DiY LEDs - How to Power Them

coreywebster

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
furalle said:
Hello.

Im planning on building a light for 4x4 using 12 vero29 4000k@700ma. I hope Its sufficent light with less problem with lightbleach and I can have them about 20" from canopy.

Can I can run them on 1 Meanwell hlg-320-c700b? My main concern is the solderless connectors (pico ez-mate)that are rated at 130v max, ecept for that they seem to fit that driver.

If anyone knows better driving options, plus feel free to post other ideas.
Click to expand...

VERO29.V2.0.4000K 12 COBS @0.7A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
16 SQ.FT. CANOPY 94% EFFICIENT DRIVER @11 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 318.09
Cobs power watts: 299
Total voltage forward: 427
Total lumens: 45753
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 127
Total PPF: 586.74
PPFD based on canopy area: 394.73
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 7.94
Cob efficiency: 47.23%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 18.69
Voltage forward per cob: 35.6
Lumens per watt: 153.02
Heatsink riser thickness / number of fins / fin's length: 0.3in/6/0.95in
Heatsink area per inch: 100.94 cm^2
Total heat watts: 158
umol/s/W / CRI: 4.62 / 80CRI
Heatsink length passive cooling @120cm^2/heatwatt: 188 inches
Heatsink length active cooling @40cm^2/heatwatt: 63 inches
COB cost dollar per PAR watt: $2.3
Electric cost @12/12 in 30 days: $13.1
Electric cost @18/6 in 30 days: $19.39
Cost per cob: $24.38
Heatsink cost per inch cut: $0.66
Total cobs cost: $293
Total heatsink passive cooling cost: $124
Total heatsink active cooling cost: $41

The bold text would suggest its only about half the amount of light you would want in a 4x4.. So only really good for a 2x2 - 2.5x2.5 area.

I'm not sure what sort of price you are paying for the vero29 but the citizen 1212 may well be cheaper and slightly better efficiency. The price on the calculator show the vero been twice the price as the 1212 but the price data may be out of date.
What price are the vero29?
 
F

furalle

Active Member
coreywebster said:
VERO29.V2.0.4000K 12 COBS @0.7A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
16 SQ.FT. CANOPY 94% EFFICIENT DRIVER @11 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 318.09
Cobs power watts: 299
Total voltage forward: 427
Total lumens: 45753
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 127
Total PPF: 586.74
PPFD based on canopy area: 394.73
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 7.94
Cob efficiency: 47.23%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 18.69
Voltage forward per cob: 35.6
Lumens per watt: 153.02
Heatsink riser thickness / number of fins / fin's length: 0.3in/6/0.95in
Heatsink area per inch: 100.94 cm^2
Total heat watts: 158
umol/s/W / CRI: 4.62 / 80CRI
Heatsink length passive cooling @120cm^2/heatwatt: 188 inches
Heatsink length active cooling @40cm^2/heatwatt: 63 inches
COB cost dollar per PAR watt: $2.3
Electric cost @12/12 in 30 days: $13.1
Electric cost @18/6 in 30 days: $19.39
Cost per cob: $24.38
Heatsink cost per inch cut: $0.66
Total cobs cost: $293
Total heatsink passive cooling cost: $124
Total heatsink active cooling cost: $41

The bold text would suggest its only about half the amount of light you would want in a 4x4.. So only really good for a 2x2 - 2.5x2.5 area.

I'm not sure what sort of price you are paying for the vero29 but the citizen 1212 may well be cheaper and slightly better efficiency. The price on the calculator show the vero been twice the price as the 1212 but the price data may be out of date.
What price are the vero29?
Click to expand...
Hello, much tnx for the calculation, I've been suspecting this but couldn't get the calculator to work. I already got the vero29s, Citizen had some weird re-seller rules here in EU. I got the veros for 24$.

On my present experiement space (22" x 22") 100W seems perfect. I have four 3590s dimmed down to 700ma. When I ran them at 200w the plants suffered. Havent tried 1050 yet. Maybe I could run more Veros at 700ma to boost the PPFD. Maybe 15of them? Or go by 1050ma?

Here is the heatsink I was looking at:
http://www.bal-group.com/heatsink_detail/200?calc_length=90&calc_air_flow=0&update=Update#calculator

Also found these: http://www.cooliance.eu/en/app-guides/product-lookup-table1
 
Last edited:
coreywebster

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
furalle said:
Hello, much tnx for the calculation, I've been suspecting this but couldn't get the calculator to work. I already got the vero29s, Citizen had some weird re-seller rules here in EU. I got the veros for 24$.

On my present experiement space (22" x 22") 100W seems perfect. I have four 3590s dimmed down to 700ma. When I ran them at 200w the plants suffered. Havent tried 1050 yet. Maybe I could run more Veros at 700ma to boost the PPFD. Maybe 15of them? Or go by 1050ma?
Click to expand...
No worries. I think the combo of a few more vero @ the slightly higher amperes would really boost your ppfd, but if you want any particular chip numbers at different amps just shout out and I will post them if your having issues with the calc.

VERO29.V2.0.4000K 15 COBS @1.05A ON 1.813 PROFILE HEATSINK
16 SQ.FT. CANOPY 94% EFFICIENT DRIVER @11 CENTS PER KWH
Total power watts at the wall: 609.57
Cobs power watts: 573
Total voltage forward: 546
Total lumens: 84712
Total PAR watts assuming 10% loss: 235
Total PPF: 1085.7
PPFD based on canopy area: 730.4
PAR watts per sq.ft.: 14.69
Cob efficiency: 45.63%
Power watts per sq.ft.: 35.81
Voltage forward per cob: 36.4
Lumens per watt: 147.84


If you ever want any citizens primelight are reasonable, about £9 for the 1212s but you may have to pay more for less than 20 units. Its can be tricky in Europe, I ended up getting clu058s from USA and got a good deal. I havnt really looked at the Vero, started off looking at all the cxbs and ended up going with citizens.
If you want some real cheap citis for playing with there are some 046 1212s (older gen) for £2.50 each in Estonia. I bought some and a few others from our part of the planet have picked some up too.
Anyway, if you want any numbers running through the calc just holla
 
smokehog

smokehog

Well-Known Member
Hi i have 6 x cxb3590 and 1 MW led driver HLG-185H-C1400B to run 4 of them to run at 50w each. I already have 2 x HLG-60H-36A 61.2W 36V. to run 2 on their own driver. In total 314.4w.
What area space will this do? My attic room is 6 foot x 4 foot and height is 6 foot. I normally put 9 x 20lt pots in the area with 1000w of light. How many more cxb3590's do i need to cover the space? Do you recommend a 200w cutters kit to add extra light?

Thanks
 
L

ledfan2

Member
Hi

i hope im in the right thread cause i need a little help to decide the best led components for my situation.(and please excuse my englisch,it s not my mother s tongue)

my situation is:very high electricity costs and high temperatures.So i think i will go with expensive equipment but for this with high efficency,it will amortize at time.
read a lot in this forum and so i think the best led for me is cree cxb 3590 cd bin 3500 kelvin.i want to drive them at max. 0.35 A or at 0.175.suited for this range is the meanwell hlg-120-c350.
http://www.meanwell.com/mw_search/HLG-120H-C/HLG-120H-C-spec.pdf
so anyone have a spreedsheet about this? maybe calculated..i need to know how much cob i can put on this driver at 350mA,0.175mA..
for 1,2 mx1,2m tent i think i can take two of this drivers and 28 cob,and at 0.175 A 56 cob?
but i m not sure if go under the 0.35A what is better for dimming cause i have read that the pwm take led on of 100 times in a second to half the light and that take lifetime from led?so what is the better way to dimm respectively what is the lowest current losses way to dimm? the driver typ a have a potentiometer,typ b have 3 in 1 dimming function-1-10vdc,10v pwm signal and resistance.
so many questions....take reflektor or glas lenses? i hope when it s go with 0.35 A or 0.175,i can renounce lenses and refl. the temps must so low that it s possible to go very close to the canopy,maybe few centimeters? once i am sure,i can passive cooling and take the cheapest cooler :-) and the rest makes the ventilation,
especially at 175 mA!i hope someone can figure this out with me and that there is a dimming method to 175mA that not much costs electricity power loss.
this,at 175mA could be the most efficient system that can be build.

thanks for future help

your ledfan2
 
sixstring2112

sixstring2112

Well-Known Member
ledfan2 said:
Hi

i hope im in the right thread cause i need a little help to decide the best led components for my situation.(and please excuse my englisch,it s not my mother s tongue)

my situation is:very high electricity costs and high temperatures.So i think i will go with expensive equipment but for this with high efficency,it will amortize at time.
read a lot in this forum and so i think the best led for me is cree cxb 3590 cd bin 3500 kelvin.i want to drive them at max. 0.35 A or at 0.175.suited for this range is the meanwell hlg-120-c350.
http://www.meanwell.com/mw_search/HLG-120H-C/HLG-120H-C-spec.pdf
so anyone have a spreedsheet about this? maybe calculated..i need to know how much cob i can put on this driver at 350mA,0.175mA..
for 1,2 mx1,2m tent i think i can take two of this drivers and 28 cob,and at 0.175 A 56 cob?
but i m not sure if go under the 0.35A what is better for dimming cause i have read that the pwm take led on of 100 times in a second to half the light and that take lifetime from led?so what is the better way to dimm respectively what is the lowest current losses way to dimm? the driver typ a have a potentiometer,typ b have 3 in 1 dimming function-1-10vdc,10v pwm signal and resistance.
so many questions....take reflektor or glas lenses? i hope when it s go with 0.35 A or 0.175,i can renounce lenses and refl. the temps must so low that it s possible to go very close to the canopy,maybe few centimeters? once i am sure,i can passive cooling and take the cheapest cooler :-) and the rest makes the ventilation,
especially at 175 mA!i hope someone can figure this out with me and that there is a dimming method to 175mA that not much costs electricity power loss.
this,at 175mA could be the most efficient system that can be build.

thanks for future help

your ledfan2
Click to expand...

It looks like you can run 12 cxb 3590 off that driver and maybe even 13. Supras spreadsheet shows 13.2 cobs using the older 3070 chips and a meanwell 120-350ma
 
sanjuan

sanjuan

Well-Known Member
Hi ledfan2,
If you use Ideal brand COB holders, they are only rated for 250V. I have the HLG120H-C350 and it will drive 12 36V COBs in series but that would require soldering wire to the solder pads on the ceramic square. (Unless there is another holder I don't know about.)

Edit: for slightly more money, I should have bought the HLG185H-C700 and used a parallel-series circuit.

Edit2: Ideal holders have two hole connectors for easy paralleling.
 
F

furalle

Active Member
sanjuan said:
Hi ledfan2,
If you use Ideal brand COB holders, they are only rated for 250V. I have the HLG120H-C350 and it will drive 12 36V COBs in series but that would require soldering wire to the solder pads on the ceramic square. (Unless there is another holder I don't know about.)

Edit: for slightly more money, I should have bought the HLG185H-C700 and used a parallel-series circuit.

Edit2: Ideal holders have two hole connectors for easy paralleling.
Click to expand...
Im confused. Its says my vero 29 holders can take 130V 2.8A. Then I should be able to run 6 of them at 36.4V @1.05A?

Edit: And here it says they can handle 300V. lol

http://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/sd/688014226_sd.pdf
 
Last edited:
Donald Ray

Donald Ray

Member
I am a NOOB of course, trying to get a parts list together for a DIY CREE 3500K OR 4000K CXB3590 build. Looking at a active cooled bar setup starting off with 1 bar and will be adding more bars to it as time goes on.

My question is what is the better all around setup for driver to cob?, efficiency, yield, photons......Etc?

4 CXB3590's powered by an HLG-185H-C1400B , Or

5 CXB3590's powered by HLG-240H-C1400B .

In a video I recently watched by Growmau5 he touched on the 5 Cob 240 setup but didn't really elaborate. Those master growers and people in the know here please help this first time old timer out would ya. Thanks!

May consider driving these at 75w idk?? If so what driver for 4 and 5 cobs ?
 
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F

furalle

Active Member
sanjuan said:
The Pico-EZmate™ Harness can run three 36V COBs in series (108V) and stay within spec of 130V. You could run six or nine or whatever in parallel-series.
Click to expand...
Isnt the current and voltage related? I mean if it can handle 130v@2.8A=364 it should handle 218v@1.05a=229
 
F

furalle

Active Member
Donald Ray said:
I am a NOOB of course, trying to get a parts list together for a DIY CREE 3500K OR 4000K CXB3590 build. Looking at a active cooled bar setup starting off with 1 bar and will be adding more bars to it as time goes on.

My question is what is the better all around setup for driver to cob?, efficiency, yield, photons......Etc?

4 CXB3590's powered by an HLG-185H-C1400B , Or

5 CXB3590's powered by HLG-240H-C1400B .

In a video I recently watched by Growmau5 he touched on the 5 Cob 240 setup but didn't really elaborate. Those master growers and people in the know here please help this first time old timer out would ya. Thanks!

May consider driving these at 75w idk?? If so what driver for 4 and 5 cobs ?
Click to expand...
Im no mastergrower but Im going to run 4 cobs per bar @1050 and 3 bars. Driven with 2 hlg-240-c1050b. I think this will be a very energy-efficient way to illuminate 4x4 and the hlg-240 are pretty cheap. If I want more light I can add 1 bar making it 16 cobs but I doubt I need it. I also have to get another driver then.

Ive found it easy to get lightburn when I ran 3590s @1.4a. Its a waste to move the lights up I think and I rather have them close but If you use co2 they can handle more light.

Now I run my 22"x22" space at aprox 4x35w and the plants seem to love it. I also have 52w of uv in there so I dont know how this affects everything.
 
sanjuan

sanjuan

Well-Known Member
furalle said:
Isnt the current and voltage related? I mean if it can handle 130v@2.8A=364 it should handle 218v@1.05a=229
Click to expand...
The voltage rating of electrical equipment depends upon the dielectric strength of the insulating materials (including air).
 
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Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
Hi

So i think i got the dc side of drivers figured out but id like to ask advice on how people manage the ac side of things, mainly how to manage the inrush current.

Im hoping to lut together (little by little) a setup of aprox 3200 watts, on 16 hlg185 36A. This will be on a timer for 12/12. What special considerations must i make, as im pretty sure that flicking the switch on all of them on one timer will trip the fuses. How do people manage this? Theres timers around for 600w hps lumatek ballasts, wondering how many hlg 185s i can put on one timer.
 
sanjuan

sanjuan

Well-Known Member
I've run over 2,000W of Lumigrow lights on a 20A, 240VAC circuit breaker without problems. [Disclaimer: I'm not an electrician and my load center has a bad reputation (FPE).] Mean Well now lists circuit breaker specs but I don't know the standard being used. I use classic Intermatic analog timers.
 
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