16000+ watts medigrow: og kush+ 13 x 1kw hps + 3 x t5 badboys + grotek = *HAPPY JOY*

Wolverine97

Wolverine97

Well-Known Member
mellokitty said:
that's the stuff from lee valley, right? i've seen banana slugs longer than my middle finger crawling over that shit to get to my tomatoes. i'm thinking maybe the "shock" is relative to body size... an electrified fence'd probably stop a toddler way more effectively than an adult human, for instance.

i looooooooove lee valley though. such a treasure trove for plant geeks like us. i could not live life without "the world's kindest nailbrush".

fwiw, i personally have my doubts on whether you guys are dealing with actual fg's. don't take my word for it, the last time i had an issue with fg's diazinon was still legal for household use. :lol:



i gotta tell you dubbzy, this one has me stumped. ^^this^^ suggests to me that they aren't fg's. fg larvae have black heads, pupate (as tan or brown pupae), and emerge as (black) gnats. i've wracked my brain and google imaged various larvae until i almost made myself sick [srsly-->:cuss: fuck you google :cuss: for throwing in the odd random root weevil larvae among the flies and gnats. disgusting things. *hurl* ] and i have no suggestions for what they actually might be. i thought maybe "root aphid" but i'm pretty sure aphids don't have a wormy-looking larval stage.

i've shown your pic to one of my garden gurus who's a certified horticulturalist and we're going to consult her compendium of garden pests tonight because she's stumped too. she doesn't think they're fg's either.
Click to expand...
I'd have to guess root aphids.
*shudders*
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
mellokitty said:
i gotta tell you dubbzy, this one has me stumped. ^^this^^ suggests to me that they aren't fg's. fg larvae have black heads, pupate (as tan or brown pupae), and emerge as (black) gnats. i've wracked my brain and google imaged various larvae until i almost made myself sick [srsly-->:cuss: fuck you google :cuss: for throwing in the odd random root weevil larvae among the flies and gnats. disgusting things. *hurl* ] and i have no suggestions for what they actually might be. i thought maybe "root aphid" but i'm pretty sure aphids don't have a wormy-looking larval stage.

i've shown your pic to one of my garden gurus who's a certified horticulturalist and we're going to consult her compendium of garden pests tonight because she's stumped too. she doesn't think they're fg's either.
Click to expand...
Wow, thank you so much for doing that for me kitty!! +reppppp It has us stumped too, but...... whatever it is just got hooked up since I used the hygrozyme to break down all the dead matter in the soil for them to now feed themselves on. The hygrozyme will NOT kill the larvae. I was just up at my friends hydro store for 2 hours and was given the recommendation to stop treating them. I start week 8 of flower today so it's way too late to see any positive change. They recommended I give them one last nute solution and then straight water flushes for the last 2-3 feedings.

Edit: Look up root maggot on google images. I'd say these are the culprits and I am SOL... (shit outta luck) but I did find a great read.

http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/AR/archive/sep08/fungus0908.htm


Edit #2 I am also reading that Mosquito Dunks is a safe and effective way to kill gnat larvae or root maggots. The stuff is also safe enough for your pets to drink after the dunks have dissolved in water. On my way to Home Depot!
 
mellokitty

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
eeeeeeeewwwwwww that's it, i'm taking a break from crawlers for a bit.... think i'm going a bit buggy.

jyer: during my image search i found one just for you... *blows kisses*

maggot_fly_small.jpg

...mmmmmm hmmmmmmmmm.... :hump:
 
fumble

fumble

Well-Known Member
hahahahahaha! that is hella funny. Question for you Kitty...if I use hygrozyme, will it counteract the worm shit?
 
Jozikins

Jozikins

Well-Known Member
So upon closer inspection I actually have root aphids, not fungas gnats. Thank you for the tips on how to spot them Mello. Does anyone have any good tips on blasting the little fuckers to hell? From what I've read they are tough little bastards to get rid of.

Great info woodsman, it's good info for everyone. But I am all to aware of how neem and azadirachtin extracts work. I was saying Doctor Doom has knock down power, not neem or azamax. However, if you have any more great info on root aphids and how to wipe them out, I am all ears!

I am thinking about nematodes, but i'm not sure, I want to know before I do a azamax drench, it'll kill em all off.
 
Toolage 87

Toolage 87

Well-Known Member
If your plants aren't in flowering and you want to but its a pain you could wash the soil off the roots and clean the roots make sure to clean the soil very well then get rid of it then get some new clean soil then use that and you might be able to treat for them still in the new soil to make sure you kill them completely.
 
mellokitty

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
Jozikins said:
So upon closer inspection I actually have root aphids, not fungas gnats. Thank you for the tips on how to spot them Mello. Does anyone have any good tips on blasting the little fuckers to hell? From what I've read they are tough little bastards to get rid of.

Great info woodsman, it's good info for everyone. But I am all to aware of how neem and azadirachtin extracts work. I was saying Doctor Doom has knock down power, not neem or azamax. However, if you have any more great info on root aphids and how to wipe them out, I am all ears!

I am thinking about nematodes, but i'm not sure, I want to know before I do a azamax drench, it'll kill em all off.
Click to expand...
well i'm sure glad you got them identified.... fg's thrive in wet, aphids thrive in drought; misidentification can exacerbate conditions. that and root aphids are hardier, more prolific, and do more damage than fg's, which are comparatively benign. when i fought them i was *infested*... my trays looked like dubbzy's, but my plants were relatively unscathed, albeit with a pronounced lack of vigour, but they weren't fucking off and dying or anything. if i remember correctly, they didn't really even yellow... just... stunted. whereas i've heard that unchecked RA's will kill 'em dead. (they're not common here; i hope it stays that way. *desperately knocking wood*)

i wonder why so many people are mis-identifying their bug problem as fg's. (i've spoken with 5 such folks this week, including you guys). (the actual culprits: 3 root aphids, dubbzys root maggots, and one case of fruit flies). oh, and i learned something new, too: fungus gnat = sciarid fly.

personally, if azamax doesn't do it, i'd go with something harder, not softer. (i find neem relatively ineffectual on non-microbes.) nematodes might help but it's really hard to get any outright infestation under control with an invertebrate biological (they can only eat so fast). not to mention they take time which we sometimes don't have. personally i would recommend a powder of some sort, or, if your heart's set on a biological, a microbe of some sort. [organophosphate: spectracide/diazinon; neonicotinoid: sevin (carbaryl); biological: BT (basillus thurengiensis) or maybe cordyceps lecanicillium lecanii] (i don't know much about cordyceps and have never had an opportunity to use them but i find them very very promising). (not to be mistaken with cordyceps sinensis, which is one of the more valued mushrooms in TCM and approved for human ingestion as an immune booster.)

refs: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1389172308700094 (<-- the study where they isolate l. lecanii as an entomopathogenic)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lecanicillium_lecanii (wiki on l. lecanii)

how i discovered cordyceps in the first place, and a basic explanation of how they work (many props to sir david):

[youtube]XuKjBIBBAL8[/youtube]

omg, somebody tell me to stfu, i'm on a pre-w&b ramble again....
edit: warning: viewer discretion advised if insect carcasses give you the heebyjeebies.
 
Beansly

Beansly

RIU Bulldog
mellokitty said:
well i'm sure glad you got them identified.... fg's thrive in wet, aphids thrive in drought; misidentification can exacerbate conditions. that and root aphids are hardier, more prolific, and do more damage than fg's, which are comparatively benign. when i fought them i was *infested*... my trays looked like dubbzy's, but my plants were relatively unscathed, albeit with a pronounced lack of vigour, but they weren't fucking off and dying or anything. if i remember correctly, they didn't really even yellow... just... stunted. whereas i've heard that unchecked RA's will kill 'em dead. (they're not common here; i hope it stays that way. *desperately knocking wood*)

i wonder why so many people are mis-identifying their bug problem as fg's. (i've spoken with 5 such folks this week, including you guys). oh, and i learned something new, too: fungus gnat = sciarid fly.

personally, if azamax doesn't do it, i'd go with something harder, not softer. (i find neem relatively ineffectual on non-microbes.) nematodes might help but it's really hard to get any outright infestation under control with an invertebrate biological (they can only eat so fast). not to mention they take time which we sometimes don't have. personally i would recommend a powder of some sort, or, if your heart's set on a biological, a microbe of some sort. [organophosphate: spectracide/diazinon; neonicotinoid: sevin (carbaryl); biological: BT (basillus thurengiensis) or maybe cordyceps lecanicillium lecanii] (i don't know much about cordyceps and have never had an opportunity to use them but i find them very very promising). (not to be mistaken with cordyceps sinensis, which is one of the more valued mushrooms in TCM and approved for human ingestion as an immune booster.)

refs: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1389172308700094 (<-- the study where they isolate l. lecanii as an entomopathogenic)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lecanicillium_lecanii (wiki on l. lecanii)

how i discovered cordyceps in the first place, and a basic explanation of how they work (many props to sir david):

[youtube]XuKjBIBBAL8[/youtube]

omg, somebody tell me to stfu, i'm on a pre-w&b ramble again....
edit: warning: viewer discretion advised if insect carcasses give you the heebyjeebies.
Click to expand...
Grows weed, sexy and smart. Your the whole package kitty. ;P
 
Dubbz0r

Dubbz0r

Well-Known Member
mellokitty said:
when i fought them i was *infested*... my trays looked like dubbzy's, but my plants were relatively unscathed, albeit with a pronounced lack of vigour, but they weren't fucking off and dying or anything. if i remember correctly, they didn't really even yellow... just... stunted.
Click to expand...
See my plants look ok, minus the first grower deficiencies I've been going through. They may be stunted from something I did or from these little maggot bastards. It's too hard to tell. I am so very thankful that they did not kill my girls though! They would have been laying in the trash next to my body...lol
 
Jozikins

Jozikins

Well-Known Member
mellokitty said:
well i'm sure glad you got them identified.... fg's thrive in wet, aphids thrive in drought; misidentification can exacerbate conditions. that and root aphids are hardier, more prolific, and do more damage than fg's, which are comparatively benign. when i fought them i was *infested*... my trays looked like dubbzy's, but my plants were relatively unscathed, albeit with a pronounced lack of vigour, but they weren't fucking off and dying or anything. if i remember correctly, they didn't really even yellow... just... stunted. whereas i've heard that unchecked RA's will kill 'em dead. (they're not common here; i hope it stays that way. *desperately knocking wood*)

i wonder why so many people are mis-identifying their bug problem as fg's. (i've spoken with 5 such folks this week, including you guys). (the actual culprits: 3 root aphids, dubbzys root maggots, and one case of fruit flies). oh, and i learned something new, too: fungus gnat = sciarid fly.

personally, if azamax doesn't do it, i'd go with something harder, not softer. (i find neem relatively ineffectual on non-microbes.) nematodes might help but it's really hard to get any outright infestation under control with an invertebrate biological (they can only eat so fast). not to mention they take time which we sometimes don't have. personally i would recommend a powder of some sort, or, if your heart's set on a biological, a microbe of some sort. [organophosphate: spectracide/diazinon; neonicotinoid: sevin (carbaryl); biological: BT (basillus thurengiensis) or maybe cordyceps lecanicillium lecanii] (i don't know much about cordyceps and have never had an opportunity to use them but i find them very very promising). (not to be mistaken with cordyceps sinensis, which is one of the more valued mushrooms in TCM and approved for human ingestion as an immune booster.)

refs: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1389172308700094 (<-- the study where they isolate l. lecanii as an entomopathogenic)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lecanicillium_lecanii (wiki on l. lecanii)

how i discovered cordyceps in the first place, and a basic explanation of how they work (many props to sir david):

[youtube]XuKjBIBBAL8[/youtube]

omg, somebody tell me to stfu, i'm on a pre-w&b ramble again....
edit: warning: viewer discretion advised if insect carcasses give you the heebyjeebies.
Click to expand...
Please ramble on Kitty. I like all the shit I'm learning. What powder would you recommend, are you talking like Diatomaceous Earth? I'm down for whatever worked for you. I've spent quite a bit of time building up the life in my soil, but I really don't care if I have to kill it all off if it takes the aphids with it too. I am already using a few different bacterias and BT to fight them off, but I think I need to get down and dirty.

I'm trying to wonder through the links you went through the trouble of posting, but I'm also typing a resume so I'm dabbling in a little of both right now. lol. I hate making a new resume.
 
mellokitty

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
Dubbz0r said:
See my plants look ok, minus the first grower deficiencies I've been going through. They may be stunted from something I did or from these little maggot bastards. It's too hard to tell. I am so very thankful that they did not kill my girls though! They would have been laying in the trash next to my body...lol
Click to expand...
so, slight change of plans and i'm seeing my horticulturalist friend tonight so i'll try to remember to look it up for you (she has great reference books, as you can imagine)....

and as someone who has, in her early days, melted all the trichs (and killed some buds too) off an entire crop by over-EndAlling it, i can say this:
whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger, but whatever kills your plants, makes your grow kungfu stronger. :lol:
 
mellokitty

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
Jozikins said:
Please ramble on Kitty. I like all the shit I'm learning. What powder would you recommend, are you talking like Diatomaceous Earth? I'm down for whatever worked for you. I've spent quite a bit of time building up the life in my soil, but I really don't care if I have to kill it all off if it takes the aphids with it too. I am already using a few different bacterias and BT to fight them off, but I think I need to get down and dirty.

I'm trying to wonder through the links you went through the trouble of posting, but I'm also typing a resume so I'm dabbling in a little of both right now. lol. I hate making a new resume.
Click to expand...
sorry jozi, i was gonna ramble on about neurotoxins for a bit but my day just started without me.... more on that later.
good luck on the job hunt.
 
Jozikins

Jozikins

Well-Known Member
mellokitty said:
sorry jozi, i was gonna ramble on about neurotoxins for a bit but my day just started without me.... more on that later.
good luck on the job hunt.
Click to expand...
Haha, I know that feeling all to well. I hope I get this job, I was up until 3 trying to make that resume sound descent. My old one was crap, I'm surprised nobody laughed at me... at least not to my face. haha.
 
brandon727272

brandon727272

Well-Known Member
Lovin the video kitty! That fungus is crazy, it's amazing how over time natural fungi like that evolve to keep insect population in check.
 
mellokitty

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
wow it's been a crazy week. now let me dig myself out from under the frybread and homemade preserves..... *ooph*

so. neurotoxins. most neurotoxin pesticides seem to work on the cholinesterase pathway (an enzyme necessary for nerve function). HOW they work on said pathway seem to determine their relative toxicities to insect and mammals.

my poison of choice for soil-bornes was diazinon.... until they made it illegal for household use. (if you have it you can still use it but you can't buy it unless you're agricultural)
diazinon is an organophosphate, and my understanding is that organophosphates work by permanently disabling the glands that produce them (cholinesterase). thing is, while organophosphates tend to degrade quickly in water, they work on a neurological pathway common to both insects and mammals so they're toxic (sometimes permanently) to both, as with most chemical pesticides you really want to read up on halflives and keep track of your application times.

onto neonicotinoids.
imidacloprid is a popular neonicotinoid, which, while it works on cholinesterase, it works on a system more prevalent in insects than in mammals so is relatively less toxic to us. Bayer Advanced is imidacloprid.
carbaryl is another neonicotinoid, Sevin is carbaryl. carbaryl was also the substance involved in the Bhopal disaster, but since then (and possibly because of that) they've changed the manufacturing process to be less of an environmental threat (notice i said "less" of a threat, not "harmless").

i've heard that with root aphids you want to give your whole room a good scourge between shows to get completely rid of them (i've heard of people doing a room-spray-down-and rinse with avid); from what i hear it's nigh-on impossible to actually GET RID of them once you have them in flower.... you can only do your best to keep them in check. (someone i know once referred to them as "the motherest, fuckerest, little beasts EVER")..... how far along are you jozi?
 
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