Are cobs worth it?

pop22

pop22

Well-Known Member
1.4 from and HPS yea right! 90% of growers using HPS are lucky to get .7/gpw. Show show me a link to these great grows........

And as others here have said, if your not pulling 1.5/gpw from a CXB 3590 based light, And I see a lot of guys here doing it, using a correct size light for the growspace, they need to go back to Growing 101........
80% of grow issues are user caused..

or maybe your green and scalely and live under a bridge...

rshackleferd said:
I've read about growers using the best cobs available "cxb3590" and ending up with mediocre harvest. For example there is a professional grower on youtube that has a 1480 watt cob system in which he only achieved 850 grams of dried bud. I heard the claim of extra trichomes and etc outweigh the cons which is baloney especially when you fork over a few thousand and end up with less than a gram per watt. Ive seen $50 250 watt hid system achieve 1.4+ grams per watt. So why should I or anyone invest over $800 or more for a system that could take up to 3 years to break even if heat isn't a factor. Another factor to consider is the depreciating value of those cobs. By the time you break even those same cobs you bought are now worth less than half for what you paid for them. Where are the advantages? Where are these outstanding grow reports/journals using cobs?, Ive seen them with other types of leds 1,3,5 watts but not cobs.
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rshackleferd

rshackleferd

Well-Known Member
pop22 said:
1.4 from and HPS yea right! 90% of growers using HPS are lucky to get .7/gpw. Show show me a link to these great grows........

And as others here have said, if your not pulling 1.5/gpw from a CXB 3590 based light, And I see a lot of guys here doing it, using a correct size light for the growspace, they need to go back to Growing 101........
80% of grow issues are user caused..

or maybe your green and scalely and live under a bridge...
Click to expand...
Did you see the vid i posted? This was no idiot and he ended up with 1.1 grams per watt. Why go with cobs when they are so expensive? What are the advantages? Is it to save money? This would take three or more years, not worth it especially for my situation. I would need heaters in the winter to get temps averaging around 85F, this would be no problem with hids. Everyone talks about grams per watt but what concerns me is maximum yield for a 3x3 room and this is where mh/hps combo win. "The output of the LED must exceed 145 l/w at 80%ppf (lumen measurements include 700-1500nm light).. LED tech has only just met that goal a few years a go. Patents and false scarcity causes the +150 l/w led to cost $5/w when a good HPS equivalent is $0.30-0.60/w."
 
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Yodaweed

Yodaweed

Well-Known Member
HPS/MH combo makes better buds than COBs, due to the lack of spectrum in the IR/UV region of the COBs. Addition supplementation is the only way to get the same quality as HID tech with these COBs.
 
Airwalker16

Airwalker16

Well-Known Member
rshackleferd said:
Did you see the vid i posted? This was no idiot and he ended up with 1.1 grams per watt. Why go with cobs when they are so expensive? What are the advantages? Is it to save money? This would take three or more years, not worth it especially for my situation. I would need heaters in the winter to get temps averaging around 85F, this would be no problem with hids. Everyone talks about grams per watt but what concerns me is maximum yield for a 3x3 room and this is where mh/hps combo win. "The output of the LED must exceed 145 l/w at 80%ppf (lumen measurements include 700-1500nm light).. LED tech has only just met that goal a few years a go. Patents and false scarcity causes the +150 l/w led to cost $5/w when a good HPS equivalent is $0.30-0.60/w."
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Again, because they KICK ASS and because WE CAN afford them. YOU CAN'T obviously.
 
MeJuana

MeJuana

Well-Known Member
Anyone know of a Light Emitting Diode grow on youtube with a low yielder like SFV OG Kush? Or my current favorite The White. Something extremely hard to please?
 
B

Bill Lidgate

Active Member
Another good value LED apart from small high wattage COBS are the (getting better) LED based fluorescent tube replacements.

Like the Luceco LED Fluorescent Replacement Tube - 4 FT - 24 Watt - 2400 Lumens, available at EarthLED and a few other places
https://www.earthled.com/products/luceco-led-fluorescent-replacement-tube-4-ft-24-watt-2400-lumens-ballast-bypass-direct-wire?variant=2403570948
I'm writing this under the light of one, very nice color (CRI 80) and cheap with free shipping.
They require NO POWER SUPPLY, you simply bypass your fluorescent fixtures ballast and they run on "120-277 VAC (UL RATED TO 250VAC ONLY)"

The one I'm under was faulty and I took it apart and made a desk lamp out of it, inside its an aluminum strip (0.35" x 46") with ~0.3W SMD LEDs every 13mm, with a tiny cheap power supply that uses a dodgy EL cap that can fail (I replaced it)

I took the strip out of the plastic tube and glued it directly to a 1/8" x 2" piece of 6061 and it barely gets warm. In their sealed tube they should be pretty tough but EarthLED sent a couple orders not in mailing tubes and when UPS bent them they DIE (they resent 2x times with no return!)

The price at volumes is as follows from EarthLED:
Luceco 48 " 2400 Lm 24 W
1 to 24 $10.99ea Lm/$=218 W/$= 2.18
25 to 99 $10.50ea Lm/$=229 W/$= 2.29
100+ $9.99ea Lm/$=240 W/$= 2.40

with slightly better PS components these could be the best value in LEDS.

 
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klx

klx

Well-Known Member
Yodaweed said:
HPS/MH combo makes better buds than COBs, due to the lack of spectrum in the IR/UV region of the COBs. Addition supplementation is the only way to get the same quality as HID tech with these COBs.
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Covering a bunch of CFLs with red cellophane makes better buds than HPS/MH combo because Christmas.
 
Trippyness

Trippyness

Well-Known Member
Go for cheaper options on COBs like the Citizen.
Reason COB yields so much better is because of spread. In a 5 x 5 say running 1 cob a sqf at .7ma or even at 1.4a gives every plant even coverage. Hps does not. Alot of advantages to CoB over say DE. However if your set on hps go DE. Look at cheaper options for COB. The extra yield pays for itself. Its not all about less power. Its about increased yield as thats what makes the $$ and makes CoBS worth it.
 
Trippyness

Trippyness

Well-Known Member
Example.
Say a good HPS grower gets 1GPW in a 5 x 5 with 1,000 Grams or 2.2 LBS.
In my market 2,200 per LB. so lets just say 4,400 with HPS.
Now say the same room same genetics but 1,000w of COB pull 1.5 gpw which is 3.31 LBS. which is 1.1 LBS more PER HARVEST.
So an extra 2,200 where I am with same wattage. Pyas for itself.
Or 625w in a 5 x 5 at 1 COB per sqf at .7 at 1.5gpw would be 937.5 or 2 LBS. leas wattage basically the same yield. I know guys pulling 1.8-2+gpw with COB with commercial strains. So pony up and get a COB light.
So if your running 4 grows a year at 3 months start to fibish each harvest. Thats 4 extra LBS a year or $8,800. COBs pay for themselves. Rant done.
 
J

JungleTime

Well-Known Member
Now let me come from a different perspective other than gpw. What about the heat and also the amount of electricity used?

To properly light up a 4x8 tray you need 2; 1,000 watt lights or 1,000-1200 watts of leds. We'll go with 1,000 watts of led to make the math work out a lil better.

Hps = 1000w being 35% efficient
Heat = 650w of heat energy
750w x 2 = 1300w of heat energy.

Led = 1000w being 56% efficient
Heat = 440w of heat energy

Air cooled lights generally remove half the heat that is produced, unless of course you have multiple 1000's on the same inline fan.

So.. final numbers.
Air cooled Hps = 1300w / 2 = 750w of heat energy
Led = 440w of heat energy

So you can see we save on 32% on heat moving to led.

Now talking about photon output...
Hps
1; 1,000w Hps = 35% efficent which is 350 watts for photons
2; 1,000w Hps = 350w x 2 = 700w for photons
Led
1; 1,000w of led's = 560w for photon output.

The small difference of 140w is EASILY disregarded as the glass takes at least 10% of the light output.
Hps = 700w x .10(glass absorption) = 70w

Final Numbers for photon output
Hps
2; 1,000w Hps = 700w - 70w = 630w for photon output
Led
1; 1,000w of led's = 560w for photon output.

The hps focuses the light straight down so your wasting light in the middle. The plant doesnt need such strong light. At a point the plant cant do anything with the strong light due to limiting factors like co2 or even feed/genetics etc. Long story short your wasting a dick ton of light in the middle.

Led will allow you to achieve basically the same photon output with a EVEN SPREAD while saving 32% heat WHILE cutting your bill in half. If you grow.. then you know you'll pull some weight. The even spread is why I find led's worth it. Your not wasting any light and the quality is dam good.

Most average growers get about a pound a light which is about .5 GPW, if you keep the same amount of light and spread it out evenly? Fuck outta here thats how led growers get 1 GPW to 2 GPW.

Nearly costs $2,000 for a 1,000w led set up but if your in the money? Get it, it'll pay for itself in your cooling costs, hps bulb replacement cost, and electricity used. Its worth it if you can shell out the big bucks.
 
Trippyness

Trippyness

Well-Known Member
JungleTime said:
Now let me come from a different perspective other than gpw. What about the heat and also the amount of electricity used?

To properly light up a 4x8 tray you need 2; 1,000 watt lights or 1,000-1200 watts of leds. We'll go with 1,000 watts of led to make the math work out a lil better.

Hps = 1000w being 35% efficient
Heat = 650w of heat energy
750w x 2 = 1300w of heat energy.

Led = 1000w being 56% efficient
Heat = 440w of heat energy

Air cooled lights generally remove half the heat that is produced, unless of course you have multiple 1000's on the same inline fan.

So.. final numbers.
Air cooled Hps = 1300w / 2 = 750w of heat energy
Led = 440w of heat energy

So you can see we save on 32% on heat moving to led.

Now talking about photon output...
Hps
1; 1,000w Hps = 35% efficent which is 350 watts for photons
2; 1,000w Hps = 350w x 2 = 700w for photons
Led
1; 1,000w of led's = 560w for photon output.

The small difference of 140w is EASILY disregarded as the glass takes at least 10% of the light output.
Hps = 700w x .10(glass absorption) = 70w

Final Numbers for photon output
Hps
2; 1,000w Hps = 700w - 70w = 630w for photon output
Led
1; 1,000w of led's = 560w for photon output.

The hps focuses the light straight down so your wasting light in the middle. The plant doesnt need such strong light. At a point the plant cant do anything with the strong light due to limiting factors like co2 or even feed/genetics etc. Long story short your wasting a dick ton of light in the middle.

Led will allow you to achieve basically the same photon output with a EVEN SPREAD while saving 32% heat WHILE cutting your bill in half. If you grow.. then you know you'll pull some weight. The even spread is why I find led's worth it. Your not wasting any light and the quality is dam good.

Most average growers get about a pound a light which is about .5 GPW, if you keep the same amount of light and spread it out evenly? Fuck outta here thats how led growers get 1 GPW to 2 GPW.

Nearly costs $2,000 for a 1,000w led set up but if your in the money? Get it, it'll pay for itself in your cooling costs, hps bulb replacement cost, and electricity used. Its worth it if you can shell out the big bucks.
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Worded great. The photon part was great as well. HPS is gone. Once COBS come down more and more it will be come standard.
 
a mongo frog

a mongo frog

Well-Known Member
JorgeGonzales said:
HID is going the way of the horse and buggy, film and typewriters. Maybe vinyl records if it's lucky, but I bet incandescents will be the new vinyl.

I mean that's a true fact. The war is over.
Click to expand...
Show us your bud shots please. Would love to see what your working with.
 
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