Ant Damage - burrowing into stalk

I've already lost one large plant because of this and I'm just now figuring out why and it may already be too late.

I had 2 large females, the remaining one is about 6foot tall and the base of the stalk is about 3inches. I first noticed about a week ago that one of the plants had a very sudden loss of health, all at once all the leaves drooped as if it has been deprived water or something had poisoned it. Since I had 2 nearly identical plants and had been treating them the same way I was at a loss to explain why one had issues and the other did not.

I tried in vain to help the plant, but after a week it just died. I did an "autopsy" of the dead plant and found what looked like small ants that had burrowed into the stalk about a foot off the ground. I checked my remaining plant yesterday and noticed small ants around the base. This morning I saw the plant had wilted similar to the other one and I could actually seen small holes where the ants had dug into the plant! I have sprayed some Neem oil around the plant and killed some nearby mounds... but I'm afraid the damage has already been done. Somehow this ants have infected the plant such that it causes acute stress to the plant, essentially killing it.

I don't know if there is some way to reverse the damage or otherwise help the plant overcome this. Anyone else encountered this type of situation and/or pest problem? It is a damn shame because the plant is starting to flower and needs another month to finish up.

I have taken some cuttings off the plant that has already died and hope to root them. I guess I can do the same with the one that is suffering now, but it will likely ruin the buds if I am not mistaken. Between the time it will take the plant to grow new roots and actually continue to flower... seems like I'm going to get nothing but aggravation from this situation.

Any advice or feedback would be greatly appreciated.

gosh ggi, few things in growing hurt worse than seeing a big plant go down before it's time - I feel your pain! I've never heard of ants causing this type of damage, but that doesn't mean they weren't the culprit. I wonder if a plastic collar, painted with tanglefoot, around the base for the first coupla feet would help prevent this. you can still take cuttings off the one that's alive but as far as getting anything off of them outdoors this year, hmmm. try to see it as education rather than aggravation.

It is certainly frustrating... especially since this is my 2nd one to go downhill and was my last best hope of getting a decent harvest. As to the culprit being ants... I'm not 100% sure, but all evidence points to it. Perhaps they are burrowing into the stalk for food, maybe even to nest since it is a larger plant. Nothing I can find on the internet has helped me ID the issue and/or pest. I wish I had figure it out sooner, so I might have put in place a safe guard for the 2nd plant.

I've wrapped the bottom of the stalk in plastic and put down a circle of boric acid around the perimeter and some ant bait that should kill off the remaining ants. If I caught it in time the plant might survive?

I'm in the deep south, so I can go as far as late October before harvesting. Still not much of a window at this point... Thanks hoonry

hoonry said:

gosh ggi, few things in growing hurt worse than seeing a big plant go down before it's time - I feel your pain! I've never heard of ants causing this type of damage, but that doesn't mean they weren't the culprit. I wonder if a plastic collar, painted with tanglefoot, around the base for the first coupla feet would help prevent this. you can still take cuttings off the one that's alive but as far as getting anything off of them outdoors this year, hmmm. try to see it as education rather than aggravation.

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2 things that should help in the future.

http://www.contech-inc.com/products/home-and-garden-products/tree-care/tree-tanglefoot-insect-barrier

And

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Safer-Brand-4-lb-Diatomaceous-Earth-Ant-and-Crawling-Insect-Killer-51702/202743025#.Ui4nFX_RLA0

Wish you had come along a bit sooner with your problem b/c I believe these 2 products would have saved your ladies.

I wish I had too... but I didn't realize what was happening, nor how quickly the damage could be done.

I had a very GOOD grow last year and I guess I took it for granted that I would repeat without incident.

Always more to learn and hope for better success in the future. Sadly I am going to suffer for my inaction this time around. Thanks Mr Ganja for the references I will put them in my arsenal.

Sunbiz1 said:

2 things that should help in the future.

http://www.contech-inc.com/products/home-and-garden-products/tree-care/tree-tanglefoot-insect-barrier

And

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Safer-Brand-4-lb-Diatomaceous-Earth-Ant-and-Crawling-Insect-Killer-51702/202743025#.Ui4nFX_RLA0

Wish you had come along a bit sooner with your problem b/c I believe these 2 products would have saved your ladies.

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Could they be termites?

gR33nDav3l0l said:

Could they be termites?

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I don't think they are termites. As I understand it termites will only eat dead wood. This plant was healthy up until the damage happened.

I cannot tell if they are feeding on the plant or burrowing into it for some other reason such as nesting. I don't know if the root system has been damaged as well.

ARGH!!! I am sick about it... my last plant is going to die.

The ants are extremely small, even for ants. About 1/2 the size of a "normal" ant. About the length of a hemp seed. Dark brown/black. I have not been able to ID them further. They are burrowing into the main stalk and this is killing the plant very quickly. If you experience a rapid wilting of your plant that cannot be explained by lack of water check for these pests immediately, especially if you have larger plants with thick stalks. They must like the wood.

Anyone with 2 cents of advice as to my best course of salvage at this point. It is early to harvest, but late to start cuttings. Tough one

I have never done this but read thread about guy vibrating them out. Use an electric back messaging thing. Let it vibrate on low all day long. Then he used some sealer stuff made for plants.

Like I said I have never tried it. But always stayed in the back of my mind. I will try to find the vid and thread. The vid showed how the ants scattered as soon as he turned the vibrator on.

I would try to find the nest. If they are feeding on the plant then follow them back to the nest and kill it.

Also another thought. On that pest commercial the guy claims ants will not cross chalk line. Get some sidewalk chalk and chalk your stalk. You never know right?

Call me crazy I do not care If I had ants I know I would try it.

I've read that ground cinnamon will deter ants. Never tried it myself but it couldn't hurt.

Might also want to stake that plant good. Looks like it may be getting week at the base.

I went out and looked at the plant a couple hours after I had wrapped the base of the stalk in plastic. This was actually after someone suggested that the ants were eating aphids off the stalk... I did not see any aphids. BUT there was a lot more damage to the stalk and I could see where the inside had actually been eaten all the way through... I could see inside the stalk and looking in there I swear it looked like a termite or something similar. So I am not at all sure what the ants MAY or MAY NOT have to do with all this, but something like a termite or grub has burrowed into the live stem of this plant. It was able to do a lot of damage and I'm pretty sure killed the plant. I will have to do some research on this and figure out what I'm dealing with exactly so I can avoid this in the future. Thanks for the replies and advice. I really appreciate it!

I read about a bug called stem borers before that eats the inside of the main stem. Don't know much about them but maybe that's what you're dealing with.

Here is my conclusion based on some research and posts by other gardeners...

The first damage that happened was caused by termites. Termites don't usually eat live plants, but they can apparently cause and/or hasten the demise of a plant by going after the larger roots. As they eat they kill the plant so they can then move up the stalk. The termites don't always eat through to the outside of the plant, so you don't notice... but the ants do and they are taking advantage of the situation. Someone suggested the ants get into the plant to eat and/or nest.

Yeah man termites for sure I had a horrible infestation about 6 weeks ago but I was able to kill them all with ivory soap and water. After a hard battle i won but the ants made there home in the burrowed stalks and were chewing the inner stalks causing weakness and rot. It sucks man I know I lost a total of 10 plants from them little white bastards.

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I kind of blame myself for not catching this sooner. I was also probably watering too much as well, because I was over compensating for the loss of my other plant. The damp ground made the plant that much more vulnerable to the insects.

If by some lucky stroke I have stopped the termites I suppose the plant might find a way to compensate for the damage. However as you can see from the pics it is pretty extensive and deep in the stalk.

Termites... little white bastards indeed!

they are not ants, I actually did some research on them when I found some in my garden I decided to leave them alone, they only problem with ants, they spread pollen, so if your all female your all fine and dandy. ants are aggressive bugs, they eat other bugs from spyder mites, to thirps,, you have a termite, if its in the damn stem, those fuckers, idk what to suggest for them , mabe neem oil spray them very heavy im sure it should work, , neem oil is expose to help prevent every bug,

gR33nDav3l0l said:

Could they be termites?

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Initially I didn't think so, but apparently it is termites. Good call.

Ever think to use a plant seal when you see big feilds of shit and they cut the trees down to nearly nothing and they put shit over the wound to keep from infection think if you did that it would help heal? Jus a thought. Hope everything works out for you!

Urhighness88 said:

Ever think to use a plant seal when you see big feilds of shit and they cut the trees down to nearly nothing and they put shit over the wound to keep from infection think if you did that it would help heal? Jus a thought. Hope everything works out for you!

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Not a bad idea, but at this point there has been too much damage done. Given the size of the plant relative to the damage a plant sealer would be like putting a band-aid on a bullet wound... Thanks though.