Everyones a breeder now.

It is quite fun to see what monstrosities emerge when we chuck pollen at every strain we can get our hands on. As was mentioned earlier in the thread, it takes a lot of work to breed a stable strain. Half the battle is finding desired traits. Furthermore, how does the smoke hit you? How does it taste? Etc. It can be a long meticulous process.

As an example, In 2014 I selected only 4 plants to work with, out of thousands! They were Mtf, Sfv og, Jack herrer, and Blackberry. I crossed all 4 of these in every combination, and the only keeper was the Mtf x Sfv OG. Why was it a keeper?

Ive been working on this one strain (mtf x sfv og) for years! I cant even recall the amount of seeds ive gone through. Lol

In my earlier years of growing, I definitely made dozens of f1 hybrids. I think its an important part of learning.

Incidentally, Ive never sold a single seed. Ive only traded and gifted them. Intention is everything. The world doesn't need anymore grifters.

Ps. Enjoy the little slideshow. Back in the day when I was young...
I feel the same way. I got into breeding as a way to be self sufficient and help friends. The problem is to do it right takes forever. When I started dabbling I didn't realize the road I would be going down. It feels crazy popping a couple hundred and ending up with 4 or 5 you want to keep. I've been messing around for a few years now and still feel like I haven't done much. However it is fun to cross some strains and see what happens
 
This has been happening way before the dawn of instagram. Anyone can make their plants fuck; people do it all the time with backyard watermelons when they don’t have bees to do it for them. Nobody complains but weed snobs be like…home breeders are tainting the gene pool with too many polyhybrids …woe be to future generations of cannabis. Hogwash! If you don’t want to buy seeds then don’t but God intended for cannabis plants and every other living thing on Earth for that matter to go forth and multiply. Leave a single boy plant to shoot pollen all over the girls in your bloom tent if you don’t believe me.
As a master breeder in my own mind my crosses are better to me than most of the crap seed I bought over the years but then again im not selling them. My friends that grow don’t even want them; they think unless you spent money on them they can’t be that good. This is what the consumer mentality has wrought: you must spend a lot of money to aquire the worlds best genetics. Not true; there are so many good strains available today it is ridiculous. Too many growers think autos are the best and I disagree; they are the best thing for seed banks because they love repeat customers.
Banks give out freebies every sale because the markup on seed is so high; they cost almost nothing to produce. Even selling them for a dollar each is like highway robbery but that’s ok; this is capitalism. Pay that dude on insta for his home made gear so he can continue living his dream of playing PS5 in mom’s basement all night & making videos instead of going to work. Don’t feel guilty for tainting the cannabis gene pool; now that breeder guy can order up a double whopper on doordash. You fed him for a day and contributed to the local economy instead of ordering seed from a faceless communist in another state. Or even better just buy a pack or regular seeds and cross them yourself. 2 cent rant ends here peace
I’m a new grower but have been thinking this all along.

I’ve done some searching here and was unable to substantiate my intuition until I stumbled upon your old post.

Seed costs are ridiculous (as compared with tomato seeds…which is what I compare them to).

Slow/long flowering “craft” cannabis seems to be where I’d like to focus my attention and leave the fast buds for the corporate growers who want to make a quick buck without regard for quality.

Truth be told I’m such a newbie that any old crap gets me higher than I want to be…. I’m just thinking breeding strictly for THC is throwing the baby out with the bath water as science doesn’t understand at this point how all the various (and yet unidentified) compounds in the plant interact and provide medicine….and if they are inadvertently bred out and landrace genetics “lost” they will be impossible to replicate/breed back in.

As I understand it, some of the greatest cultivars were grown from bag seed and I love the idea of growing anything and everything you can and find for yourself what works best for you.

Again, I’m a newbie and don’t know shit as compared to almost anyone on here but it just seems logical to me.

Peace
 
I’m a new grower but have been thinking this all along.

I’ve done some searching here and was unable to substantiate my intuition until I stumbled upon your old post.

Seed costs are ridiculous (as compared with tomato seeds…which is what I compare them to).

Slow/long flowering “craft” cannabis seems to be where I’d like to focus my attention and leave the fast buds for the corporate growers who want to make a quick buck without regard for quality.

Truth be told I’m such a newbie that any old crap gets me higher than I want to be…. I’m just thinking breeding strictly for THC is throwing the baby out with the bath water as science doesn’t understand at this point how all the various (and yet unidentified) compounds in the plant interact and provide medicine….and if they are inadvertently bred out and landrace genetics “lost” they will be impossible to replicate/breed back in.

As I understand it, some of the greatest cultivars were grown from bag seed and I love the idea of growing anything and everything you can and find for yourself what works best for you.

Again, I’m a newbie and don’t know shit as compared to almost anyone on here but it just seems logical to me.

Peace
Same here, I don’t know shit about any of this. This is the first year I grew from a seed and not a clone <<lmao>> so for me to even think about purposely making seeds is kinda like a pipe dream without the dream part. I will say the seed start seems more vibrant than a clone start but may just be I am getting a little better?
 
Theres a lot to learn in breeding but its really simple. Kinda like when learning to grow it seems like a lot but you get better. After so much time youre nailing it and, you still sont know everything about what youre doing? Breeding is just using tools to create something. Its all about objective and if you achieved it or not while you were active.

As soon as you know what you want to do because it doesnt exist yet, you just focus on the few tools and steps. To create your goal. The real challenge is finding the obvious traits you want, but also the invisible ones that make it just as valueable. True female, doesnt lose its traits being cloned before the usual 10 generation mark, consistant traits expressed under various conditions.

Traits are everything, when you start to identify them you realize you can stabilize them. Growing the same clone 7 times inadvertantly showed me all the traits Im looking for to breed with. Its boring subtle things you notice but they come together fast later, like holy shit, thats some real insight type thing.

Im becoming a breeder because believe it or not, lets put this to the test, find me a strain that was inbred for hash. To a f4-f5 level or IBL status. Or even bx3 for christ sake. Not the same 5 I already know of. Compare that to a f1 poly hybrid, there are countless. There is TONS of room to grow and this is just an example to my situation. You can find your place in it all just like I did.

Just follow my project and youll probably find your inspiration for your own project. If people were just freakin willing to share info and be kind Id be on this years ago. Thats the thing, true breeding your project might not make it if youre really doing jt properly. Its a slow gradual process with many discarded plants while mating the best ones. Keeping mothers alive until the strain is made, lots can go wrong.

Not too much to make a new person daunted from trying, look at it as inspiration. Those key few steps are what create quality, not cutting corners. You dont need thousands of plants to be a breeder except with polyhybrids which even those you could breed with but luck becomes the main strategy. You can just continue a project that was somewhat inbred already. Like a S1, S2, or bx1 and bx2, F2 or F3, etc.

Those cut down the pheno numbers to where a small legal home grower of 6-12 plants can accomplish pretty easily. You can create something pure for its strong bred traits like for ex for my project, 30% flower rosin yield. Now my work can be used to create outdoor varieties, flavors, list goes on. Nobody did it yet to a IBL status and for a specific hash method.

The hash breeding game is a mess and not even established yet, not even for each hash method nor the ones that been around for decades. Rosin is a specific kind of hash that a large pile of bubble or drysift etc, wont just provide. Its a special process that involves chemical changes into a new compound. It can basically be vaporized before turning into hash you can hold in your hand.

For example I learned long ago machine trimming took half of my flower rosin yield. This means ounces of rosin gone and it wasnt scattered in the machine trimmer. It somehow vanished into thin air. So to say you have a f5 good for concentrates, that doesnt tell me if its for BHO or bubble, is there any viable hash in it? How much are we talking? 20-25%? You tend to want maximum yield so 30% would be nice.

Even if it was like that already which it should be, you should be able to give numbers. Even if it was, seeds sell out. Someone has to keep putting the work in. I cant wait another 10 years for this market to expand to where I dont have to breed. I could be the one that makes it happen which is cool, Ive always wanted purpose in life. Even if I dont make it, Im laying the ground work for it.

When first starting and finding my first pheno, I told my self Id look into what it would take to continue that breed since it was limited edition. Well I sure learned how to do that alright. Self sufficiency, theres low chance someone is gonna breed it the way i intend to grow it. Im doing it for myself but I learned if you do it right, you should share it because it will likely do great in the market.

They will need to grow it like me tho and would need to somehow get that info to them. Via forum or description in seed bank. Im in dtw coco but its the easiest hydro method IMO and looking for phenos that have low light saturation points so any average LED will do. Make sure they know to hand trim and be gentle with it till its being pressed, dried 60/60 and press at certain temp, that should be it.

The rest would be more on how it grows, that I grow full size plants 2.5x2.5 or 3x3 topped only once at 6th node. Lollipop and defol a bit in otherwords traditional style growing. Thats it.
 
The Shakers and others were doing this in the 1800s with beans and tomatoes, then another boom in the eary 1900s with berries and fruits, then came the great pumpkin race, followed by sunflower fever.
I'm sure broccoli and potatos had their moment. Now it's pot and hot peppers.
Just the crop varies, not the circus.
 
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I plan on doing a bit of pollen chucking when I get going again . I've been collecting some seeds with that in mind . For all my life my hobbies have been growing weed , fishing , hunting , and breeding tropical fish .

An ice storm in 2011 wiped out my fish due to an extended power outage . I had about 20 years into it and made somewhat of a name for myself in the Angelfish world . Lost all my breeding stock and said fuck it .

From 1980 to about 2013-14 I grew weed , outdoor mostly with about 8-9 years of indoor mixed in . Life changes took precedence and I stopped growing but always missed it .

At 64 now my skeleton isn't what it used to be due to injuries in my youth coming back on me . I've had to scale down the fishing and haven't hunted in 4 years . I can't enjoy it when I can't move for 2 days after a hunt .

In the near future I'll be setting up a couple tents . Aside from many years of maintaining our outdoor strain through open pollination I never put much thought into breeding . It was either growing the same seed year after year outdoors or the latest and greatest clones of the time .

I've been collecting some landraces and doing my best to find some of the old legends being preserved by those few breeders who don't care about being Instagram stars . I don't do social media past a few forums and don't plan to .

So far I've picked up a few of what I consider gems of yore . Some TGA Subcool preservations , Karma , SSDD , Afgooey , Champagne Hashplant and SSH . I'm looking forward to doing a little careful chucking and spreading some seeds around to those who might be interested .

When I was breeding fish I kept careful track of lineage and could show pics of multiple generations to those interested in my lines . I plan on doing the same with my weed .

It'll be for fun without the goal of profit just like it was with my fish . If I can pass along something special it will be even more satisfying . Hopefully within another year or so I'll have something on the "different" side for myself and others to play with .
 
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I plan on doing a bit of pollen chucking when I get going again . I've been collecting some seeds with that in mind . For all my life my hobbies have been growing weed , fishing , hunting , and breeding tropical fish .

An ice storm in 2011 wiped out my fish due to an extended power outage . I had about 20 years into it and made somewhat of a name for myself in the Angelfish world . Lost all my breeding stock and said fuck it .

From 1980 to about 2013-14 I grew weed , outdoor mostly with about 8-9 years of indoor mixed in . Life changes took precedence and I stopped growing but always missed it .

At 64 now my skeleton isn't what it used to be due to injuries in my youth coming back on me . I've had to scale down the fishing and haven't hunted in 4 years . I can't enjoy it when I can't move for 2 days after a hunt .

In the near future I'll be setting up a couple tents . Aside from many years of maintaining our outdoor strain through open pollination I never put much thought into breeding . It was either growing the same seed year after year outdoors or the latest and greatest clones of the time .

I've been collecting some landraces and doing my best to find some of the old legends being preserved by those few breeders who don't care about being Instagram stars . I don't do social media past a few forums and don't plan to .

So far I've picked up a few of what I consider gems of yore . Some TGA Subcool preservations , Karma , SSDD , Afgooey , Champagne Hashplant and SSH . I'm looking forward to doing a little careful chucking and spreading some seeds around to those who might be interested .

When I was breeding fish I kept careful track of lineage and could show pics of multiple generations to those interested in my lines . I plan on doing the same with my weed .

It'll be for fun without the goal of profit just like it was with my fish . If I can pass along something special it will be even more satisfying . Hopefully within another year or so I'll have something on the "different" side for myself and others to play with .
Looking forward to your project! Hope you keep us up to date here!
 
The Shakers and others were doing this in the 1800s with beans and tomatoes, then another boom in the eary 1900s with berries and fruits, then came the great pumpkin race, followed by sunflower fever.
I'm sure broccoli and potatos had their moment. Now it's pot and hot peppers.
Just the crop varies, not the circus.
I guess what I’m sort of trying to say is that while we think that we know what we’re doing when we are breeding, we don’t know the full implications.

I was reading an article in high times online:

“Weed’s Next Big Secret: Scientists Just Discovered a New Family of Molecules Hiding in Cannabis Leaves”​

78 compounds…25 never reported previously in cannabis.

So… Let’s say you are farm Bill 2018 breeding for CBD. You don’t know what you’re breeding out of the genetics aside from the THC. Conversely, when you breed exclusively for THC, aren’t you breeding out the CBD and also all kinds of compounds that you don’t even know that you are inadvertently breeding out? So this goes on and on and eventually you end up with pretty much two distinct plants. CBD cannabis and THC cannabis, and all the compounds in between may or may not be present and may not be able to be bred back into the plant. You don’t really know what you’ve lost in the process and you may very well not be able to get it back.

Again, I don’t know shit about this.

Maybe like the shakers mentioned above, maybe the original tomato plant was some crappy kind of gooseberry sized fruit that has now been bred into many different varieties of wonderful tomatoes, but maybe some kind of magical medicinal properties of the tomato have been lost forever…

4 AM rambling…..
Just food for thought
 
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