrontational newbie, see how far that gets you
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
I'd venture to say they're probably stressing out because of too much salts. Copper colored necrotic dots between veins is a good indicator as is dessicated, brown/black leaf tips.
No, don't layer an entire leaf. If you want more root output then cut off the lower petioles near the trunk, let the wounds callous for a day and cover it up with soil. Every node that is covered like that will induce root output, greatly increasing plant vigor because of more water/salts uptake potential.
UB
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