CXB3590 1500W

SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
Megalomando said:
@ Supra, Thanks again for the info. I still haven't received the tracking # so maybe they haven't shipped yet (Jerry). If I can get the 36V COBs instead, wouldn't I take a hit in lumins? it seems like 23W as opposed to 50W would be much less output. Or, would the output be about the same? It would be great to put out the same lumins with less heat being made.
I suppose it's academic as 56.3% isn't that far from 64%
I'm learning a lot here and its awesome to have so much help in this forum.
Click to expand...
If you go with the 36V and run them at 23-24W ea, you would need almost 2X as many COBs to get the same job done. A 64% efficient COB is making 13.7% more light/W than a 56.3% efficient setup.

Here is a breakdown comparison I did for a friend that I think demonstrates 56% is a good compromise for most builds:

Based on your current yield of 1 LB per 1000W HPS, here is what you could expect:

6000W HPS gets you 6 LBS
3000W COBs @ 56% efficiency should get you 6 LBS
2000W COBs @ 56% efficiency should get you 4 LBS
2000W COBs @ 64% efficiency should get you 4.5 LBS

Cost comparison:
3000W @ 56%:
$2520 60 COBs + $900 15 drivers + $750 15 heatsinks/fans + $225 lenses/wiring = $4395

2000W @ 56%:
$1680 40 COBs + $600 10 drivers + $500 10 heatsinks/fans + $150 lenses/wiring = $2930

2000W @ 64%:
$3360 80 COBs + $600 10 drivers + $500 10 heatsinks/fans +$300 lenses/wiring = $4760
 
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trichomatic

trichomatic

Member
@yoda
yoda954 said:
hello

it seems to me
yes it's cxb3590 5000k cd for vegging
I will recall me that told me SupraSPL
So for germination and vegetative phase (growth and surment stretch for some variety of hemp)
it should be good

it corrects me I'm wrong SupraSPL

à +++
Click to expand...
Thanks for your reply, my question is more about COB and driver pairing to get good PPFD and light distribution for vegging this space. I am thinking that if I go with 4 x CXB3590 36V @5000K / HLG-185H-C1400B and cut the 38" in half so that I can get better light distribution, then it should work pretty well.

What do you all think? Is this a worthwhile investment for veg? Or should I just use some T5s for veg and put focus investing in the flower room?
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
trichomatic said:
Hey @SupraSPL thanks for helping all of us get into this awesome technology. I am going to go with your 4 x CXB3590 36V @ 3500K / 1400ma driver build recommendation to add to my flower room. Need some lights for a 3' 9" x 3' 9" vegging area. Do you have any recommendations for this? I believe I read that you are using 400 PPFD for veg, is that correct? Would you go 5000K?
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You can veg as low as 25-50 PPFD for seedlings and short clones. Of course that is not ideal but it can keep plants growing slowly on the back burner. For a decent veg pace for shorter plants ~ 12" I use 200-250 PPFD. For tall ladies up to 3 feet I use 350 PPFD. At 350 you have to be able to keep them fed.

That is how I manage the veg speed for a perpetual setup with a separate veg space. But for those who need to veg up as fast as possible you can hit them with a lot more light. I think @REALSTYLES just vegged some thin mints in hydro at over 1000 PPFD.

I have been very happy with straight 5000K in vegging. I am using HLG-120H-C350B with (6) CXA3590 5K DB and I dim from 200mA to 380mA. I just ordered another HLG-120H-C350B and (6) CXB3590 5K CD. This is running them low experimentally. You can run them at 50W ea but it would require more vertical height to get the 400 PPFD level.

I defiinitely recommend any DIY COB setup over the fluoro. If you have any fluoros, replacing them with LED is the lowest hanging fruit
 
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trichomatic

trichomatic

Member
SupraSPL said:
You can veg as low as 25-50 PPFD for seedlings and short clones. Of course that is not ideal but it can keep plants growing slowly on the back burner.

For a decent veg pace for shorter plants ~ 12" I use 200-250 PPFD.

For tall ladies up to 3 feet I use 350 PPFD. At 350 you have to be able to keep them fed.

That is how I manage the veg speed for a perpetual setup with a separate veg space. But for those who need to veg up as fast as possible you can hit them with a lot more light. I think @REALSTYLES just vegged some thin mints in hydro at over 1000 PPFD.

I have been very happy with straight 5000K in vegging. I am using HLG-120H-C350B with (6) CXA3590 5K DB and I dim from 200mA to 380mA. I just ordered another HLG-120H-C350B and (6) CXB3590 5K CD.
Click to expand...
Many thanks for your detailed reply, how much area do you have the HLG-120H-C350B with (6) CXA3590 5K DB covering?
 
Humanrob

Humanrob

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
Decided to try a 10 gal pot to see if it would increase yield much versus 5 gal. The test plant is Cali Connection - Alien OG fem selected from 6 ladies:
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Pot size is an argument I follow every time it comes up. I am very curious to see your results. There seems to be a general consensus that moving from 3 to 5 gallon increases plant potential. But from there it seems to depend on growing style, medium (soil vs. coco, for instance), and nute regiment. I'm not sure if there is a definitive answer.

In the four indoor grows I've done, I've found that for my spaces 7 gallon seems to be the sweet spot. 10 gallon requires hauling more water, and unless I veg for a really long time, when I go to dump them after harvest the roots do not seem to have utilized the extra soil very much. If I'm going to veg for less than six weeks and/or scrog, 5 gallons seems sufficient. When I let plants grow taller with a more natural shape, they seem to do better in larger pots. But this is very anecdotal, because I'm at that early point in the learning curve where I (still) change multiple variables from one grow to the next, making my results inconclusive. Since you appear to have your basic set up down, I look forward to hearing your results.

I run two small spaces, and in my last cycle I did an Alien OG in one of them -- a 2'x2.5'x6' with two Optic 120's over it, and the Alien was in a 10 gallon cloth pot. I'm still a newbie so my results are limited by my experience, but she was one of my best so far, and smokes really nicely. It was a clone of one I grew outdoor last summer (my first outdoor), and the outdoor produced beautifully but sadly became one of my learning curve casualties. The buds were beautifully dense and large but while experimenting with various ways of protecting her from fall rains, I trapped too much air and got bud rot on that one (an all too common Oregon experience). I do like Alien OG though!
 
trichomatic

trichomatic

Member
SupraSPL said:
It can cover about 14 sq ft @ 300 PPFD ( 6 COBs @ 23W ea)
Click to expand...
How do you think it would be covering my 3' 9" x 3' 9" vegging area with 4 x CXB3590 @ 49W each? The spacing would be 15" on center between COBs. Would this light distribution be alright for veg?

BTW, how do you calculate PPFD for the various setups you are designing?
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
trichomatic said:
How do you think it would be covering my 3' 9" x 3' 9" vegging area with 4 x CXB3590 @ 49W each? The spacing would be 15" on center between COBs. Would this light distribution be alright for veg?

BTW, how do you calculate PPFD for the various setups you are designing?
Click to expand...
@littlejacob showed an extremely healthy veg area that appears to run on exactly what you're planning. He can correct me and provide more details?
 
trichomatic

trichomatic

Member
ttystikk said:
@littlejacob showed an extremely healthy veg area that appears to run on exactly what you're planning. He can correct me and provide more details?
Click to expand...
Awesome, thanks for letting me know. Do you know what reflectors or lenses @littlejacob used? I am planning on using 80 degree glass lenses on 38" heatsinks for the flower bar. Those would be spaced at 9.5" on center. The veg bars will have the COBs spaced 15" apart. Should I go with a 90 degree lens for a bit wider throw?
 
yoda954

yoda954

Well-Known Member
Hi everybody
@SupraSPL

one to answer me about it ?
copy of my previous post ^^

I would like to savor what used reflector and links this to the purchased
and the lens in case I would put the lenses instead
and what degree to choose 80° or 90° diameter take what?

thank's

what is the best in 3 choices below?









thank's uou so much
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
trichomatic said:
How do you think it would be covering my 3' 9" x 3' 9" vegging area with 4 x CXB3590 @ 49W each? The spacing would be 15" on center between COBs. Would this light distribution be alright for veg?

BTW, how do you calculate PPFD for the various setups you are designing?
Click to expand...
I come up with 360 PPFD:

3.75' X 3.75' = 14 sq ft
50W X 4 = 200W * 56.3% efficiency = 112.6 PAR W
112.6 PAR W * .9 lens/wall reflector losses = 101.34 PAR W
101.34 / 14 sq ft = 7.23 PAR W/ sq ft
7.24 + 4.65 umol/s/PAR W * 10.7 (sq meter conversion) = 360 PPFD averaged

The way I like to find the best spacing quickly is to make a mockup. You can put a slight bias to ward the walls because the center benefits from the overlap
 
M

Megalomando

Well-Known Member
Running at 50W for each COB, I'm trying to decide on the size of the heatsinks and it comes down to putting 4 COBS on one 10" x 12" heatsink and making three of them, or making one large 10" x 24" with 4 3000K & 4 3500K on it for bloom and one" 10 x 12" with four 5000K for veg.

The COBS & drivers are on their way, need to order the heatsinks & fan now. Any suggestions?

Thanks.
 
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cdgmoney250

cdgmoney250

Well-Known Member
Humanrob said:
Pot size is an argument I follow every time it comes up. I am very curious to see your results. There seems to be a general consensus that moving from 3 to 5 gallon increases plant potential. But from there it seems to depend on growing style, medium (soil vs. coco, for instance), and nute regiment. I'm not sure if there is a definitive answer.

In the four indoor grows I've done, I've found that for my spaces 7 gallon seems to be the sweet spot. 10 gallon requires hauling more water, and unless I veg for a really long time, when I go to dump them after harvest the roots do not seem to have utilized the extra soil very much. If I'm going to veg for less than six weeks and/or scrog, 5 gallons seems sufficient. When I let plants grow taller with a more natural shape, they seem to do better in larger pots. But this is very anecdotal, because I'm at that early point in the learning curve where I (still) change multiple variables from one grow to the next, making my results inconclusive. Since you appear to have your basic set up down, I look forward to hearing your results.

I run two small spaces, and in my last cycle I did an Alien OG in one of them -- a 2'x2.5'x6' with two Optic 120's over it, and the Alien was in a 10 gallon cloth pot. I'm still a newbie so my results are limited by my experience, but she was one of my best so far, and smokes really nicely. It was a clone of one I grew outdoor last summer (my first outdoor), and the outdoor produced beautifully but sadly became one of my learning curve casualties. The buds were beautifully dense and large but while experimenting with various ways of protecting her from fall rains, I trapped too much air and got bud rot on that one (an all too common Oregon experience). I do like Alien OG though!
Click to expand...
More roots, more fruits.. I recently switched from 10 to 15 gal smart pots because after a few experiments I consistently yielded 15-20% more in the 15 gal. Heavier and more work initially, but then watering becomes less of a chore as the larger pots hold moisture longer. And the plants seem to appreciate the space to stretch their legs.
 
threetwobravo

threetwobravo

Member
SupraSPL said:
It is ideal to use a heatsink that will spread the COBs as far apart as possible, but still sufficient surface area. This will reduce the vertical height required and spread the intensity as evenly as possible.
Click to expand...
Is there a resource or a formula you could point me to work this out for myself for my particular set Supra?

Cheers
 
Rahz

Rahz

Well-Known Member
Whatever spacing you decide on you might add a little padding around the outside... or not. In a reflective area I think it makes little difference. Not so much a formula as much as a method, once you've decided on # of emitters and drive current play around with spacing til you find something that makes them equidistant. A hex pattern is most efficient but it's difficult to justify using it when mounting the emitters on long heatsinks.
 
threetwobravo

threetwobravo

Member
Rahz said:
Whatever spacing you decide on you might add a little padding around the outside... or not. In a reflective area I think it makes little difference. Not so much a formula as much as a method, once you've decided on # of emitters and drive current play around with spacing til you find something that makes them equidistant. A hex pattern is most efficient but it's difficult to justify using it when mounting the emitters on long heatsinks.
Click to expand...
Safe, cheers Rahz!!
 
M

Megalomando

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
It is ideal to use a heatsink that will spread the COBs as far apart as possible, but still sufficient surface area. This will reduce the vertical height required and spread the intensity as evenly as possible.
Click to expand...
That's the bugger for me; If I put 8 50W COBs on one heatsink or 4 50W cobs on a heatsink, which size heatsink is best for 4 COBs and which size heatsink for 8 COBs to live on one heatsink? I'll be using a 200MM fans for cooling.
 
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