Do you believe in God?

Do you believe in God?

  • Yes

    Votes: 71 34.6%

  • No

    Votes: 122 59.5%

  • Maybe

    Votes: 12 5.9%
  • Total voters
    205
B

BrewerT

Well-Known Member
Enigma said:
Now, imagine if everyone felt this way.. how the world would be so different.. we wouldn't be so overpopulated.. we wouldn't be so polluted and ravaged.. we would still fight and kill, that is the natural order.. I believe the Earth would have a longer lifespan, we would have a longer lifespan.. there would be less technologically advances weapons, most likely you would have to look you adversary in the eye when you kill him.. out medical, communication, transportation education, etc. would be far more advanced, we would have a better opportunity to explore the universe we live in.

:leaf:
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Praise Praise Praise!!! I completely agree! Humans love to return animals to the wild, except for themselves. Humans outside of its natural order has shown its sums. Borders, Nations, Fiat Currencies, Religions, all partake in the division and control of "civilized" human beings. Humans are out of the natural order and this divergence has the capacity to extinct humans. In our natural order, that is so far from a reality that its truly laughable.

Humans seem to forget, that much of our history, ....in fact, the majority of human history, to our understanding thus far, has been nomadic, natural, and evolving. Now we are stagnant, lumped together against natures will, and rapidly going backwards or towards a extinct fate. So ya, Go America! Go Christianity. This New world order that we live in, is merely slavery really well painted to look like hope...a better tomorrow...except tomorrow never comes. Its the same regimented days, one after another....until your children take your spot in this never ending cycle of human slavery, or you die and the next man takes your spot.! Being in a civilization is the only means to mass slavery. In humans natural order, death would occur long before a life of blind slavery.

Natural order is by far, the more respectable approach to living a human beings existence. Respect is promoted in this order. Its demanded. Other wise its time to fight, to the death, of one.Which is honorable, respectable. Its promotes letting people be people. Not mindless. It encourages self determination and thought process. People think without leadership and civilized laws there is anarchy and lawlessness. That humans would be out of ORDER. But in FACT, it works the other way around. Most of human history, again, works without man made laws, and within the confines of NATURES LAWS. You against the world. Its clear. Nothing can hide, and sincerely more importantly, enslave us within that reality. It may appear barbaric, but thats the way NATURE works.

Notice any other creatures praying or giving praise? Notice any pro-choice alligators? Notice nothing but humans have tried to convince you. Does one with a subscription to "higher powers" find this extremely odd? Look around, we are the ones that have it wrong. We could be a species that does thrive, but instead we a a society, driven, by its powerful owners.

Sadly Freeing personal Freedom starts with FREEING YOURSELF FROM CIVILIZATION.....and its far to late, to start that. Less than a handful of humans remain on this planet that are not under the microscope. That are not attached to civilizations. These are the last real remaining humans. You, I, and everyone on this website....share one thing in common....we are all royally fucked...together!
 
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dagwood45431

dagwood45431

Well-Known Member
BrewerT said:
Praise Praise Praise!!! I completely agree! Humans love to return animals to the wild, except for themselves. Humans outside of its natural order has shown its sums. Borders, Nations, Fiat Currencies, Religions, all partake in the division and control of "civilized" human beings. Humans are out of the natural order and this divergence has the capacity to extinct humans. In our natural order, that is so far from a reality that its truly laughable.

Humans seem to forget, that much of our history, ....in fact, the majority of human history, to our understanding thus far, has been nomadic, natural, and evolving. Now we are stagnant, lumped together against natures will, and rapidly going backwards or towards a extinct fate. So ya, Go America! Go Christianity. This New world order that we live in, is merely slavery really well painted to look like hope...a better tomorrow...except tomorrow never comes. Its the same regimented days, one after another....until your children take your spot in this never ending cycle of human slavery, or you die and the next man takes your spot.! Being in a civilization is the only means to mass slavery. In humans natural order, death would occur long before a life of blind slavery.

Natural order is by far, the more respectable approach to living a human beings existence. Respect is promoted in this order. Its demanded. Other wise its time to fight, to the death, of one.Which is honorable, respectable. Its promotes letting people be people. Not mindless. It encourages self determination and thought process. People think without leadership and civilized laws there is anarchy and lawlessness. That humans would be out of ORDER. But in FACT, it works the other way around. Most of human history, again, works without man made laws, and within the confines of NATURES LAWS. You against the world. Its clear. Nothing can hide, and sincerely more importantly, enslave us within that reality. It may appear barbaric, but thats the way NATURE works.

Notice any other creatures praying or giving praise? Notice any pro-choice alligators? Notice nothing but humans have tried to convince you. Does one with a subscription to "higher powers" find this extremely odd? Look around, we are the ones that have it wrong. We could be a species that does thrive, but instead we a a society, driven, by its powerful owners.

Sadly Freeing personal Freedom starts with FREEING YOURSELF FROM CIVILIZATION.....and its far to late, to start that. Less than a handful of humans remain on this planet that are not under the microscope. That are not attached to civilizations. These are the last real remaining humans. You, I, and everyone on this website....share one thing in common....we are all royally fucked...together!
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You're in the Jean-Jacques Rousseau camp. Nothing wrong with that.
 
B

BrewerT

Well-Known Member
dagwood45431 said:
You're in the Jean-Jacques Rousseau camp. Nothing wrong with that.
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Thank you kindly! In my opinion, just knowing of Rousseau says some good things about you! :)

He was also a mathematician. One of his notable equations was ; Historical Amnesia = Genocide.

Division + Lunacy+ Nuclear Arms = Where in the fuck is GOD NOW????? If there ever was to be a GOD, no human alive or dead could ever imagine, a more appropriate time for Divine Intervention. But I am sure some believer out there has a very just excuse on his behalf!
 
dagwood45431

dagwood45431

Well-Known Member
BrewerT said:
Thank you kindly! In my opinion, just knowing of Rousseau says some good things about you! :)

He was also a mathematician. One of his notable equations was ; Historical Amnesia = Genocide.

Division + Lunacy+ Nuclear Arms = Where in the fuck is GOD NOW????? If there ever was to be a GOD, no human alive or dead could ever imagine, a more appropriate time for Divine Intervention. But I am sure some believer out there has a very just excuse on his behalf!
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I'll be darned -- the reference hit home. Cool!
 
MarWan

MarWan

Well-Known Member
BrewerT said:
Thank you kindly! In my opinion, just knowing of Rousseau says some good things about you! :)

He was also a mathematician. One of his notable equations was ; Historical Amnesia = Genocide.

Division + Lunacy+ Nuclear Arms = Where in the fuck is GOD NOW????? If there ever was to be a GOD, no human alive or dead could ever imagine, a more appropriate time for Divine Intervention. But I am sure some believer out there has a very just excuse on his behalf!
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God is awaiting me and you and the others who feel injustice all over the planet, to get together and fight for themselves, He made laws that do not change, in order to get from point A to point B, you have to have the desire first to do that, then plan and use whatever means , tools that might help you accomplish your goal.
We've to help ourselves before asking for a Divine intervention.

On the other hand, those evil beings that look like us humans, but lack any human feelings knew very well that the Laws of God* or Nature** don't change and they took it to their advantage.

Over the course of time they studied and understood the human psychology and behavior as individuals and as a society, and knew how to manipulate us and keep us chained to our materialistic needs, and in the same time weaken and destroy our spiritual side.
--------------
*My believe
**Your believe

We cannot say for sure that animals and birds do not pray or praise, Only when we get to understand their language.

Peace
 
MarWan

MarWan

Well-Known Member
dagwood45431 said:
Yeah, that's one of the mysteries yet solved. Wow.
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I would rather be a bird or a decent animal after seeing what Man has done to the planet. I would pray and praise that I was not created to be a human.
that's reason enough for praise.
 
B

BrewerT

Well-Known Member
The changes we see in the manifestations of different "gods" show the lack of omnipotence , which is literal proof that the Laws of God, are still and probably as long as humans occupy earth, will change.
Buddhism
Judaism
Pagan
Islam

Just testaments of PROOF that indeed, "God's" laws do change. Some would like to argue that its mans interpretation...and in reality it is. But that also is just another example of the lack of efficacy. If these laws are not efficient than what can we surmise about this "G-d" ? Why would any God have an interest in confusion or trickery? Transparency in theory is something very very easy for a "God"

MarWan said:
God is awaiting me and you and the others who feel injustice all over the planet, to get together and fight for themselves, He made laws that do not change, in order to get from point A to point B, you have to have the desire first to do that, then plan and use whatever means , tools that might help you accomplish your goal.
We've to help ourselves before asking for a Divine intervention.

On the other hand, those evil beings that look like us humans, but lack any human feelings knew very well that the Laws of God* or Nature** don't change and they took it to their advantage.

Over the course of time they studied and understood the human psychology and behavior as individuals and as a society, and knew how to manipulate us and keep us chained to our materialistic needs, and in the same time weaken and destroy our spiritual side.
--------------
*My believe
**Your believe

We cannot say for sure that animals and birds do not pray or praise, Only when we get to understand their language.

Peace
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With all do respect, most of what you have stated is pure speculation. God awaiting anyone is a opinion at best.

There is a plethora of science and more importantly scholarly research and studies into the languages of other life forms.
Take a moment to research what a Lexigram is. Take a moment to understand how we learned how dolphins, whales, chimps, bonobos, monkeys, etc. all communicate. Plants, yes...PLANTS, even have a route of communication. Plants respond to electrical stimuli in a binary fashion. To me, that's really fascinating. I am sure if they could communicate with us they would want to roam....like a nomad, on its own free intuition and not that of a bird, or wind :) There are hundreds of published books and studies expressing this. Darwin also contributed to the studies of plants and had some really neat conclusions.

Michael Marder put forth a phenomenology. Based loosely on the physiology of plant perception.

The astonishing thing about these studies is.....there has not been a single example of these other forms of life, praying, or giving praise to a "high power". Praise is very common in dolphins and some whales. They praise each other, not some imaginative hocus pocus.

Science can say, with absolute, that indeed thus far, "animals and birds" do not practice prayer to our observations. That is to say that its not impossible that they don't ,but thus far, we have no tangible or documented evidence to motivate a body of scientist to believe that we share this unfortunate practice with other life forms.

Lastly, a Human is a Human is a Human. Whether we like that fact or not does not remove its validity. Some humans behave in a manner that we prefer or like more than other, but at the end of the day.....There is no such thing as an evil human or a good human, or even a godly human for that matter. Science has no interest in pretending, or in the make believe.

A human might be able to make you believe he is pure wickedness.
Science classifies it as what it is, a Homo Sapien.
 
PCXV

PCXV

Well-Known Member
MarWan said:
When we are healthy, have plenty of food , and setting safely in our comfortable homes, we start questioning if God really exists.
I wonder what would the non believers say when things go wrong and get real serious (getting close to death) say during a flight, or while cruising in the middle of the ocean, or during sickness.
at that moment when you realize its the end you will instinctively go into autopilot and cry for God's help and start making promises that you'll soon forget if your life gets spared.
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What the fuck kind of argument is that?!?! Lmao that is a better argument against god, if anything. "Oh now that I'm desperate, deprived, and my mind is losing all sensibilities, my only impossible hope is some all-powerful being that hasn't saved billions of people before me" or something like that. That is called ego.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
What Einstein demonstrated is that energy is equivalent to mass times speed of light squared. What you have stated is the first law of thermodynamics which is accredited to Antoine Lavoisier and Julius Robert Mayer. None of those people claimed to have proved that we never die.

To quote Ben Radford: "After a person dies, the energy in his or her body goes where all organisms' energy goes after death: into the environment. When a human dies, the energy stored in his or her body is released in the form of heat, and transferred into the animals that eat us (i.e., wild animals if we are left unburied, or worms and bacteria if we are interred), and the plants that absorb us. If we are cremated, the energy in our bodies is released in the form of heat and light."

Where our energy goes when we die is not a mystery. While you are free to believe as you wish, pretending that those beliefs are somehow backed up by science is factually wrong and intellectually dishonest. I'm afraid you'll have to fall back on faith.



This is a very old trick popular with religious apologists, but it's also a well known logical fallacy called equivocation. It relies on the fact that words have multiple meanings. If I say "that girl is hot" or "the sun is hot" I am obviously using two very different definitions of the word "hot,", neither of which has anything to do with the other. When people say "I have faith in God" or "I have faith in my friends" they are using the same word, but meaning two wholly different concepts. Faith in our friends comes from evidence. This can be demonstrated by the fact that a friend who treats you badly or repeatedly lets you down is a friend which you'll have no faith in. Faith in God comes from wishful thinking, and it persists despite evidence, not because of it.

It's such a well known fallacy that it isn't hard to find dozens of websites explaining it. (for example: https://adamkemp.newsvine.com/_news/2007/06/30/797564-faith-faith-and-equivocation) The next time you decide to call someone else a moron, you should probably make sure you're not looking in a mirror first.

The fact that you have to rely on name calling, made-up science, and logical mistakes to defend your faith is telling not only of its intellectual frailty but also your confidence in it. If faith is a personal thing, then keep it to yourself, because when you try to prove it has some factual basis or that everyone else shares your faith, you're gonna fail.
Click to expand...

Goddamn! This post should have ended the thread. Glad I stumbled over to S&S&P, nice to see you around, Heis. How's life and the pseudo-science site going?
 
PCXV

PCXV

Well-Known Member
BrewerT said:
Praise Praise Praise!!! I completely agree! Humans love to return animals to the wild, except for themselves. Humans outside of its natural order has shown its sums. Borders, Nations, Fiat Currencies, Religions, all partake in the division and control of "civilized" human beings. Humans are out of the natural order and this divergence has the capacity to extinct humans. In our natural order, that is so far from a reality that its truly laughable.

Humans seem to forget, that much of our history, ....in fact, the majority of human history, to our understanding thus far, has been nomadic, natural, and evolving. Now we are stagnant, lumped together against natures will, and rapidly going backwards or towards a extinct fate. So ya, Go America! Go Christianity. This New world order that we live in, is merely slavery really well painted to look like hope...a better tomorrow...except tomorrow never comes. Its the same regimented days, one after another....until your children take your spot in this never ending cycle of human slavery, or you die and the next man takes your spot.! Being in a civilization is the only means to mass slavery. In humans natural order, death would occur long before a life of blind slavery.

Natural order is by far, the more respectable approach to living a human beings existence. Respect is promoted in this order. Its demanded. Other wise its time to fight, to the death, of one.Which is honorable, respectable. Its promotes letting people be people. Not mindless. It encourages self determination and thought process. People think without leadership and civilized laws there is anarchy and lawlessness. That humans would be out of ORDER. But in FACT, it works the other way around. Most of human history, again, works without man made laws, and within the confines of NATURES LAWS. You against the world. Its clear. Nothing can hide, and sincerely more importantly, enslave us within that reality. It may appear barbaric, but thats the way NATURE works.

Notice any other creatures praying or giving praise? Notice any pro-choice alligators? Notice nothing but humans have tried to convince you. Does one with a subscription to "higher powers" find this extremely odd? Look around, we are the ones that have it wrong. We could be a species that does thrive, but instead we a a society, driven, by its powerful owners.

Sadly Freeing personal Freedom starts with FREEING YOURSELF FROM CIVILIZATION.....and its far to late, to start that. Less than a handful of humans remain on this planet that are not under the microscope. That are not attached to civilizations. These are the last real remaining humans. You, I, and everyone on this website....share one thing in common....we are all royally fucked...together!
Click to expand...
While I agree we have separated ourselves from nature, it has been for the goal of bettering our existence, and in almost every way, it has. What you view as slavery I view as a much better quality of life. Is it imperfect? Sure. Is it rigged? Sure, to some degree. Is it fair? No, but neither is nature. In what ways is it worse than a short life of suffering and loss because of an unreasonable fear of socializing/society?
 
Enigma

Enigma

Well-Known Member
PCXV said:
While I agree we have separated ourselves from nature, it has been for the goal of bettering our existence, and in almost every way, it has. What you view as slavery I view as a much better quality of life. Is it imperfect? Sure. Is it rigged? Sure, to some degree. Is it fair? No, but neither is nature. In what ways is it worse than a short life of suffering and loss because of an unreasonable fear of socializing/society?
Click to expand...

Some people have a problem "bending the knee".
 
B

BrewerT

Well-Known Member
PCXV said:
While I agree we have separated ourselves from nature, it has been for the goal of bettering our existence, and in almost every way, it has. What you view as slavery I view as a much better quality of life. Is it imperfect? Sure. Is it rigged? Sure, to some degree. Is it fair? No, but neither is nature. In what ways is it worse than a short life of suffering and loss because of an unreasonable fear of socializing/society?
Click to expand...

Its hard to imagine let alone believe, humans have gained a better existence out of becoming a civilized society....especially considering the world currently sits on the fence of total nuclear annihilation. Nature is not fair, but its the order of laws that we NEED and SHOULD be adhering to. ....or you end up with a world on the brink :) Just my .02
 
Venus55

Venus55

Well-Known Member
PCXV said:
While I agree we have separated ourselves from nature, it has been for the goal of bettering our existence, and in almost every way, it has. What you view as slavery I view as a much better quality of life. Is it imperfect? Sure. Is it rigged? Sure, to some degree. Is it fair? No, but neither is nature. In what ways is it worse than a short life of suffering and loss because of an unreasonable fear of socializing/society?
Click to expand...
BrewerT said:
Its hard to imagine let alone believe, humans have gained a better existence out of becoming a civilized society....especially considering the world currently sits on the fence of total nuclear annihilation. Nature is not fair, but its the order of laws that we NEED and SHOULD be adhering to. ....or you end up with a world on the brink :) Just my .02
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It's hard cos u both make valid points.. It's about finding the ever so clichéd "happy medium". Where a civil, advanced existence doesn't forfeit the nurture of nature.
 
PCXV

PCXV

Well-Known Member
BrewerT said:
Its hard to imagine let alone believe, humans have gained a better existence out of becoming a civilized society....especially considering the world currently sits on the fence of total nuclear annihilation. Nature is not fair, but its the order of laws that we NEED and SHOULD be adhering to. ....or you end up with a world on the brink :) Just my .02
Click to expand...
Not to argue, but to elaborate my point, by every measure it is better. Longer life, healthier life, less needless death and suffering, modern medicine, modern technology, modern mobility (we can see the world!), space exploration, ocean exploration etc. Pretty amazing imo. We still very much are chained to nature, but we have mitigated the harshness of nature on our being. Of course, people have always been hard on eachother. Nuclear technology is scary, sure, but if it didn't exist would you still hold the same opinion? If we made it through the laws of nature, who's to say we won't make it through the way of man? It is our reasoning ability that separates us from most of nature, and also what can save us from our faults.
 
B

BrewerT

Well-Known Member
PCXV said:
Not to argue, but to elaborate my point, by every measure it is better. Longer life, healthier life, less needless death and suffering, modern medicine, modern technology, modern mobility (we can see the world!), space exploration, ocean exploration etc. Pretty amazing imo. We still very much are chained to nature, but we have mitigated the harshness of nature on our being. Of course, people have always been hard on eachother. Nuclear technology is scary, sure, but if it didn't exist would you still hold the same opinion? If we made it through the laws of nature, who's to say we won't make it through the way of man? It is our reasoning ability that separates us from most of nature, and also what can save us from our faults.
Click to expand...
Thanks for replying pcxv! You do make some good points. So please allow me a moment to elaborate a bit more.

I do also want to argue against your statement "by every measure it is better". I would imagine you would have a difficult time convincing that viewpoint to say holocaust survivors or say pol pots genocide. These events are the literal costs of massing together. The level of absolute power and control are not possible unless, humans lump together. Yes civilization did intervene ...far to late as always!!...But it is all beside the point...it wouldn't have happened...if humans didn't diverge to an illusion that somehow mans way is better....no other life form except humans fell for that fallacy!
That would never happen to nomads. It would never happen to any animals that are living within the means of the order they were intended to live in.

That being said, the sum of civilization has lead us to this point. Whatever advances that have been made has lead humans to this point. Another cost of this massing is division, to the point of extinction....so in terms of reasoning....how does a human reason that this is all worth it???? Let alone "better" than what nature intends? I simply don't agree it is better in any fashion that is prudent to human survival as a collective whole natural species.

If nuclear arms didn't exist my point is still valid. Humans outside the natural order are humans bound for extinction. Sure there will be advancements....all of which are irrelevant...not just because of nuclear arms, but because humans are forever enslaved to living outside of natures intended laws.....Those laws far more protect humans as a whole species than any civilization has yet to date! The greatest empire of humans....The Romans acknowledge this many years ago, humans are addicted and enslaved to civilizations. The Romans showed just one example of how a whole empire of humans, can , and eventually will, self destruct.

It is literally just Natural Science. Do what natures wants, and perhaps needs its occupants to do...be like every other life form, and have a greater chance at a long term species survival. Thriving and Surviving. I will gladly take Surviving as a species, over a long(er) period of time than what civilization has shown it can offer!
 
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Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
tyler.durden said:
Goddamn! This post should have ended the thread. Glad I stumbled over to S&S&P, nice to see you around, Heis. How's life and the pseudo-science site going?
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Hey TD. Nice to see a familiar face!

My life is blissfully boring. Nothing to do all day but watch lectures and listen to podcasts, and I love it! Although I've been letting my podcasts drift ever more into comedy/improv shows and away from science. I even spent 171 hours listening to Nerd Poker, which is comedians playing a long D&D campaign. It was a glorious waste of time.

I'm not as involved in the pseudoscience page these days. Facebook is constantly making changes that make the experience frustrating, and a whole crop of skeptic themed pages exist now, so the message is well represented.

How about you? What strains you liking these days? I'm still doing ak47 x critical mass. It's the bomb but I'm sick of it.

Oh, and just so this post isn't totally off topic, here's a classic.

 
Venus55

Venus55

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
Hey TD. Nice to see a familiar face!

My life is blissfully boring. Nothing to do all day but watch lectures and listen to podcasts, and I love it! Although I've been letting my podcasts drift ever more into comedy/improv shows and away from science. I even spent 171 hours listening to Nerd Poker, which is comedians playing a long D&D campaign. It was a glorious waste of time.

I'm not as involved in the pseudoscience page these days. Facebook is constantly making changes that make the experience frustrating, and a whole crop of skeptic themed pages exist now, so the message is well represented.

How about you? What strains you liking these days? I'm still doing ak47 x critical mass. It's the bomb but I'm sick of it.

Oh, and just so this post isn't totally off topic, here's a classic.

Click to expand...
Oh haha, BOOM! That guy's awesome!! lol
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
Hey TD. Nice to see a familiar face!

My life is blissfully boring. Nothing to do all day but watch lectures and listen to podcasts, and I love it! Although I've been letting my podcasts drift ever more into comedy/improv shows and away from science. I even spent 171 hours listening to Nerd Poker, which is comedians playing a long D&D campaign. It was a glorious waste of time.

I'm not as involved in the pseudoscience page these days. Facebook is constantly making changes that make the experience frustrating, and a whole crop of skeptic themed pages exist now, so the message is well represented.

How about you? What strains you liking these days? I'm still doing ak47 x critical mass. It's the bomb but I'm sick of it.

Oh, and just so this post isn't totally off topic, here's a classic.

Click to expand...
It's great to see you enjoying some recreation. Heis wasting time, who woulda thunk it? Glad to hear the message is going strong out there, I never could get into FB.

All is great by me - the music is going better than ever, both the gigs and my personal evolution as a musician. I started playing classical guitar on top of my violin playing, I fell in love with it and it is eating away at my violin time.

The grow op is doing very well. I finally found a nice indica to round out my stable of beauties, DJ Short's Blueberry (a reco from Stinkbud). I've smoked nothing but BB for the last few months. I'm still growing Trainwreck, OG Kush and Heavy Duty Fruity, but there's nothing like a great indica to unwind at the end of a long day. I'm starting to get into producing solventless dabs, I have pounds of frosty trim on hand and dabs seem more popular and profitable than edibles these days.

I hope to see you around more often. Love that video you posted, I just watched that dude's vids again last week. So entertaining. Is that sexy FB partner of yours still running the site, and still doing her music?


Here's an old fav that is back on YT. Still cracks me up...


 
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