Attempt at making Lowryder2 seeds

Hey all,

I have already started this grow and am currently about 4 weeks in. Got 10 LR2 seeds from attitude seekbank a little over 2 months ago. I also have 10 autoblueberry x AK47, along with a buch of g13 lab fem seeds.

Goal: Isolate one male and one female plant. Pollinate the female to produce as many seeds as possible. Long term, looking to do a modified sea of green grow using autoflowering plants (hence why i need seeds instead of clones...can't clone the autos).

System: It's like an 11 liter DIY bubbleponic system. Got an air stone in there running 24/7. Base of the tote is covered with duct tape to keep as much light out as possible. I cut out only 2 holes in the top of the system as I will really only be using this for the purpose of breeding (i have a couple of other systems waiting to be used for the bigger grows).

Lighting: Currently using my aerogarden hood lamp and a couple of cfl's (i forget the exact wattage but they're minimum of 42watts as I remember)(one high kelvin and the other low kelvin). I also have a 150w HPS to use but this light is currently finishing up another grow of mine. I will be throwing these lr2's under the hps when I finish with my other grow (listed under the aerogardeners thread).

Nutes: Fox Farm hydro series. I still have a ton of ?s about the feeding schedule for these autoflowerers since they are far from the typical seed-->veg-->flower cycle. I just started to add nutes at week #3, and used a small mix of the Hydro Grow Big and Big Bloom. I imagine these lr2's don't need many nutes in the early going (or even throughout the entire grow given their size). I also have a good amount of 3% hydrogen peroxide (h2o2) to add to the rez during each feeding.

Other Material: Digital pH and PPM meter (cheap ones though). General Hydroponics ph up and down.

Grow Medium: Hydro; 2" net cups, hydroton rocks, rockwool cubes.

Space: Right now, they're in a spare bedroom of mine. The set up will eventually be moved to either my closet (where my current grow is finishing) or my basement (which may give me more relief in terms of odor control).

The pics included were taken earlier in the week. I had some serious difficulties getting seeds to sprout up and was eventually able to create a poor mans humidity dome that finally worked. The 1st plant I put in the system about 4 weeks ago. He's definately a male and I'm more than fine with that given what I'm trying to do here. The 2nd plant (no pics yet) just went into the system today and is only a couple of cm's tall right now. Took a full week in the humidity dome to finally sprout up. PROBLEM...there is now 4 full weeks of seperation in growth between these two. This obviously complicates the grow given that they will require 2 different concentrations of nutrients throughout the entire grow. I'm not sure what I'm going to do about this just yet or just how keeping them in the same rez will affect the grow but I'm working on it. There maturities will also be quite different as well. I plan on collecting the pollen from the male in a small glass jar and will probably use a tiny paint brush to pollinate the female bud sites.

The only other problem I have encountered so far is some spreading discoloration in the male plant that is 4 weeks old. My guess is that this is due to ph issues. I re-ph to 5.5-5.8 once each day. When I check the rez at the end of each day, the ph tends to be well over 6, hence the discoloration (brownish yellow spots to be exact). Not sure how I'm going to get around this. I'll probably ph it twice per day (once in the morning, once at night) to get greater stability.

All comments, questions, and suggestions are welcome

I'm pretty much doing the same thing as you, but without so much emphasis on seeds. I'm only gonna seed a branch or two of a female auto ak.

If you need help with seeding, check out fdd2blk's tutorial HERE.

Let me know if you find any information on nutes for autos. I'm trying to figure out the same shit.

Anyways, good luck with your grow, man. Check mine out.

4204l1f3 said:

I'm pretty much doing the same thing as you, but without so much emphasis on seeds. I'm only gonna seed a branch or two of a female auto ak.

If you need help with seeding, check out fdd2blk's tutorial HERE.

Let me know if you find any information on nutes for autos. I'm trying to figure out the same shit.

Anyways, good luck with your grow, man. Check mine out.

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Thanks for the link. Hadn't seen that before. Just checked your journal too. Get ready for some heavy odor man. I've heard that these things put off some serious stank during the grow. Mine is only about 2 inches tall and I can already smell it. I've got the Ona Gel ready to go for when it gets real bad. Hope it works.

(Butters) said:

Thanks for the link. Hadn't seen that before. Just checked your journal too. Get ready for some heavy odor man. I've heard that these things put off some serious stank during the grow. Mine is only about 2 inches tall and I can already smell it. I've got the Ona Gel ready to go for when it gets real bad. Hope it works.

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Yeah, I'm building an ONA/SoilMoist fan for the odor. Our house constantly smells like herb anyway. We smoke too much.

Rough day today. I came home, checked the rez to take it's pH, and found a shitload of algae. The roots were completely covered. I dipped the roots into a small cup of h2o2 and it cleaned right off. I changed the rez, added nutes (again), ph'd and duct taped the crap outta the system. I'm not really sure where the light was getting in so I just taped everything. I will definately be getting my rear to the hydro store to get some hygrozyme (apparantly this prevents algae from forming )

Fortunately, the only plant in their roots has essentially done what it was grown to do...create pollen sacs. There's a bunch already so I plan on reading up tonight to learn of the best ways to get pollen from them. I've seen people cut the sacs off and store them in airtight bags for a couple of months top but I've also seen people extract the pollen right from the sacs when they are still on the plant. I can't get over this strain. It's like they don't even need nutes. Still having ph issues and I'm not entirely sure why. I'm wondering if I ph'd distilled water to 5.5 and just let it sit would the ph change. Twice a day is a bit much for my ph'ing preferences and I'm lost on what could be causing it to consistently increase day to day...especially when my ppm doesn't budge, meaning that it's really not using much nutes.

The other little tiny sprout has barely grown, if at all, and I'm getting worried that I may need to put it back in the humidity dome...Sounds like a cheap Mel Gibson knock off movie huh (Beyond Humidity Dome)..."Two sprouts enter, one sprout leave". With any luck, I can try to get a small dome-like item on top of the plant while it's in the set up. Pic updates coming soon.

(Butters) said:

Rough day today. I came home, checked the rez to take it's pH, and found a shitload of algae. The roots were completely covered. I dipped the roots into a small cup of h2o2 and it cleaned right off. I changed the rez, added nutes (again), ph'd and duct taped the crap outta the system. I'm not really sure where the light was getting in so I just taped everything. I will definately be getting my rear to the hydro store to get some hygrozyme (apparantly this prevents algae from forming )

Fortunately, the only plant in their roots has essentially done what it was grown to do...create pollen sacs. There's a bunch already so I plan on reading up tonight to learn of the best ways to get pollen from them. I've seen people cut the sacs off and store them in airtight bags for a couple of months top but I've also seen people extract the pollen right from the sacs when they are still on the plant. I can't get over this strain. It's like they don't even need nutes. Still having ph issues and I'm not entirely sure why. I'm wondering if I ph'd distilled water to 5.5 and just let it sit would the ph change. Twice a day is a bit much for my ph'ing preferences and I'm lost on what could be causing it to consistently increase day to day...especially when my ppm doesn't budge, meaning that it's really not using much nutes.

The other little tiny sprout has barely grown, if at all, and I'm getting worried that I may need to put it back in the humidity dome...Sounds like a cheap Mel Gibson knock off movie huh (Beyond Humidity Dome)..."Two sprouts enter, one sprout leave". With any luck, I can try to get a small dome-like item on top of the plant while it's in the set up. Pic updates coming soon.

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Hey man, at least the Hydrogen Peroxide helped ya out. Good luck with your breeding, man. Can't wait to see pics since we have almost the same setup, lol.

Rez check today and it looked pretty good. Some algae build up but not too much. I added h2o2 once this morning and once in the afternoon to help. Seems to be working. Trying to find time to get to the hydro shop before it closes someday soon so I can get hydrozyme and be done with this issue. The ph was exactly where I left it this morning and the previous night. Thank god for that! I get so sick of adding ph up/down until it's in the 5.5-6.0 range. Total pain in the ass. Been working on the closet design for when I go SOG with these babies. It's probably consist of a humidity dome, 3 small bubbleponic units, and the lighting I already have (150 hps, aerogarden hoodlight, crapload of varied cfls high and low spectrum). Every 2 weeks, they move to a new bin until harvest. Downside is that I'll have to do away with 1/2 of the plants as they'll be male. I'll probably keep a close eye on the males to see if any of them look real strong so I can just use their pollen again. In retrospect, I really didn't need the male and female to co-exist at the same time. Just grow the male, get the pollen in a plastic baggy, then fertilize whatever female looks best. That's pretty much where I'm at now anyway. My sprout that I put in the system is still just a tiny sprout and hasn't seemed to grow in the slightest since I put it in the bubbleponic system. If I don't see more growth by tomorrow, I'll put it back in the humidity dome and see if that helps it. Pics coming soon.

(Butters) said:

My sprout that I put in the system is still just a tiny sprout and hasn't seemed to grow in the slightest since I put it in the bubbleponic system. If I don't see more growth by tomorrow, I'll put it back in the humidity dome and see if that helps it. Pics coming soon.

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Don't do that, man. In all plants, the seedling stage takes the longest.

Pic 1) Another pic of the general setup. This is of course temporary until I finish my first grow (just a couple days away )

Pic 2) Here's the 4.5 week old male. When I came home this afternoon, I noticed that one of his pollen sacs had opened up . Given this, I wrapped a plastic baggy around him to catch any pollen that may fall off. The mother load of pollen will most likely come from the top of the cola and those sacs are still forming and maturing so I didn't want to cut him down just yet. Once they mature and look more ready, I'll cut'm down, put'm in an unsealed plastic bag and watch the sacs open and release their pollen (which will be conveniently caught by the baggy).

Pic 3) Here's the baby. Well, no exactly a baby. It was in the humidity dome for a full week, and has now been in the system for about 5 days. Real, real tiny still so I'm worried. I took 420's advice and didn't put it back in the h-dome. Instead (as you can see) I made a compromise and just used a clear plastic cup to act as a h-dome while it's still in the dwc. Hopefully this'll work cause I'm running low on seeds.

The algae is still there but nearly as bad as it was on Monday. Just got the hygrozyme today. Stuff is expensive as hell. Word is that it works for preventing algae buildup and a bunch of other stuff that increases yield as well. Ph has been more stable this week. PPM doesn't budge and has yet to decrease. The male really doesn't seem to even need nutes. I'm curious to see how the females utilize nutrients. With little need for nutes, this could be a very cheap strain to grow. That being said, I much prefer to see the ppm lower and know that the plant is soaking up nutes and using it to produce lots of yummy thc and buds. Provided the seedling is a female and starts to pick up "her" growth, I should be able to pollinate in a couple of weeks and get this party started.

Good luck with that sprout, man. I've got a troublemaker myself.

scribed man.

onthedl0008 said:

scribed man.

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Thanks onthedl.

Well, my male had quite the growth spurt over the last 48 hours and looks fully developed (no pics cause my camera is dead right now and I can't find the charger). So, I got a big ziplock freezebag, cut'm down, and put him in the bag (leaving the bag open of course). Should be able to collect the pollen in the next couple of days.

More good news as well. The struggling sprout is looking much better now. And just in time as it's the lone plant in the system right now...for now.

I put 6 more seeds in to germinate that I have my male outta the way. Of course I'll get more males in this grow as they are not fem'd seeds but I'll just cut them down and collect more pollen as the growing goes on. I have a new, larger dwc to put these 6 in. Once they sprout, I'll put them in ph-dipped rockwool and put them in the humidity dome. From there, they'll go in the dwc and go under a mix of the hps and cfl lighting at 18/6. With the other plant already stunted, they will catch up in size and nutritional requirements pretty quickly. Strongest looking female gets the pollen.

Hopefully I'll get the camera charged for pics in the next few days.

Cool man. Sounds like things are going as planned.

(Butters) said:

The struggling sprout is looking much better now. And just in time as it's the lone plant in the system right now...for now.

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Teach me your ways!!! Haha, good shit, man... hey, and good luck with your male. I'm runnin that same gameplan. Good luck, bro. Can't wait to see pics!

Okay. So, my slow grower is now about 3 weeks old from the first sign of a taproot. It is less than an inch tall
In fairness, ever since I cut the male down, I haven't touched the rez there. I finally changed it today. The ph was over 7 and there was algae everywhere. I wasn't too concerned about this as it's roots haven't even gotten through the rockwool. Of course, the water is splashing up to the rockwool so the ph clearly needs to be in the correct range for it to do what it needs to do. My current concern is now the rockwool that it's in. By now, I would have (at the very least) expected the roots to have navigated through the rockwool. So, my new thinking is that I have to somehow change the rockwool that this runt is in. Not exactly sure how I'm going to do this just yet, but 1st I'm going to give it 2 more days with the newly ph'd water (which I will be staying on top of) to see if it gets going. The strange thing is, aside from the fact that it's a 3 week old sprout, it looks like a perfectly normal sprout. No signs of drying, or yellowing at all. And I do see some progress in the painfully slow unfolding of leaves as well. But, this is the slowest god damn plant I have ever seen . This particular autoflowering plant is gonna be like 150 days from seed to harvest at this rate. I know once those roots can get through, the game changes and the growth gets to explode (like it did with my male).

And to add further insult to injury, the male plant that I chopped stil isn't dry and the pollen sacs haven't opened . I read countless tutorials of folks explaining that once you chop it, just put the top part (or part with the pollen sacs) into an opened plastic bag and in just a couple of days, you'll see white powdery pollen. BULLSHIT. I move it to a dryer room and still nothing. This thing holds moisture like that Shamwow thing I see on those infomercials.

Out of the 5 seeds that I put in to germ this past weekend, 3 have made it into the humidor and rockwool. 1 of these was a pretty much hopeless attempt as the seed itself was cracked before the germ and it germed all screwed up. 1 looks very promising and is already a sprout but I'm in no rush to move it into the dwc until it gets a little bigger or I start to see some roots comin outta that rockwool. The other one I just put in yesterday and looks pretty typical (no good or bad signs yet). I still have 2 seeds germing. They both barely have a taproot coming out so I'm letting that get a little bigger. Seeing as how I put them in to germ on Sunday and they're still working on gettin that tap root out all the way, I'm not too optimistic. And that's it. I'm all outta lr2 seeds! At this point, I'm praying that at least 2 outta the 3 seeds I got in the germ station will be valid and become actual plants. As long as I can get some roots outta their rockwools, the rest is smooth sailing for me (at least smoother). I'm also gonna move the set up to my closet this weekend. This is where I just finished my 1st grow succesfully and it's very easy to control conditions in that space.

Keep your fingers crossed for me all. I'm due for some gl (...I am a poker player and know full well that lady luck just hates your guts for long periods sometimes). Keep growing all.

Okay. So today I looked at the runt and decided it was time to change rockwool cubes. So I gently pulled out the little runt and inspected him/her. Actually looks pretty normal. Has some real root development in there and basically just looks like it's one week old. There is some yellowing at the tips of the leaves now so I'm a little concerned but this really could be due to any number of reasons. In touching the bottom of the rockwool that it was in, it felt really cold coming out of the system. Obviously this would stunt the hell outta the growth. So, tomorrow I need to move it all to the closet. There, I can get the ambient and rez temp up there (stable) no problem.

My h-dome germinated seeds still pretty much look the same. Since they are in the same room, I am questioning the temperature issue as well. The digital temp reader I have lists the temp at about 73, but that's directly under the aerogarden hood lights. Given this, the h-dome will also have to go into the closet as well to get temps up and constant. Busy day tomorrow. I'll post pics of the new set up once it's done.

Oh yeah, the 2 germing seeds, that I left in that same room using the p-towel method, don't look like they're doing anything. The taproots that were there the other day, have now receded back into the seed shell. I have already put them in a warmer place and hopefully they can do something.

Okay. So the great move has officially happened. Pic 1 is the new set up in the closet that treated me so well for my 1st grow. It can fit 3 tubs, which I will be using for the SOG if I can just get one female to make it. On the left is the AG hood light, for the early growth. The hanging light on the right is the 150w hps that I'll use once I start to see preflowers. Above, you can see the ghetto humidity dome with a 6500K light bulb above that (pics 3 and 4 show the current cubes in there...nothing looks too promising yet).

Pic 2 shows the stunted plant. Since it's move to the rockwool, it's gotten a little bigger but also more yellow. Ph'd the water today and added just a smidge of veg nute to try and accelerate growth a little.

Ambient temp in the room is about 82. Starting humidity was only about 30 but I just started the humidfier to get that up.

On the brightside, I checked my male that I cut down and put in a plastic bag and I FINALLY got some pollen. Not much at all and it looks like only a few of the pollen sacks released their stuff so far. I took the pollen that was released and stored it in one of those black camera film cases then put that in the freezer to store it.

So, here's the dilemma. The pics basically show all that i am working with in terms of plants here. That's one stunted plant already in the system that may or may not make it at this point. And three in rockwool under the h-dome. Not sure if you can see from the pic but the one in there that looked promising at first is now brown and real ugly looking. I think it had issues getting it's shell off. So it's probably only like 25% to make it. Out of the 2 rockwool cubes that are left, I already know 1 is a dud (it's the one where the seed was already cracked on the side and all f'd up). So that leaves 1 in rockwool that's up for grabs. No sign of it losing its shell yet and sprouting but I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Since I have some valid pollen, I simply need at least 1 female. If non of these make it or if the ones that do are male, I'll lr2 pollen but nothing to pollinate (no seeds left).

See the problem? I do have 10 autoblueberry x AK47 seeds though. Two problems arise here:

1) I'm accepting the fact that I suck with autoflowering strains at this point. There is no evidence to suggest that I'll have any better results with these 10 seeds than I did with the 10 lr2 seeds.

2) I don't know how the f to do a cross like this. Do I grow an auto BBxAK male, collect pollen, and pollenate a female auto BBxAK? Will the genetics be stable this way or will I get a good percentage that aren't autoflowering? I'm gonna have to do some research on this and see what's up.

If all fails with this seed making attempt, I'm tempted to go back to using bagseed to get more practice in. But that's a 3 month grow and about a 2 month cure. I do have some of the free fem'd seeds from g13 labs (varieties of skunk and pure gold). Managing the closet temps is much easier with the 12/12 cycle than the 18/6 for the autos. Not sure what I'm going to do yet but I'm not exactly giving up on the lowryders just yet. Oh yeah...and every website I see lists lr2 grow difficulty as "Easy"......I must be retarded! Rockwool has not been a kind growing medium to me so far.

I started with 3 LRD's and 2 were male and 1 female. All 3 sprouted very easy in paper towels and went to rockwool in a humidity dome until they 3 were an inch tall at which time the root was showing thru the rockwool.
All 3 grew rapidly and evenly and the males shows sex at 3 weeks and the females at 4 weeks. I cut the males immediately and cannabuttered them.

The lone female is shown below at 11 weeks from seed germ.
Not sure why it's taken so long since it is supposed to be finished at 8 to 9 weeks from germ. Maybe because it's been on 12\12 from seed as it's in the same growing space as another already flowering female is in.
Growth has been fast and steady and prolly will be done in another 2 weeks.
I am also planning on a grow for seed on my next grow of these. There so easy to grow and yeah seem to take any mix of ferts I give em and seem happy with it.

So that's what they look like when the get past the germination phase (lol). Glad to hear that they can tolerate the 12/12 cycle but just take longer. Your female looks incredible! Well done.