MeGaKiLlErMaN
Well-Known Member
And there's currently a grow off going between that and cobs so we will see soon enough.
COB Spectral Quality Thread
- Thread starter MeGaKiLlErMaN
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- calculator cobs led photosynthetic
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
I have used the same genetics for years BOG. I have seen improvements with Royal Blue during veg and Deep Red, IR, and Far Red during bloom. Now they have a COB with both called a full spectrum smd led. It comes in 1w-100w capacity. I find the 20w-100w COB quite interesting,as they run at 30-32v and 1500mA. You could run the additional cob alone on it's own driver which I have on hand thanks to @SupraSPL 's help. The current COB best cob is amde by a company called CHANzon http://www.ebay.com/itm/High-Power-LED-Chip-1W-3W-5W-10W-20W-30W-50W-100W-SMD-COB-Grow-Light-Bulb-Bead-/272220021539?var=&hash=item3f6193e323:m:mvC35DJEBOwDyFnKBDAYnjA
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
Pointing out spectral capabilities. I am going to combine the best of both, high power cobs running at 50w and full spectrum cob running at 50w. I currently use Deep red, Far Red and IR on 3w leds. I am combing them into a cob for better output just like a Vero, CLU or cree
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
independent they both have shortcomings, together they have strength, strong branches, good nodal spacing, good fruit development, good healthy leaves. Together they are great separate they have weaknesses. I use royal Blue during veg and see excellent close nodal development as Growmau5 has already experienced as well as the Far Red. he felt it did not add significantly from his perspective, but it made a positive contribution. More is better in my approach. I am working on rebuilding sunlight to the best of my abilities. BTw, the cobs, I am looking at have 50,000 hours supported on them and are well made.
MeGaKiLlErMaN
Well-Known Member
Can you point to the thread showing the difference in using the extra colors be white by itself? I would like to see if it's the extra blue/red/green that's driving it or just extra wattageI have used the same genetics for years BOG. I have seen improvements with Royal Blue during veg and Deep Red, IR, and Far Red during bloom. Now they have a COB with both called a full spectrum smd led. It comes in 1w-100w capacity. I find the 20w-100w COB quite interesting,as they run at 30-32v and 1500mA. You could run the additional cob alone on it's own driver which I have on hand thanks to @SupraSPL 's help. The current COB best cob is amde by a company called CHANzon http://www.ebay.com/itm/High-Power-LED-Chip-1W-3W-5W-10W-20W-30W-50W-100W-SMD-COB-Grow-Light-Bulb-Bead-/272220021539?var=&hash=item3f6193e323:m:mvC35DJEBOwDyFnKBDAYnjA
sixstring2112
Well-Known Member
Heres the thing vegas,if you say you saw improved growth but started 3 years ago with all white and now 3 years later you are using a bunch of extra shit and seeing an improvement that doesnt really mean much to me.i guess if anyone runs a strain long enough they will see an improvement, see what im saying?
So without actually taking 2 tents say 4 x 4 and putting the same cut in both but using say 500w cob(white)only in 1 tent and then in the other tent using 400w white cob and 100w of whatever red and blue diodes you want,we have nothing to go off of except that you say you personally seen improved growth characteristics like node space ect.and these tents would need to be kept at very similar environmental factors usually within the same room.
Node spacing too close can actually cost you yields,i have seen it here with my first run of cobs.and its 100% the reason i searched out and built multiple fixtures with 2700k cree.just a lil more space between nodes can allow more light down into the plant and bump yields by better bud development towards the center and lower part of the plant.
So without actually taking 2 tents say 4 x 4 and putting the same cut in both but using say 500w cob(white)only in 1 tent and then in the other tent using 400w white cob and 100w of whatever red and blue diodes you want,we have nothing to go off of except that you say you personally seen improved growth characteristics like node space ect.and these tents would need to be kept at very similar environmental factors usually within the same room.
Node spacing too close can actually cost you yields,i have seen it here with my first run of cobs.and its 100% the reason i searched out and built multiple fixtures with 2700k cree.just a lil more space between nodes can allow more light down into the plant and bump yields by better bud development towards the center and lower part of the plant.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
My experience and experiments with lighting spectral approaches. When I started peo0ple said no blue light in bloom, but that was a wrong concept. If you use a 2700k cxb3590 you will get the additional reds for Deep Red and IR available. If you use a 6500k you will get the additional Royal Blue available. If you mix the two cobs together 2700k and 6500k you will get a beautiful thing. I cannot afford to buy cobs to experiment so I use 3w cree leds with color spectrum available. If you do not want to add 3w or 5w leds you can just change up your bloom fixture to replace 1-3500k with 1-2700k and 1-3500k with 1-6500k and you are close to the same full spectrum you get with a cob or custom grow light system.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
I grew these genetics under HPS prior 600w-1000w depending on tine of year. When I built my cob lights I added the Royal Blue, 18w total increase in power; I doubt a game changer in the power band; but a game changer in bushy plants. I also added Deep Red-12/3w, IR 12-3w, and far Red 15-3w. None of these leds added significant power or wattage to the grow area, just a broader light spectrum and a growth response to that. Just sharing my experience. I do not do side by side tests, just share my results. The 3w leds did not add much real wattage as far away as they are, so the 3590, 3500k do the real work at 18" away. I doubt 3w leds have an impact from that distance driven at 750mA.
Now I found a cob with all the above in it. I will still run Far Red at sunset, but now I have all the rest in a single cob with a 50w driver I already have. At $12 a full spectrum is cheaper than a 1212 and you can see the specs, copper base. I am always doing research on lighting it is a specialty of mine, hence the led controller I design and offer for use, so others can make lights like ChilledLed and other professional lights adding light spectrum and getting yields to prove their worth.
nogod_
Well-Known Member
Occasionally, yes, even mighty NASA "gets it wrong".
Personally I'm itching to see a side by side "enhanced spectrum" vs. "Standard spectrum" shootout and have been since Amare opened the "enhanced spectrum" can of worms.
Conventional pot-board wisdom has always maintained "blue-heavy for veg, red-heavy for flower" but after two straight runs of really solid vegetative growth under 3000k cxa3590s, I'm just not sure who to believe anymore!
Maybe this thread will put the "spectral quality" issue to bed but I doubt it! Until we have some trials with isolated controls its just going to be more "yeah well it was basically the same except i did bump up the silica a bit, and the power went down for 6 hours but i doubt that mattered, and my co2 ran out and i didnt notice, and it was a little warmer at night but only 5 degrees for 16 days" so on and so forth.
CobKits
Well-Known Member
i was aghast with my first 90 cri crop at the stretch, but damn if that didnt all fill in and yield more than im used to
Abiqua
Well-Known Member
has anyone done any full terp profile testing....sc labs for example....
desertvegas...what would your response be to someone that has done the exact opposite of your reds and has gotten the same results you have.....just playing devils advocate....
growing after 3 years and you dont think that different strains let alone same clones act the same to all types of light?
after 3 years of growing....all i m convinced of is this:.......strain/ cultivar dependent. my most consistent strain can have even slight changes in 3k from 4k spectrums when comparing similar ppf....
not trying to argue just adding my experienco...it can be a good convo ....light spectrum.
desertvegas...what would your response be to someone that has done the exact opposite of your reds and has gotten the same results you have.....just playing devils advocate....
growing after 3 years and you dont think that different strains let alone same clones act the same to all types of light?
after 3 years of growing....all i m convinced of is this:.......strain/ cultivar dependent. my most consistent strain can have even slight changes in 3k from 4k spectrums when comparing similar ppf....
not trying to argue just adding my experienco...it can be a good convo ....light spectrum.
Raging Stalk
Active Member
Unless you want to go full blown scientific experiment double blind, etc trials a number of times over to get the minimum number of data points before you could determine any impacts statistically, then yeah we are all just winging it. That is why we need more research and that takes time.
What I do know is that my plants seem happier whenever I add more cobs so I am going to keep doing that.
What I do know is that my plants seem happier whenever I add more cobs so I am going to keep doing that.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
I don't think they have blown up any led lights yet. But then led lights is not rocket science either. NASA has money to do research you and i do not have.
Occasionally, yes, even mighty NASA "gets it wrong".
Personally I'm itching to see a side by side "enhanced spectrum" vs. "Standard spectrum" shootout and have been since Amare opened the "enhanced spectrum" can of worms.
Conventional pot-board wisdom has always maintained "blue-heavy for veg, red-heavy for flower" but after two straight runs of really solid vegetative growth under 3000k cxa3590s, I'm just not sure who to believe anymore!
Maybe this thread will put the "spectral quality" issue to bed but I doubt it! Until we have some trials with isolated controls its just going to be more "yeah well it was basically the same except i did bump up the silica a bit, and the power went down for 6 hours but i doubt that mattered, and my co2 ran out and i didnt notice, and it was a little warmer at night but only 5 degrees for 16 days" so on and so forth.
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
after close nodal spacing in veg, more red and stretch in bloom is just that more nugz and bigger nugz too if you feed well
VegasWinner
Well-Known Member
There is a lot of good information out there on full spectrum lighting and it's effects on plant growth. As I said up front, adding supplemental lights to cob lights is not a bad thing, you an even mix different kelvins 2700-5600 and see the difference. If you are waiting for someone else to do it, you will kiss out or not. just participating in the dialog and sharing what i find with others.
Rahz
Well-Known Member
To the person asking about 70/90 -vs- 80 CRI, 70 should have the highest PAR and PPF values and 90 the lowest. This still applies when a weighting factor is applied based on the Mcree curve. The gap closes a bit but the observed photosynthetic efficiency favoring red doesn't explain my testing results. Both 70 and 90 CRI samples outgrew their 2x2 area but the 90 CRI sample being a bit taller did have a bit more floor space by the end of the grow. So not a lot of hard conclusions can be drawn but in addition to the yield figures the 90 CRI samples (3000 and 2700) did finish first and had better looking fruit. While better looking fruit doesn't indicate compound level % it is worth noting.
I think it's fair to suggest high CRI isn't hurting the results. Whether it will test the best in the future remains to be seen, but I like it enough that I'm in the process of switching from 3000/80 to 3000/90. I'm working with someone on running a 2nd test with no possibility for the plants to escaping their respective enclosures, will also include a 4000/90 sample, so hopefully the next set of results won't be so ambiguous. It's looking like only room for 4 samples so it will be 3000/90 4000/90 2700/90 and either 3000/70 or 3000/80. Any preferences?
I think it's fair to suggest high CRI isn't hurting the results. Whether it will test the best in the future remains to be seen, but I like it enough that I'm in the process of switching from 3000/80 to 3000/90. I'm working with someone on running a 2nd test with no possibility for the plants to escaping their respective enclosures, will also include a 4000/90 sample, so hopefully the next set of results won't be so ambiguous. It's looking like only room for 4 samples so it will be 3000/90 4000/90 2700/90 and either 3000/70 or 3000/80. Any preferences?
Raging Stalk
Active Member
I think they are all putting out the same ppf, just a different, more balanced spd. At least when I measure ppfd the 80s and 90s are well within margins of error in similar conditions.
It isn't like the power going to the cobs is any different and the amount of waste heat is the same so that remaining power is being used for light somehow.
sixstring2112
Well-Known Member
Yes my preference for the 4th chip would be 2700k 80cri
3000k 70cri is so 2 years ago hahaha
Raging Stalk
Active Member
Isn't Malocan running 1750k decor now?
verticalgrow
Well-Known Member
Rahz, 3000/70 or 5000/90 plz
