racerboy71
bud bootlegger
and btw, you're not being forced to buy o'care, if you don't want it, don't buy it, pay the not tax tax for not having o'care, problem solved really..
Duck Dynasty Plucked
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racerboy71
bud bootlegger
you're right kynes, the town over from me have a friends school, which of course is quaker based, and they even have quaker services every sunday.. also another friends school in a town a few miles the other way..quakers are still among us, quietly moving unseen through our society, concealing their nature from all who might peer too closely.
thats right they still exist, a shadowy cabal of dangerous madmen pulling the strings, and controlling all who dare reach for the seats of power.
often the only way to reveal the hidden quaker in your midst is to look for the guy who cant stop quivering...
And Kill Him Before He Destroys Us All!
quakers are surely out there..
desert dude
Well-Known Member
Would you settle for one Christian being forced to buy contraceptives for another person?
The argument is not about government forcing birth control on Christians, it's about the government forcing Christians to pay for other peoples birth control.
Antidisestablishmentarian
Well-Known Member
If a woman in the employ if the Catholic Church decides she wants to go on birth control, the Catholic Church has paid for it already. They are contributing to the health insurance the woman is using.
Previous to ACA, they had a plan that didn't have it. Now they have to pay for a plan that goes against their religious beliefs.
I hate religion, I'm agnostic. But I love our constitution.
Previous to ACA, they had a plan that didn't have it. Now they have to pay for a plan that goes against their religious beliefs.
I hate religion, I'm agnostic. But I love our constitution.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
yes, i would like you to show me one instance where a christian is being forced to BUY, not OFFER, contraceptives for another person.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
what church does hobby lobby go to?
desert dude
Well-Known Member
Thank you. I don't know why that point is so hard to grasp.
If you pay taxes, you arguably were already paying for that, to some degree. You don't get to use your religion as a line item objection to the government's budget.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
when was hobby lobby baptized?
desert dude
Well-Known Member
You do get to spend your money on things that comport with your religious beliefs. We are not talking about taxes here.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
hobby lobby is a shitty store with crappy products, not a religious organization.
Yes we are. See the supreme court case upholding the ACA. The government mandate is effectively a tax, according to John Roberts, not just Ginsburg and company.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
I'll have to disagree with you, it's pretty clearly written in the 1st Amendment. When government forces people to do something that is against their religion, the government is prohibiting them from exercising their beliefs.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
every single person at hobby lobby is free to not take birth control pills.
however, since hobby lobby is a store and not a religious organization, it is subject to the same rules that apply to all businesses.
i knew you were a devout bible thumper all along.
DutchKillsRambo
Well-Known Member
How do you view insurance then? Maybe it's me, but I think it's always been a type of tax. My car insurance makes money off me and its mandated. My health insurance makes money off me and its mandated. If it were up to me, I dunno if I would buy both these things. I dunno I guess I just look at it as money that I could have except the government says I have to spend it on these things. Kinda like a tax. I personally don't like my health insurance company paying out for obese, alcoholic, chain-smokers, but they do. And with gusto as thats how they make the most money. Should I be able to opt out because my beliefs say we shouldn't be spending millions of dollars on end of life care for those that never cared for their lives?
Forcing churches to comply with the laws imposed on all other people is not prohibiting the practice of religion. The fact that the Catholic Church officially opposes contraception has nothing to do with the free practice of their religion, because it doesn't inhibit them at all. The fact that they don't like the obligation is not the same as saying they're prohibited from practicing their religion.
The Catholic Church can preach against contraception all it likes. It can do whatever it wants to preach against contraception; it can counsel people against contraception at its pleasure. That does not excuse them from complying with a government mandate that applies to all other people.
LOL Is this Buckyology
Thought you'd just throw out that straw man, did you. Show me in the first amendment where it has to be a religious organization!
It's talking about individual rights, not organizational rights.
FAIL
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
this thread started off with right wing racists shouting that free speech is dead because a bigot can't be bigoted without consequences.
now this thread is puttering along with right wing racists shouting that freedom of religion is dead if you're not allowed to impose your religion on others.
nothing will satisfy right wing racists. they will always find a new way to form a narrative of persecution against them.
those poor right wingers.
now this thread is puttering along with right wing racists shouting that freedom of religion is dead if you're not allowed to impose your religion on others.
nothing will satisfy right wing racists. they will always find a new way to form a narrative of persecution against them.
those poor right wingers.