First Grow, Panama Red!
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209 Cali closet grower
Well-Known Member
got any shop lights? t12
Jack Harer
Well-Known Member
your moisture meter is pretty much worthless unless it just measures room RH. Best way to determine when to water is to water until saturated, lift the pot to feel the weight. Then let them dry out well, and feel the weight again. I know it's not "High Tech", but it's the most reliable. It was hammered to me when I was starting out, and in the end, it's the best way I have heard of to figure a watering schedule.
Thank you so much, this will really help with the watering, my biggest concern was with overwatering. this will help a lot.
Jack Harer
Well-Known Member
Just remember, over watering has nothing to do with how MUCH water you run thru, it's about how long the roots stay wet. They need oxygen and to dry out a bit between waterings. Always water until you get runoff. It'll take a minute to get used to what your doing, you dont wanna let em get TOO dry so that the soil pulls away from the sides as when you DO water the water will run down between the soil and the pot. Dont stress over that tho, it just takes time to get used to. As long as you dont let the roots sit wet for too long you'll be fine. If it makes ya feel any better, I bought a meter at first as well. Live and learn.
drolove
Well-Known Member
stay away from miracle grow altogether if you can. especially their nutrients!
as far as the light goes and people saying a 400 watt is too much for seedlings.....wtf people? sun puts off way more light and heat then a 400 watter.
ALL my seedlings pot out into the world under a 400 and dont have 1 issue with it.
so anyways ya stay away from MG, watch out for over watering (top noob mistake), and i saw you were messing with you seeds a lot and were worried about them not popping up and what not. its really best you just plant them in your soil and just let them be. messing with them when they are germinating just spells disaster. GOOD LUCK! and ill be watching. subbed.
as far as the light goes and people saying a 400 watt is too much for seedlings.....wtf people? sun puts off way more light and heat then a 400 watter.
ALL my seedlings pot out into the world under a 400 and dont have 1 issue with it.
so anyways ya stay away from MG, watch out for over watering (top noob mistake), and i saw you were messing with you seeds a lot and were worried about them not popping up and what not. its really best you just plant them in your soil and just let them be. messing with them when they are germinating just spells disaster. GOOD LUCK! and ill be watching. subbed.
Jack Harer
Well-Known Member
OK, with the MG soil, you have to consider that almost without exception, MG soil has added nutrients. So when you DO start feeding, keep that in mind. Seedlings wont need to be fed for at least a couple weeks after they start to take off, and the nutes in the soil are sometimes too much for them. In the future, avoid any added nutes in your soil unless you mix it yourself. I'd get the saran wrap off there and just be vigilant about keeping them MOIST not wet. The saran wrap could allow the air to stagnate and you'll end up with mold on the soil surface. Let the air circulate naturally. Peat pellets and a moisture dome make things SO much easier to control as the domes have adjustable vents on them.
I germ my seed in paper towels, the put the germed seed into a peat pellet where it will stay for at least a month under T-8s before I transplant them into their final homes. I put 1 seedling per pot under a few 400w lights to veg, then flower under 2 or 3 1K lights depending on how many I run, usually 72 at a time (4'x8' flood table, plants in 8" grow bags)
Just out of curiosity, why multiple seed in one pot? If you only want to grtow out a certain amount of plants, say 10, you'll need to germ at least 15 or 20 beans to ensure you get the amount of females you want. Putting multiple seed in one pot (to me at least) just creates some avoidable problems.
I germ my seed in paper towels, the put the germed seed into a peat pellet where it will stay for at least a month under T-8s before I transplant them into their final homes. I put 1 seedling per pot under a few 400w lights to veg, then flower under 2 or 3 1K lights depending on how many I run, usually 72 at a time (4'x8' flood table, plants in 8" grow bags)
Just out of curiosity, why multiple seed in one pot? If you only want to grtow out a certain amount of plants, say 10, you'll need to germ at least 15 or 20 beans to ensure you get the amount of females you want. Putting multiple seed in one pot (to me at least) just creates some avoidable problems.
I had 12 old seeds germinating and didn't have tham many pots, I was waiting till the tap root was showing on a few of them but they never popped. I just ended up putting all 12 in the same pot, I'll separate them the best I can if any of them sprout. Also thank you for the info on the MG, is the added nutrients the only reason MG isn't the best choice of soil?
Jack Harer
Well-Known Member
It's pretty much the only disadvantage I can see. The biggest problems most new growers have is A) over feeding, B) over-watering. Being a weed, I don't believe it has the nutritional needs that most ornamental plants have, my theory, just an observation. And Miracle-Gro is pretty hot. Most newbies will follow the recommended dose (IF they even read the label) and that's way too much. Combine the use of their (or any other) fertilizer with their nutrient containing soil and....well, you get the idea.
Miracle-Gro can be used with success but not at the recommended doses. There are way too many documented grows using ONLY MG products to say that Miracle-Gro doesn't work. They aren't the number one name in household fertilizers because they don't work. They may not be IDEAL, but they certainly will grow good pot when used right.
As for soil, the best soils are the ones you KNOW whats in them, like the ones you make yourself. SubCools "Super Soil mix" is a great starter mix. Use it until you get your mind around the principles of organics and plant nutrition and can make your own adjustments to it. Find a base soil with "no added nutrients" (Like Fafard, or most larger nurseries/garden centers will have a "house mix" potting soil with no nutes. Use that as your base, and add to it as you (or your plants) need.
Miracle-Gro can be used with success but not at the recommended doses. There are way too many documented grows using ONLY MG products to say that Miracle-Gro doesn't work. They aren't the number one name in household fertilizers because they don't work. They may not be IDEAL, but they certainly will grow good pot when used right.
As for soil, the best soils are the ones you KNOW whats in them, like the ones you make yourself. SubCools "Super Soil mix" is a great starter mix. Use it until you get your mind around the principles of organics and plant nutrition and can make your own adjustments to it. Find a base soil with "no added nutrients" (Like Fafard, or most larger nurseries/garden centers will have a "house mix" potting soil with no nutes. Use that as your base, and add to it as you (or your plants) need.
Cobnobuler
Well-Known Member
No, MG is also known for making your weed taste earily similar to shit. Not that I know what shit tastes like mind you
but the paralels are drawnAnyway...I think you have an even bigger problem. If the seeds didnt sprout in the tried and true wet paper towel method, I'm betting that they are not going to sprout at all for ya. Shame too because I'd like to see some pics of some old school Panama Red
Jack Harer
Well-Known Member
OK, thanx Cob, yeah, the weed will most likely have that "chemical salt" taste, and won't burn evenly, but that you'll get with any chemical salt type ferts. Organics will yield the best tasting bud you've ever had!! No salt build up in the soil, so no need to flush as well. organics really IS the easiest and most forgiving way to grow once you get your mind around the principles. You feed the soil, the soil feeds the plant! Got it?
It has been nearly a month since I potted the 12 panama red seeds, and they have yet to sprout. The 2 panama red and 2 pandora's box seeds that I planted 14 days ago have yet to sprout as well. I don't really know if I should wait longer, or just toss the 12 and wait on the other 4, or toss them all and start over. What do you guys think?
Okay, so the plants still haven't sprouted, and I think it might be that the room they are in gets too cold at night, so I moved the lamp down to about 2-2 1/2 feet from the top of the pots. I am going to give them a couple more weeks and then if they don't sprout I am going to start over. I am going to be using my own mix for soil this time. I am thinking about 4 parts FF happy frog, 1 part perlite, 1 part vermiculite, 1 part blood meal, 1 part bone meal, small handful of azomite, and a small handful of dolomite lime. I am not sure how far this soil will get me with out added nutes but I guess I will find out. I am thinking I will just put the seeds right into the soil this time, and putting them under the light so they have some heat throughout the day and leaving the light on 24/7 so the cold of night doesn't mess with the seeds too much.
Does this sound like a good idea? anything I should add to the soil or change about my plan?
also thank you all so much for your replies! they have been more than helpful and I greatly appreciate all the advice!
Does this sound like a good idea? anything I should add to the soil or change about my plan?
also thank you all so much for your replies! they have been more than helpful and I greatly appreciate all the advice!
ProfessorPotSnob
New Member
Regardless of the controversy surrounding , have you thought of soaking seeds in water and placing in moist paper towels ? Some growers swear by it and some curse this method ... None the less you ll know when they have and if they have sprouted , verses waiting and wondering ..
That is how I started the seeds, after they started to pop I put them in the soil, I might have messed with them too much and killed the seeds, but I am trying to stay hopeful. some of the seeds are 25+ years old.