Conscious?!?

I think you mean consciousness, or do you mean conscience? If it's the latter, then that's virtually the same question as where did our morality come from (morality evolving within us as we were small hunter gatherer tribes - I'll scratch your back you scratch mine type of thing that is explained in many other threads here). If you mean consciousness, that is what cognitive science is attempting to define and explain. It's a fascinating subject! Dennet, Harris, Hofstadter, Pinker and others all dabble in cognitive science, and there are differing hypotheses of how we discovered consciousness. One train of thought originates from a Princeton professor, Dr. Julian Jaynes, in his book, 'The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind'. In it, he states that humans were not always conscious, and that it is a fairly recent human discovery. His definition of consciousness is very specific, and he explains what consciousness is necessary for, and what it is not (learning, routine tasks, etc.) He demonstrates how the human two chamber (or Bicameral) mind was not always conscious, and that the discovery would only be made after complex enough language was developed. Language advanced enough to use metaphor - using a known thing to explain an unknown thing, and generate analog models - this map/grid represents its corresponding location or area of space. He goes on to demonstrate that entire ancient civilizations were built without humans being conscious: Egypt, Mesopotamia, even very ancient Greece. He points to their writings being simply a reporting of events and devoid of introspection and self-analysis (example - the Iliad's prose being an objective reporting of events, and the Odyssey written centuries later showing subjectivity and introspection). Although some of Jaynes' hypotheses are now obsolete (the book was written in the 70's), many have been used to lay the foundation of modern cognitive science, and he was a pioneer. Anyway, I would suggest reading Pinker's, 'How the Mind Works' and Hofstadter's, 'I Am a Strange Loop'. Or better yet listen to the Pinker book on Youtube:

[video=youtube;vuwNfPca_Pw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuwNfPca_Pw[/video]

um... i think whatever it is, it probably came from the universe..through the process of evolution

The Buddhists hold the fascinating belief that consciousness is a failure of perception, a structural bug in our being. Only by discarding the notion of self do we make real progress. I don't know how to take that, but the contrast with Western thought is extreme. cn

cannabineer said:

The Buddhists hold the fascinating belief that consciousness is a failure of perception, a structural bug in our being. Only by discarding the notion of self do we make real progress. I don't know how to take that, but the contrast with Western thought is extreme. cn

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I'm sure that even the Western definition of 'real progress' is vastly different from the Buddhist one. Ours includes an ever-deepening sense of self, and theirs includes abolishing the self. Diametrically opposite goals. Everyone will lose their sense of self (their I-ness) when they die, seems strange that one would aspire to this before this inevitability...

j.GrEeN.< said:

In your own, Individual/personal opinion ?

Where does it come from ?

What within you, or without you, is conscious of your conscious?.................................................................................................................................................................................................
...................................Aware, of your awareness?What IS IT ? IS IT not ?

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IMO

it comes from our evolution and the need for communication and the need to inovate

only i can be aware of what i am aware of, my conscious is no more than a product of my brain functions

it is what makes me, me!. it isnt a part of some web connecting every atom in the universe in a introspective viewing of itself

i agree a bit with canabineer a bit conciousness gets in the way when we are trying to do something i am a juggler and i know that once i've learnt a trick it is my unconcious mind that does all the work

good ideas in here
[youtube]LM_iiPFkNas[/youtube]

cannabineer said:

The Buddhists hold the fascinating belief that consciousness is a failure of perception, a structural bug in our being. Only by discarding the notion of self do we make real progress. I don't know how to take that, but the contrast with Western thought is extreme. cn

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...at this point in my studies, I can safely say that the alchemical process is the refiner of self. I agree with the idea that self is the illusion we cling to. I also really like the sufi expression 'die before you die'. With that 'needing' part of a person as the forerunner a saying like that could be taken literally (even at an unconscious level); but once that self is dissolved it takes on a whole new meaning / being.

This is the wake n bake thread, right?

eye exaggerate said:

...at this point in my studies, I can safely say that the alchemical process is the refiner of self. I agree with the idea that self is the illusion we cling to. I also really like the sufi expression 'die before you die'. With that 'needing' part of a person as the forerunner a saying like that could be taken literally (even at an unconscious level); but once that self is dissolved it takes on a whole new meaning / being.

This is the wake n bake thread, right?

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It's the Couscous thread, so it's more "dream 'n' steam". cn

cannabineer said:

It's the Couscous thread, so it's more "dream 'n' steam". cn

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...couscous, semolina, dream 'n' steam...it all sounds a bit sexual if you ask me I'm sure Nigella must have covered it somewhere.

Whoa, tangent