Biden Shanked The Progs

hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
I apologize for using “Russia” as an umbrella; I confess I wanted to keep it simple
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I do that all the time too. That was why I started just saying Trump trolls (foreign and domestic) I don't really even distinguish them from the trolls that were 'for' Bernie. It's all smoke and mirrors designed to divide us up and in the internet nationality really stops mattering since people can live anywhere.

Bagginski said:
At the same time, whether it was explicitly Russian policy to “support” Sanders, there were many cooks involved in the toxic stew being dished out at the time, and which cook dished which ladle of misinformation is slightly less important (to me) than the toxicity and the ubiquity.
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Fair enough.

Bagginski said:
I have great respect for your research, and I’ve learned considerable from your posts, so I take you statement of Russian support for Sanders as stated...
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Thanks man, it is pretty self serving, because I don't ever want to be blindsided by this kind of attack again, but I am very happy others benefit from it, which is why I came back to this site to at least scream it out into the void. It is nice to think it has helped some see it.

Bagginski said:
in which case, their ‘support’ was weak sauce indeed.
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I would look at the larger picture, all the attacks on propaganda websites like 'the Hill' or 'the Nation', youtube videos that are funded by the Russian military, Facebook accounts pushing the messaging, accounts across the internet on forums like this where left-trolls attack anything 'establishment'.

I would put it on the trolling that caused the vast majority of bad blood between people who determine themselves in one camp or another.
Bagginski said:
If it did more than underscore the idea that Sanders is “really a communist’ in the wrong-wing ‘mind’, I’ve yet to see it. The deliberate division sown between HRC supporters and Sanders supporters is still obvious, still toxic, still furious, whoever is due “credit” for it. The wedge driven between the two camps will not be removed within the political lifetimes of Sanders or Clinton: the core of it is that Sanders embraced the “Bernie bros”, voted for Trump, and savaged Clinton throughout the campaign; that Sanders and his supporters are indifferent at best toward women, racial and ethnic minorities - and hostile toward them at best.
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This is where we diverge. I would point to all that toxicity is the trolling touch that is constant until it creates something that is not there because that is how the human brain works.


When people who are in whatever camp are constantly attacked when they show support, it tricks them into thinking that it is other people doing it, when it is almost all trolls pushing these narratives that people pick up and that is when it becomes reality.

I would point to the fluid nature of the personalized attacks that can be automated. Whatever it is that people will be most likely to fall for is what they end up being spammed with. And that creates the illusion of their agendas being that different. And as those illusions harden, bubbles get formed and people radicalize (my word, might not be totally accurate) themselves into their camps. And as they see those trolls arguments over and over again, and the same troll pushing the narrative they want to harden, that person is essentially learning a 'script' to use if they encounter someone in the real world. Which thanks to entities like Facebook, is hightly predictable, and therefore easy to program arguments when they do.

Bagginski said:
Even the most extreme “Bernie bro” of my acquaintance is strong in support of women’s issues and women candidates - strong in support for minority issues, the welfare of minority communities, and both candidates of color and organizers of color, strong in opposition to Trump during and after the election: they feel stabbed, dry-gulched, attacked and betrayed for having been moved by Sanders in the first place, treated as scapegoats and sacrificial victims for HRC’s loss and Trump’s win. They don’t appreciate it, they resent it...but no amount of letting it go and attempting to bridge the gap to HRC’s crew has lessened the hostility - or the sense of futility in even trying.
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I agree with all this. I also believe that these feelings are perpetuated via social media and clickbait programming.

Bagginski said:
So, not a Russian operation, but very much in kind with what they *and others* were doing, and with deep and lasting wounds, as we’re seeing begin to play out between the progressive Dems and the professional Dems.
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This is what I disagree with. I think that it is more just noise designed to keep us all apart as much as possible. Things like saying 'professional Dems' is where I think you might (no disrespect, Ill explain in this next video) be falling into the propaganda trap. Democrats don't need to be qualified as 'professional' or 'establishment', they are just Democrats, and people who label themselves as something different get programmed into the branding that is only there to divide us up.

Humanity was not ready for the internet. Our brains are easily tricked and no matter how well you understand this doesn't make you immune to it. Just like in the video above, when our brains are programmed to fall into believing something that is not real, it sticks.
 
Bagginski

Bagginski

Well-Known Member
hanimmal said:
I do that all the time too. That was why I started just saying Trump trolls (foreign and domestic) I don't really even distinguish them from the trolls that were 'for' Bernie. It's all smoke and mirrors designed to divide us up and in the internet nationality really stops mattering since people can live anywhere.


Fair enough.


Thanks man, it is pretty self serving, because I don't ever want to be blindsided by this kind of attack again, but I am very happy others benefit from it, which is why I came back to this site to at least scream it out into the void. It is nice to think it has helped some see it.


I would look at the larger picture, all the attacks on propaganda websites like 'the Hill' or 'the Nation', youtube videos that are funded by the Russian military, Facebook accounts pushing the messaging, accounts across the internet on forums like this where left-trolls attack anything 'establishment'.

I would put it on the trolling that caused the vast majority of bad blood between people who determine themselves in one camp or another.

This is where we diverge. I would point to all that toxicity is the trolling touch that is constant until it creates something that is not there because that is how the human brain works.


When people who are in whatever camp are constantly attacked when they show support, it tricks them into thinking that it is other people doing it, when it is almost all trolls pushing these narratives that people pick up and that is when it becomes reality.

I would point to the fluid nature of the personalized attacks that can be automated. Whatever it is that people will be most likely to fall for is what they end up being spammed with. And that creates the illusion of their agendas being that different. And as those illusions harden, bubbles get formed and people radicalize (my word, might not be totally accurate) themselves into their camps. And as they see those trolls arguments over and over again, and the same troll pushing the narrative they want to harden, that person is essentially learning a 'script' to use if they encounter someone in the real world. Which thanks to entities like Facebook, is hightly predictable, and therefore easy to program arguments when they do.


I agree with all this. I also believe that these feelings are perpetuated via social media and clickbait programming.


This is what I disagree with. I think that it is more just noise designed to keep us all apart as much as possible. Things like saying 'professional Dems' is where I think you might (no disrespect, Ill explain in this next video) be falling into the propaganda trap. Democrats don't need to be qualified as 'professional' or 'establishment', they are just Democrats, and people who label themselves as something different get programmed into the branding that is only there to divide us up.

Humanity was not ready for the internet. Our brains are easily tricked and no matter how well you understand this doesn't make you immune to it. Just like in the video above, when our brains are programmed to fall into believing something that is not real, it sticks.
Click to expand...
We diverge on very little, it seems...can’t say that’s a big surprise. The “progressive / professional” was only meant to distinguish between political newcomers (not yet hardened to loss, etc) and old-timers (figured out its a long long game and stayed with it). Another facile grab at an illustrative distinction.

Overall I agree with you about humanity’s vulnerability to the way social media has manifested, and its likely like path forward if left unmodified. Yet another loose cannon in the mix....

if I understand what you’ve said about where we diverge, you’re saying that the churn, the sheer volume of bullshit, incidentally produced the effects I described? That it generated itself, absent direction? I’ll have to think about that more. I had detected the slanting of “The Hill” the same way I did that of “Russia Today”: observation and critical analysis...as you applied to “The Nation”. Social media is actually a fairly small component of my own investigations and observation: I’ve had a chance to see the rancor take root and solidify in multiple contacts outside of what we call social media...though a case could be made for the web itself being social media by one standard or another. (‘anywhere anyone can comment on anything, including other comments’ could fit the bill).

Still, much to investigate, reflect on, digest. Very agreeable to swap words and points of view with you, sir or ma’am. Glad you’re here.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
We diverge on very little, it seems...can’t say that’s a big surprise. The “progressive / professional” was only meant to distinguish between political newcomers (not yet hardened to loss, etc) and old-timers (figured out its a long long game and stayed with it). Another facile grab at an illustrative distinction.

Overall I agree with you about humanity’s vulnerability to the way social media has manifested, and its likely like path forward if left unmodified. Yet another loose cannon in the mix....

if I understand what you’ve said about where we diverge, you’re saying that the churn, the sheer volume of bullshit, incidentally produced the effects I described? That it generated itself, absent direction? I’ll have to think about that more. I had detected the slanting of “The Hill” the same way I did that of “Russia Today”: observation and critical analysis...as you applied to “The Nation”. Social media is actually a fairly small component of my own investigations and observation: I’ve had a chance to see the rancor take root and solidify in multiple contacts outside of what we call social media...though a case could be made for the web itself being social media by one standard or another. (‘anywhere anyone can comment on anything, including other comments’ could fit the bill).

Still, much to investigate, reflect on, digest. Very agreeable to swap words and points of view with you, sir or ma’am. Glad you’re here.
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Inserting certain words to channel the narrative is an old trick, look at how the word liberal was decontextualized and defined for most of America by the republicans and right wing. Most Americans don't even associate the word liberal with the word liberty, even though they mean one believes in and supports the other, liberals support liberty, is what it really means. Many Americans think the word liberal is a curse word and is somehow associated with socialism and communism, libertard was and still is an insult among Trumpers in particular.

You can kill an idea, by killing the word that describes it. Likewise you can add a label or preface and existing word to distort reality or simply substitute words, bureaucrat, for government employee or civil servant for instance. The word bureaucrat, evokes a different "feeling tone" than the word civil servant and this sets off a chain reaction of association in the mind. People are like putty if you have the knowledge and skill along with a medium to reach them. If this shit didn't work to influence minds, how did Facebook and Google become so rich so fast with ad revenue? Nobody would spend a dime on marketing if it did not work, no you don't get the pretty woman with the car they are advertising.
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
We diverge on very little, it seems...can’t say that’s a big surprise. The “progressive / professional” was only meant to distinguish between political newcomers (not yet hardened to loss, etc) and old-timers (figured out its a long long game and stayed with it). Another facile grab at an illustrative distinction.

Overall I agree with you about humanity’s vulnerability to the way social media has manifested, and its likely like path forward if left unmodified. Yet another loose cannon in the mix....

if I understand what you’ve said about where we diverge, you’re saying that the churn, the sheer volume of bullshit, incidentally produced the effects I described? That it generated itself, absent direction? I’ll have to think about that more. I had detected the slanting of “The Hill” the same way I did that of “Russia Today”: observation and critical analysis...as you applied to “The Nation”. Social media is actually a fairly small component of my own investigations and observation: I’ve had a chance to see the rancor take root and solidify in multiple contacts outside of what we call social media...though a case could be made for the web itself being social media by one standard or another. (‘anywhere anyone can comment on anything, including other comments’ could fit the bill).

Still, much to investigate, reflect on, digest. Very agreeable to swap words and points of view with you, sir or ma’am. Glad you’re here.
Click to expand...
You are correct in my using social media to encompass anything online basically. Youtube, comment sections on any online article, here, chat features in video games, anything and everything that someone is able to communicate online with another person. Blogs, planted news stories with propaganda titles, on and on.

And you are exactly right about the volume of bullshit incidentally producing the effects of social division, they are all wedges, and give realtime feedback to the bad actors that use programming to manipulate what we are spammed based on all of our data history online.

This guy really knows the ability of 'social media' programability altering our virtual realities:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/i-actually-think-this-guy-is-worth-listening-to.1032546/post-15824989

And this post I use to show how pervasive (and effective) it has been in political persuasion:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/ap-cyborgs-trolls-and-bots-a-guide-to-online-misinformation.1005699/post-15310450
 
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DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Some example of images associated with the word bureaucrat and the feelings, then the thoughts it evokes, even in liberals.
OIP.jpg


bureaucrat_2.jpg
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
I apologize for using “Russia” as an umbrella; I confess I wanted to keep it simple. At the same time, whether it was explicitly Russian policy to “support” Sanders, there were many cooks involved in the toxic stew being dished out at the time, and which cook dished which ladle of misinformation is slightly less important (to me) than the toxicity and the ubiquity.

I have great respect for your research, and I’ve learned considerable from your posts, so I take you statement of Russian support for Sanders as stated...in which case, their ‘support’ was weak sauce indeed. If it did more than underscore the idea that Sanders is “really a communist’ in the wrong-wing ‘mind’, I’ve yet to see it. The deliberate division sown between HRC supporters and Sanders supporters is still obvious, still toxic, still furious, whoever is due “credit” for it. The wedge driven between the two camps will not be removed within the political lifetimes of Sanders or Clinton: the core of it is that Sanders embraced the “Bernie bros”, voted for Trump, and savaged Clinton throughout the campaign; that Sanders and his supporters are indifferent at best toward women, racial and ethnic minorities - and hostile toward them at best.

Even the most extreme “Bernie bro” of my acquaintance is strong in support of women’s issues and women candidates - strong in support for minority issues, the welfare of minority communities, and both candidates of color and organizers of color, strong in opposition to Trump during and after the election: they feel stabbed, dry-gulched, attacked and betrayed for having been moved by Sanders in the first place, treated as scapegoats and sacrificial victims for HRC’s loss and Trump’s win. They don’t appreciate it, they resent it...but no amount of letting it go and attempting to bridge the gap to HRC’s crew has lessened the hostility - or the sense of futility in even trying.

So, not a Russian operation, but very much in kind with what they *and others* were doing, and with deep and lasting wounds, as we’re seeing begin to play out between the progressive Dems and the professional Dems.
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i feel she pushed herself upon us much like trump now the only difference is she wasn't president- it's about themselves and only themselves at any cost and in this case it is the American people.
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
just a little reminder..you remember us?..grassroots donors, first on the call; first to action.

www.nbcnews.com

In nod to Sanders, Biden looks to adopt more progressive policies

On his first day as the apparent Democratic nominee, Joe Biden is extending another olive branch to backers of his more progressive rivals.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com

nypost.com

‘Enormously insulting’: Sanders warns Biden not to shut out progressives

“It seems to me pretty clear that progressive views need to be expressed within a Biden administration,” Sanders told The Associated Press.
nypost.com nypost.com

www.tampabay.com

Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren at risk of being excluded from Joe Biden’s Cabinet picks

The liberal New England senators remain interested in serving in Biden’s Cabinet, but even some of their allies recognize they face major political hurdles getting there.
www.tampabay.com www.tampabay.com

www.detroitnews.com

Sanders, Warren under scrutiny as Biden weighs Cabinet picks

The senators remain interested in serving in Biden's Cabinet, but even some of their allies recognize they face major political hurdles getting there
www.detroitnews.com

2019 Q1-4



2020 Q1

www.nytimes.com

Sanders Raises $25 Million in January, a Huge Show of Financial Strength (Published 2020)

The Vermont senator’s announcement came as the Biden, Buttigieg and Warren campaigns are showing signs of financial strain.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

and then came the Trump Plague.
 
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schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Pelosi: accept what we could've accepted long ago because we have 1) new president and 2) vaccine. + lot's of time to get it done before they leave on 12/18..just like Labor Day..plenty of time.

let's take a walk down Memory Lane shall we?..oh! and did i mention we had plenty of time?

en.as.com

Unemployment benefits: Why Pelosi has declined vote to extend $600 payments

Although she believes it is positve initiative, Democratic House speaker Nancy Pelosi has rejected calls to vote on extending the $600 federal unemployment benefit.
en.as.com en.as.com

Q: what about when the new president is short two seats in the Senate?

the vaccine?:lol:

www.wsj.com

Supply-Chain Obstacles Led to Last Month’s Cut to Pfizer’s Covid-19 Vaccine-Rollout Target

Pfizer and partner BioNTech had hoped to roll out 100 million vaccines world-wide by the end of this year, a plan that was reduced to 50 million last month, highlighting the challenges drug makers face in rapidly building supply chains to meet the high demand.
www.wsj.com www.wsj.com

i hate to be ageist but Jeeeeeeeeeesus Christ already..if you can't hold a thought and communicate to the audience?:wall:
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Good thing Sanders and Warren are still Senators hmmmmmmmmm...i wonder how they'll vote on this SWIFT BOOT IN OUR ASSES.

if you people think they'll be another 'Relief' bill after this just because we have a 1) new president and 2) vaccine at 50%?


wonder how much they paid Tuskeegee Recipients? here, john delaney wants to pay folks to inject the bleach..

1607122392112.png

www.wvlt.tv

Former presidential candidate proposes giving $1,500 to Americans willing to take vaccine

As states across the country prepare to get their populations vaccinated, a former presidential candidate offered a bold proposal to get citizens to take it.
www.wvlt.tv www.wvlt.tv

first the seniors get it who don't need the stimulus with a super secret number that you convey to some government agency where they need to cross reference that the number is real and that you did indeed get a shot..ETA 6 months+ then they'll get to everyone else at some point rinse repeat.
 
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Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
Good thing Sanders and Warren are still Senators hmmmmmmmmm...i wonder how they'll vote on this SWIFT BOOT IN OUR ASSES.

if you people think they'll be another 'Relief' bill after this just because we have a 1) new president and 2) vaccine at 50%?


wonder how much they paid Tuskeegee Recipients? here, john delaney wants to pay folks to inject the bleach..

View attachment 4759765

www.wvlt.tv

Former presidential candidate proposes giving $1,500 to Americans willing to take vaccine

As states across the country prepare to get their populations vaccinated, a former presidential candidate offered a bold proposal to get citizens to take it.
www.wvlt.tv www.wvlt.tv
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Democrats are why Republicans are blocking the aid I want.
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
um, i'm not understanding why this is up to 2 Moderates..Retired are getting exactly nothing..Elder Care which already exists just more of them..gee thanks I can do my own laundry and would prefer a pair of glasses to go with the eye exam..they give you an eye exam but no glasses or contacts..they give you the woodie..no dental..NO DENTAL!!!!!!! they'll cover your hearing exam but no hearing aid..until Biden (Sanders) wrestled a hearing aid from them. What about RXs? WTF?

www.npr.org

Paid family leave gets slashed as Democrats try to reach consensus on spending plan

The United States is one of a handful of countries, and the only wealthy nation, without a national paid leave policy.
www.npr.org www.npr.org
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
um, i'm not understanding why this is up to 2 Moderates..Retired are getting exactly nothing..Elder Care which already exists just more of them..gee thanks I can do my own laundry and would prefer a pair of glasses to go with the eye exam..they give you an eye exam but no glasses or contacts..they give you the woodie..no dental..NO DENTAL!!!!!!! they'll cover your hearing exam but no hearing aid..until Biden (Sanders) wrestled a hearing aid from them. What about RXs? WTF?

www.npr.org

Paid family leave gets slashed as Democrats try to reach consensus on spending plan

The United States is one of a handful of countries, and the only wealthy nation, without a national paid leave policy.
www.npr.org www.npr.org
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You are letting the 50 Republican senators who are not even voting (and also are forcing it to not be able to even be voted on) for what is in that bill off the hook pretty easily there.
 
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